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General Motors news
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Brosky
Great Pumpkin
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Tom,
Several interesting points in there.
1. GM Boards "always" unanimously support their CEO. Problem #1.
2. The stock has fallen constantly since 2000. The market knows better than the board. Problem #2.
3. GM has failed to renegotiate with their bond holders and UAW, but Ford somehow has and hasn't taken any money. Problem #3.
4. In spite of this, they still feel they have the "right guys". Problem #4.
5. The Board is still the same after all of this happening since 2000. Problem #5.
6. Every VP directly under the CEO is still there. Problem #6
Toyota is smarter than GM and would only want Cadillac and Chevrolet anyhow, so they can wait until they fall and buy them out without the baggage going on today.
Am I anti-American or anti-union? Absolutely not, no more than I am anti-local government. But someone needs to get their head out of the sand and realize it is time for radical change before all is lost. The 50's and 60's are gone, but GM (and government) seems to have missed that fact. The steel mills found it out in the late 70's and early 80's when they all closed for basically the same reasons as mentioned above. GM had a fatter bankroll and the billions that they made and had are now all gone, but they still are thinking like it's 1957 and Autorama is just around the corner.
Several interesting points in there.
1. GM Boards "always" unanimously support their CEO. Problem #1.
2. The stock has fallen constantly since 2000. The market knows better than the board. Problem #2.
3. GM has failed to renegotiate with their bond holders and UAW, but Ford somehow has and hasn't taken any money. Problem #3.
4. In spite of this, they still feel they have the "right guys". Problem #4.
5. The Board is still the same after all of this happening since 2000. Problem #5.
6. Every VP directly under the CEO is still there. Problem #6
Toyota is smarter than GM and would only want Cadillac and Chevrolet anyhow, so they can wait until they fall and buy them out without the baggage going on today.
Am I anti-American or anti-union? Absolutely not, no more than I am anti-local government. But someone needs to get their head out of the sand and realize it is time for radical change before all is lost. The 50's and 60's are gone, but GM (and government) seems to have missed that fact. The steel mills found it out in the late 70's and early 80's when they all closed for basically the same reasons as mentioned above. GM had a fatter bankroll and the billions that they made and had are now all gone, but they still are thinking like it's 1957 and Autorama is just around the corner.
bgbassplyr
Darth Vader
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Paul,
Here is a blog that I have been reading for some time now. https://www.autoextremist.com/
this is a guy who was on the inside for a long time. Knows all the players. Reading your post, I could swear you have been reading it too. If not, DO.
Jim
Here is a blog that I have been reading for some time now. https://www.autoextremist.com/
this is a guy who was on the inside for a long time. Knows all the players. Reading your post, I could swear you have been reading it too. If not, DO.
Jim
Brosky
Great Pumpkin
Offline
Don,
I grew up in coal and steel town that was decimated in the 70's for a lot of the "business as usual" thought processes. Bethlehem Steel employed 35,000 men and women in steel and another 18,000 in the mines. US Steel had a plant in the same town with 15,000 workers. That doesn't even count the cottage industries that supported the mills and mines. At that time I was working trying to get leaned out GM and AMC cars to run up the steep hills of that area. But the Toyota's and even the Renault's and Peugeot's ran fine.
I saw first hand what complacency in engineering and design did to America's auto industry. I also saw the affects of men who went into the mills and slept through second and third shifts but still got 13 weeks vacation after 20 years and full health benefits.
By 1978, US Steel was closed and when I left in 1982, Bethlehem was down to 10,000 men. There might be 2,000 left in the whole company today. These were from plants that built the steel for nearly every major highway in this country along with the rail cars and wheels that got them there. They ran millions and millions of miles of wire for suspension bridges and construction in the rod and wire mills. And these were the same mills that built the steel for the tanks and planes, as well as the shells for the Navy big guns that won WWII for the free world.
So do I really think that any snotty nosed White House advising economist has a clue about what is really going on in this country today, or has happened over the last 50 years? I have about as much faith in them as in the people who think that they still have the "right guys" on the job at GM.
Bethlehem Steel, US Steel, Jones and Laughlin. Do you ever hear those names on the business news any more?
