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Woodie

Woodie

Jedi Warrior
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it a 1970 with twin su's. I know little about them. It turns over and over and over. Took off the float covers and the floats seem ok. Turned in and out the idle screws. It finally started once, and ran for about 2 minutes really rough and slow. when I pulled on the throttle cable it stalled. Could not get it to start again. I killed the battery trying. Ok so I pulle the carb cover off. Checked the needle , seems ok. Then screwed in the mixture nuts all the way, and then back out 2 full turns. Sprayed and cleaned everything with carb cleaner. Reassembled. Now I wait till tomorrow for acharged battery. Any idea why the difficult time to start, and then very slow and rough idle. (Its new gas too) /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif
 
Could be a lot of things. What was the history of the car before this incident? Any recent adjustments or repairs? I'm not an SU expert but since you've adjusted on them, I would put them at a default setting. Make sure the ignition circuit is strong and static timing is correct. Retarded timing can make an engine idle extremely slow no matter what you do with the carbs (to an extent) You can use a vacuum gage to judge the timing as well. I know this is a bunch of different things to think about but these are the basics needed to make an engine run.
JC
 
Woodie,

90% of all carburettor problems are electrical. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif

Check the points (condition and gap)and timing. It wouldn't hurt to pull the plugs and check the gap on them as well. I assume you're getting spark if it fired up once.

Sounds like you have the mixture set on the carbs at a reasonable starting point. Do the carburettor pistons move up and down freely? With the dashpot caps removed, lift the piston up and let it drop. It should fall freely with a metallic "clunk".

Check for potential vacuum leaks. I'm not super familiar with that model year setup, but are there any openings on the intake manifold (where hoses should be connected)?
 
And just how long has this car been setting up?

If you throw a bit of fuel in the carbs does it start?

A bit in the cylinders, just a bit, does it start?

How about moveing fuel line to the Docs one gal can with 4 feet of hose, does it start?

If all this fails, electrial, and that's a different game.

What makes you think it is fuel of course it must be fuel or electrial. Easy to test the fuel part, see above.
 
Yes the pistons move up and down freely. I think all vacuum lines are good. Unfortunaltely I set th ecarb mixture aftre I kleed the battery. Wont know if thaht helps till tomorrow. I put in new wires new plugs and a new rotor. How can I check timing if it is not running.?
 
Oh boy Woodie, that's possible of course, but I am not sure I am smart enough to write it up. Check the search function on this site or the Knowledge base, its been discussed before for sure. However if you did not move the distributor, lossen and move it, it should be close.
 
[ QUOTE ]
How can I check timing if it is not running.?

[/ QUOTE ]

The timing can be set statically. Do you have any kind of a repair manual (like Haynes)? If not, let me know and I'll scan and email the appropriate pages for setting the timing statically.

You might want to check the valves as well and make sure they're properly adjusted.
 
The easiest way to check the static timing (this is very generic and not exactly the best way) is to take the dizzy cap off and use a multimeter to determine exactly when the points open. There will be a voltage differential across them when they start to open. You will obviously have to rotate the engine to do this. If you want, you can leave the key off and just check to see when the resistance across the points increases sharply. Check the timing marks on the front pulley. You can roughly estimate the static timing this way based on crankshaft position and ignition points operation.
Like I said, this isn't the perfect way to do it but it will give you a rough estimate. This ignores the slop in the timing chain and any irregularities in the dizzy shaft.
JC
 
I found an article here
https://www.wideopenwest.com/~kottage/tech/tuning.html
It describes static timing and adjusting carbs. I think tomorrow I will start with assuming the timing is ok. After all it di start today. The car was last driven in sept 04, then had the engine pulled and a new clutch put in. It was not driven after that. If I cannot get anything started I will do the static timing. I'll be back to morrow to let you know how I did. Im still surfing so if anybody has any ideas please add them ..and thanks
 
It sounds like you're on the right track, but I *would* check the timing, points and valves if I were you prior to messing with the carbs any more. It's amazing how far out of time these cars can be and still start.
 
I do not have a new valve cover gasket. Can just alot of red RTV gasket goo be used or do I need a new gasket when I do the static timing.?
 
What kind of a valve cover gasket do you have on there now? Is it just the standard cork-type gasket? Heck, I've probably had my valve cover off a half-dozen time with the same gasket, and I don't have any problems with it leaking.

I wouldn't use any kind of gasket goo on it. Worst case, it may leak a little. If it does just get a new one. Much better to have a small oil leak on the valve cover than poorly adjusted valves IMHO.
 
ok you got me convinced. Timing, then try starting, then adjust carbs. Would removal of then engine to install a new clutch throw timing or carb settings off?
 
Might effect timeing if they removed distributor but would effect carbs for sure a bit.

However, I would bet that the car ran after clutch was installed, and you have fuel problems.

See above first.
 
You can get close without pulling the valve cover bud. Assuming the timing chain is in good shape, the position of the crankshaft can be used. Pull the number one plug and rotate the engine by the front nut. Use a chopstick or something else thin and soft to determine piston position. A screwdrive can be used in a pinch just be ginger with it so you don't damage the top of the piston. When air is rushing out of the spark plug hole, you are on the compression stroke. Once the piston gets to the uppermost position, you are at top dead center. Mark the front pulley in relation to a reference point so you know where this is. Everyother rotation will be the compression stroke. Then you can determine what the static timing is. I think Doug Lawson has a good article on how to do this. I would not pull the valve cover if it isn't leaking. You should only pull it if you feel that the timing chain has slipped or something has happened to cause the position of the crank in relation to the cam to change. Since it ran before it was pulled to change the clutch, I wouldn't suspect that the cam timing is off. Just my two cents though. But to answer your question, yest RTV can be used to extend the life of a valve cover gasket if it isn't torn when you remove it.
JC
 
Printed his directions,, but dont see the PDF on ignition circuit. I assume you mean something about electrical stuff???
 
[ QUOTE ]
ok you got me convinced. Timing, then try starting, then adjust carbs. Would removal of then engine to install a new clutch throw timing or carb settings off?

[/ QUOTE ]

Woodie,

You're getting some conflicting advice here... <grin>. I've pulled the engine from my TR4 and my Sprite in the last couple of years. In both cases, the engines were completely rebuilt. I would never attempt to pull an engine with the distributor in place (too great of risk that it could hang on something or get banged against something and damaged), so I would assume that the distributor was removed and replaced, and the timing is probably off.

In both cases, I made it a point not to disturb the carburettor settings after they were removed. The new engines started up quickly and ran great on both cars... after getting timing and valve adjustment issues resolved.

Also... I wouldn't hesitate to pull the valve cover. One of the first things I would do with a "new to me" old British car is adjust the valves (then timing, and then finally carbs). Valves on these cars need to be adjusted at regular intervals.
 
ok Lets have a vote /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif Pull the cover and adjust the valves or not.

Actually I know the distributor is the same one as was on the car in 04, Am I right, I thought a distributor could only go in 1 way. so if it was removed when the engine was out for a new clutch it could have only gone back in the same way...Correct?
 
That's it, that's the one, should be in the knowledge base for sure.
 
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