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Flasher relay

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AUSMHLY

AUSMHLY

Yoda
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OK, so the time has come to plug in all the wires and see what happens. To my surprise, all the lights work! Well except, yup, there's always the except. The flashers doesn't work. I hear a click sound from the Flasher Relay. (The silver box under the fresh air tube, front left of the car, lots of wires going to it)

Can it too be full of bead blast dust? Maybe a contact is not making the contact?

The traficator seems to work ok. I put an air hose to that and blew out the dust. I'm assuming it's working.

Your thoughts? Roger
 
Roger, Very very carefully remove the relays cover.If you see dirt in there with very very low air pressure blow it out.I would also very very carfully clean each set of contacts.Then see if it works.All of the "Very" cautions are included because the last time I looked that relay's cost was about $150.00 /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/shocked.gif ---Keoke- /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif
 
Roger:

[ QUOTE ]
I would also very very carfully clean each set of contacts.

[/ QUOTE ]

A POINTS file is perfect for the job. Ditto fuel pumps /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif!!

/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cheers.gif
Ed
 
A POINTS file is perfect for the job. Ditto fuel pumps /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif!!

"A POINTS file". What in the world is zat??.---Keoke- /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif
 
The correct tool is a relay point burnishing tool. It would feel almost smooth to the touch. I am not familiar with the point file. If it is not too agressive, then it would be OK. A finger nail file is way too rough to use on relay points.
 
[ QUOTE ]
Roger:

[ QUOTE ]
I would also very very carfully clean each set of contacts.

[/ QUOTE ]

A POINTS file is perfect for the job. Ditto fuel pumps /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif!!

/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cheers.gif
Ed

[/ QUOTE ]
Use a "points" file or a diamond file for ignition points. Most ignition contact points have tungsten on their surfaces. Tungsten is about five times as hard as any file steel. A regular file used on ignition contacts will just transfer microscopic pieces of the file to the contacts & make things worse than before. Actually a good silicon carbide sandpaper would be much better than a plain file on ignition points.

On the other hand, for relay contacts, I agree with the other ED. Many relays use silver coated contacts & would be harmed by files of any type. A burnisher would be the only way to go on the non-tungsten contacts. Burnishers do feel smooth but on a silvered contact, all you are trying to do is remove soft oxidation, or contamination. Even plain paper might serve as a burnisher on delicate contacts, such as the turn relay, though it might leave sulfur contamination.

Different cleaners for different types of contacts. Burnishers are widely available, if needed.

As an aside: When I changed my car from positive to negative ground, several contacts including the turn relay contacts & a couple of bulb sockets quit working. Not sure why, something to do with polarity change & contact contamination "reversal" I guess. Burnishing the contacts solved the problems.
D
 
I removed the flasher relay. Opened it up to find a computer board. See attached photo. I used an air compressor and blew all the dust off, put it back together and put it back in the car. Did not solve the problem. It still makes the click sound, yet my turn signals still do not work. The head lights, high and low beam work. Front and rear parking lights work. No directional.

What is the flasher units job? If it was bad, would the parking lights not work at all? Do the headlights rely on this unit to work?

Bad unit and replace? What is my next step?

Am I looking at the right part as the problem? Do you think it may be the flasher unit? The unit on the firewall?

How do I test these things? To narrow the problem down to a unit or bad wire or bad ground?
Thank you, Roger
 
[ QUOTE ]
I removed the flasher relay. Opened it up to find a computer board. See attached photo. I used an air compressor and blew all the dust off, put it back together and put it back in the car. Did not solve the problem. It still makes the click sound, yet my turn signals still do not work. The head lights, high and low beam work. Front and rear parking lights work. No directional.

What is the flasher units job? If it was bad, would the parking lights not work at all? Do the headlights rely on this unit to work?

Bad unit and replace? What is my next step?

Am I looking at the right part as the problem? Do you think it may be the flasher unit? The unit on the firewall?

How do I test these things? To narrow the problem down to a unit or bad wire or bad ground?
Thank you, Roger

[/ QUOTE ]
Hi Roger,
I didn't know that anyone made such a "relay box". It is obviously a very neat modern interpretation of the original relay box. The HKE relays are what would appear to be a modern encapsulated relay, obviously the contacts cannot be cleaned or adjusted, & shouldn't need such anyway. The HKE specs are - 12 VDC coil operate voltage, 270 Ohms coil resistance, & two form C contacts in each of the two relays. Where did you get this "device"?

