Healey Will Not Start (a.k.a. "Failure to proceed") Part 137

[Donovan2001]

Hello to ALL,

I recently started working on my 65 Austin Healey 3000 MKIII and I can't get it to turn over.

-- REPLACED BATTERY AND CONNECTORS
-- WHEN KEY IS IN ON POSITION LIGHT INDICATOR TURNS ON FOR SPEEDOMETER
-- WINDSHIELD WASHER MOTOR WORKS
-- JUST REPLACED STARTER SOLENOID

I'm able to by pass the starter solenoid in order to get the engine to turn over, but I'm unable to do so when I turn the key.

Advice? checklist?

Please help

Thank you

 

[GregW]

I'd check the connections at the back of the ignition switch (yeah, I know it's a pain) Main ones to be concerned with are the red/white wire and the brown wire. Be aware that the brown wire is always hot and unfused, so disconnect the battery before rooting around too much. If those wires have good contact, you should put an ohm meter on the switch. The brown wire connector is power feed to the switch. The red/white wire is the trigger wire to the starter solenoid.

 

[andrea]

Hi Donovan
This are the wiring route on the rear dash of my 100/6 BN4
https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/MerBBcHWfIFmvX9sEpKJZQ?feat=directlink basically can be the same on BJ8 III
I recently re-wired my car. and have one NEW Ignition Key switch, probably made in China or India, all the four connection resulting loses, this is probably due to the wrong thickens of the attaches on the NEW key switch -
https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/O_aLf9-FEzy-tvdCr_L9hQ?feat=directlink
all the electrical test have a good result, but the contacts are so lose that I have the fear that can be disconnected when the car are on regular ON THE ROAD AGAIN- any suggestion?? I think to soldering directly the wires
Andrea

 

[rjc157]

so if you turn the key on and push the selenoid button does it turn over

 

[Donovan2001]

I can put the key in the on position and by pass the solenoid to get the car to turn over, but i can't do it when turning the key fully

 

[Donovan2001]

Greg W,

When testing the starter switch with a volt meter, DO I test each wire individually? How do I test I have never done this before?

Thank you

 

[TimK]

The testing Greg suggested is a resistance test using an ohm meter. An open connection has infinite ohms (the needle doesn't move) A good connection has no resistance (zero ohms) and pins the needle at zero. So with the battery disconnected, you are checking for continuity (zero ohms) at each connection from the key to the starter with the key in the on position. Does the BJ8 have a starter button like our older Healeys? If so, the button has to be depressed to get a continuous connection to the starter. If not the key has to be turned to the starter position for this test. The two test leads are placed on each side of the connection (the black or red leads can be used in any order, they are not positive or negative in the ohm testing.)

 

[GregW]

Greg W,

When testing the starter switch with a volt meter, DO I test each wire individually? How do I test I have never done this before?

Thank you

Since getting to the back of the ignition switch is such a pain, here is another test you can do. Pull the white/red wire (I called it red/white incorrectly in my last post) off the starter solenoid. Attach a volt meter on that wire and to ground. If your car is still positive ground, use the black lead on the volt meter for the white/red wire. Turn the key to start (with battery connected) and see if you get 12 volts. If you get voltage with the key on, you probably need a new solenoid. Try cleaning the contacts first though. If you don't get voltage, the white/red wire may have a bad connection at the ignition switch or a bad switch itself.

 

[Donovan2001]

I have tested the the brown and white/red wires going into the ignition switch and voltmeter gives me solid readings. However, when I test the red/white wire going into the solenoid I pick up NO ready. I know the solenoid is good but still unsure if the switch is bad. Now, when I turn the key I do get a light on the tachometer, so I still think the switch is good.

Should I go to the fuse box next?

Having some troubles ready the Haynes book

Thanks

 

[Donovan2001]

I went ahead and ordered a new key switch. I think you are right . They is not voltage going from the switch to the solenoid.

Thanks

 

[GregW]

I have tested the the brown and white/red wires going into the ignition switch and voltmeter gives me solid readings.

I'm not sure what you mean by solid readings? With a voltmeter you should get the following with one lead of the voltmeter attached to the chassis (red for + ground, black for - ground)
Key off
12v on brown only
Key on
12v on brown and white wires
Key to start
12v on brown, white and white/red

However, when I test the red/white wire going into the solenoid I pick up NO ready.

Where are you testing a red/white wire? There are red/white wires right next to the ignition switch, but they are for the panel lights. They have nothing to do with the starter circuit. I hope I didn't confuse you with my first post, I'll try to change that for future readers.

I know the solenoid is good but still unsure if the switch is bad. Now, when I turn the key I do get a light on the tachometer, so I still think the switch is good.

Until the above tests are done (and a couple more depending on the results :wink: ) , it could be a bad wire connection, a (partially) bad ignition switch or a (partially) bad starter solenoid.