You do but you wouldn't be able to understand what they are called today unless you can read or translate the Chinese language. And yes, that means they are not on our shores. So remember that the next time that you ever need a tank or a jet plane or armaments build to defend our way of life.
I grew up in coal and steel town that was decimated in the 70's for a lot of the "business as usual" thought processes. Bethlehem Steel employed 35,000 men and women in steel and another 18,000 in the mines. US Steel had a plant in the same town with 15,000 workers. That doesn't even count the cottage industries that supported the mills and mines. At that time I was working trying to get leaned out GM and AMC cars to run up the steep hills of that area. But the Toyota's and even the Renault's and Peugeot's ran fine.
I saw first hand what complacency in engineering and design did to America's auto industry. I also saw the affects of men who went into the mills and slept through second and third shifts but still got 13 weeks vacation after 20 years and full health benefits.
By 1978, US Steel was closed and when I left in 1982, Bethlehem was down to 10,000 men. There might be 2,000 left in the whole company today. These were from plants that built the steel for nearly every major highway in this country along with the rail cars and wheels that got them there. They ran millions and millions of miles of wire for suspension bridges and construction in the rod and wire mills. And these were the same mills that built the steel for the tanks and planes, as well as the shells for the Navy big guns that won WWII for the free world.
So do I really think that any snotty nosed White House advising economist has a clue about what is really going on in this country today, or has happened over the last 50 years? I have about as much faith in them as in the people who think that they still have the "right guys" on the job at GM.
Bethlehem Steel, US Steel, Jones and Laughlin. Do you ever hear those names on the business news any more?
You do but you wouldn't be able to understand what they are called today unless you can read or translate the Chinese language. And yes, that means they are not on our shores. So remember that the next time that you ever need a tank or a jet plane or armaments build to defend our way of life.
Offline
I went to Lehigh University next to the main Bethlehem Steel plant. That brownfield will be opening this spring as a Sands Casino. I wonder what locally made products will be helping the economy now?
sideache
Jedi Knight
Offline
Problems I don't see in the 6 listed
The big three have become pension management companies instead of car manufacturing companies. Problem 7
Executives are now finance managers not car guys because of problem 7, that's problem 8
Wagner didn't really resign, forced out by POTUS -now we have problem 9 because of problem 3.
The big three have become pension management companies instead of car manufacturing companies. Problem 7
Executives are now finance managers not car guys because of problem 7, that's problem 8
Wagner didn't really resign, forced out by POTUS -now we have problem 9 because of problem 3.
aeronca65t
Great Pumpkin
Offline
I think the last really good car guy running a US company was Bob Stemple. A mechanical engineer (and from NJ), he was way ahead on electric cars, high efficiency powertrains, small cars, etc.
The finance guys pushed by the short-term investor crowd threw him out because he wanted long-range improvements that wouldn't create a profit <span style="text-decoration: underline">right now </span>. The guys that watch the stock ticker <span style="text-decoration: underline"> every day </span>had no interest in guys like Stemple.
I wouldn't exactly say that the US car companies are really pension holders at this point. GM negotiatied with the UAW and the union has owned those for the last few years. There was a lot of concessions on that type of stuff about 4 or 5 years ago.
I would say that the American auto companies are health care providers that sell cars to fund their operation (I think I heard Wagoner say that).
One of the reasons that some foreign auto companies build cars in the US is to take the health care costs off the backs of their own taxpayers and onto the US taxpayers. It's a long term stategy that will pay off in the future.
The finance guys pushed by the short-term investor crowd threw him out because he wanted long-range improvements that wouldn't create a profit <span style="text-decoration: underline">right now </span>. The guys that watch the stock ticker <span style="text-decoration: underline"> every day </span>had no interest in guys like Stemple.
I wouldn't exactly say that the US car companies are really pension holders at this point. GM negotiatied with the UAW and the union has owned those for the last few years. There was a lot of concessions on that type of stuff about 4 or 5 years ago.
I would say that the American auto companies are health care providers that sell cars to fund their operation (I think I heard Wagoner say that).
One of the reasons that some foreign auto companies build cars in the US is to take the health care costs off the backs of their own taxpayers and onto the US taxpayers. It's a long term stategy that will pay off in the future.