Should I go to the fuse box next?

no

Having some troubles ready the Haynes book

No surprise there, you might want to pick up the shop manual. I made a wiring diagram for the late BJ8s. It used to be here on BCF but that section of the forum is no more, haven't figured out how to get a PDF into the wiki. Anyway, I can email you the diagram if you PM me your address, or you can download an older copy from HERE

 

[MikeP]

Always possible that the white/red wire could be bad too, broken at one of the female connections or even internally. I've had other wires in original harnesses in other cars do that on occasion.

 

[Keoke]

I still think the switch is good.



IF you do just jumper 12Volts from the unfused side of the horn circuit to the small terminal on the solenoid if car turns over switch or wiring is bad.--Fwiw--Keoke

 

[Donovan2001]

I did the following.....

With a voltmeter you should get the following with one lead of the voltmeter attached to the chassis (red for + ground, black for - ground)
Key off
12v on brown only --> *with the setting on 20V I got 3.02V
Key on
12v on brown and white wires --> *around 2.00
Key to start
12v on brown, white and white/red --> *didn't have enough hands only did white wires. I got .41



----------------------
I also tried the following

"Pull the white/red wire (I called it red/white incorrectly in my last post) off the starter solenoid. Attach a volt meter on that wire and to ground. If your car is still positive ground, use the black lead on the volt meter for the white/red wire. Turn the key to start (with battery connected) and see if you get 12 volts. If you get voltage with the key on, you probably need a new solenoid. Try cleaning the contacts first though. If you don't get voltage, the white/red wire may have a bad connection at the ignition switch or a bad switch itself."

*I got .01 on the 20V setting on the voltmeter.

I think the wiring is bad :frown: What do you think? Also, if its bad where should I get the wiring harness? Victoria British or Moss Motors. What should I get with the harness?

Thanks

 

[Keoke]

think the wiring is bad What do you think?




YEP !!!! or the switch------------------------Keoke-- :laugh:

 

[IanIrving]

It looks to me that from your description above that the 12v on main brown wire into switch is missing but if so, why do you get ignition light. Can't be! Is your meter ok, not switched to AC accidentally? measure straight across battery and see if you get 12 volts. If that's ok and you still don't have 12 volts on main brown wire then you've a problem with that wire which according to the diagram I have in fronmt of me comes from B connection on regulator which is straight off Battery negative if your car is still positive earth.

Ian

 

[GregW]

I agree with Ian, and I suspect you didn't have a good connection to ground since all the readings were low. Your wiper motor wouldn't have worked on 3 volts and the wiper gets its power from the brown wire on the ignition switch. If you can, use the black wire from the wiper motor switch for ground, just make sure the contact is clean.

I did the following.....

With a voltmeter you should get the following with one lead of the voltmeter attached to the chassis (red for + ground, black for - ground)
Key off
12v on brown only --> *with the setting on 20V I got 3.02V
Key on
12v on brown and white wires --> *around 2.00
Key to start
12v on brown, white and white/red --> <span style="font-weight: bold">*didn't have enough hands only did white wires.</span> I got .41

I'm not sure what you were doing, but the game of twister came to mind. :smirk:


----------------------

I also tried the following

"Pull the white/red wire .../... If you don't get voltage, the white/red wire may have a bad connection at the ignition switch or a bad switch itself."

*I got .01 on the 20V setting on the voltmeter.

That initially sounds like a bad wire, but I'd suggest checking it again when you know you have a good ground since all of your readings are low. Try this, check for voltage on the battery side of the starter solenoid, that will be the most reliable source. Once you see 12v there, check the other connections.

I think the wiring is bad :frown: What do you think? Also, if its bad where should I get the wiring harness? Victoria British or Moss Motors. What should I get with the harness?

I would hold off on a harness for now. If the only bad wire is the white/red, I'd just add a new wire. Unless you find other problems in the system.

 

[Donovan2001]

This is what I did tonight.....

Tested battery off of connections ~10.25V
Tested brown cable to solenoid ~9.2V
Tested brown cable to starter switch ~8.75V

Installed New ignition switch, used the above picture and diagram to install wires. I'm getting NO light on the tachometer.

Zero reading on white/red

Also, it looks like wire from bat kill switch to coil is fried I have NO continuity.

What next? :frown:

 

[Keoke]

The voltage readings suggest the battery is discharged or defective.---Keoke

 

[TimK]

Connect battery directly to a good chassis ground bolt (if your car is still positive ground, connect positive cable to chassis, otherwise negative). Bypass kill switch. But if battery voltage is only 10.25 at the terminals, it is no good, or badly run down. Trickle charge for 36 hours and check again. Should be 12.7-12.8 volts if fully charged.