I'm not sure which you mean by "the flasher unit". As far as operation goes, the flasher can (three terminal) on the firewall does the flashing. The relay box with 8 terminals only routes the signals. I doubt if you could hear the relays in the "box" clicking, but maybe. On the other hand, you could hear the flasher itself, on the firewall, clicking as it should.

Assuming that the "new design" relay box is intended to be connected the same as the original box, I don't know this for sure though, the flashers should work. If the flasher itself (three terminal can) is not working you would not hear it clicking. I guess I'm wondering which unit you are actually hearing.

Wow, you come up with some interesting gadgets. I really don't know where to go from here. Hope someone has an idea.
D
 
Well the late Jim Albrec did a very similar design some years ago and it is published in both of the major club magazines.The teminal numbers on this unit shold agree with the schematic and wiring diagram Roger.Hook it back up correctly and using a voltmter set to 12 Volts or more verify that there is a correct 12 volt output on the correct signal terminals when the turn signal switch is in its lefthand and right hand positions.Good input Voltages but no outputs will indicate a filure in one of the relays or circuit board contacts. Lacking an input Voltage will indicate a problem with the trafficator switch or its wiring. let us know how you get on.--Keoke

AS an afterthought,Roger- it will probably be easiest to check this little fella out initially using the stop light circuit,to get stop light power on to the unit after it is hooked up correctly,place a jumper across the stoplight switch if you can get them to work you will be half way home.---Keoke
 
Roger. here are some notes to try and clarify this problem.

"Flasher doesen't work: Means the turn signals did not flash ?.

"Trafficator works OK"??
Maybe, but if the turn signals did not flash the Trafficator can not be exonerated from the problem.

Neither can the Flasher unit on the scuttle. '
 
Sometimes if the bulbs are not of the correct volts/amps/watts, there is not enough resistance? to make the flasher contact engage-heat up - and then release and then keep going thru the routine until they are cancelled
 
Hi guys. I appreciate all the help here.
Dave Russell, sorry I'm not makeing clear what parts I'm refering to. I get these terms from the Moss catalog. Let me try again. Flasher Relay: the silver box, with 8 wires attached, located front left wing under the fresh air hose. Flasher unit: silver small can style unit, 3 wires, attached to the fire wall. Traficator: center unit attached to the steering wheel. Does that help? Only thing making any noise is the Fasher relay. It's a learn as I go, and if I'm calling these units by their wrong names, and confusing things, sorry about that. How's this? Trunk-boot. Hood-bonnet. Fenders-wings. Quarter panels-wings. Windsheild-windscreen? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/savewave.gif

The flasher unit, can on firewall is not making any sounds. Maybe that is the defective unit? I'd like to try and replace that. What should I as for at my local parts store? I seem to run in problems when they find out it's for a 64 Healey. Sorry we don't have a reference for that.

In reply to where the Flasher relay came from, I don't know. PO installed it. Maybe this is what Moss is supplying. He did get most things from them.

I'll be trying all the things mentioned here and thanks for figuring out what I'm trying to get across. Sooner or later, I'll get the terminology correct. Cheers, Roger
 
If what he's refering to as a 'flasher unit' is not making any clicking sound, he has to start there by replacing it, IMHO.
 
[ QUOTE ]
Hi guys. I appreciate all the help here.
Dave Russell, sorry I'm not makeing clear what parts I'm refering to. I get these terms from the Moss catalog. Let me try again. Flasher Relay: the silver box, with 8 wires attached, located front left wing under the fresh air hose. Flasher unit: silver small can style unit, 3 wires, attached to the fire wall. Traficator: center unit attached to the steering wheel. Does that help? Only thing making any noise is the Fasher relay. It's a learn as I go, and if I'm calling these units by their wrong names, and confusing things, sorry about that. How's this? Trunk-boot. Hood-bonnet. Fenders-wings. Quarter panels-wings. Windsheild-windscreen? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/savewave.gif

The flasher unit, can on firewall is not making any sounds. Maybe that is the defective unit? I'd like to try and replace that. What should I as for at my local parts store? I seem to run in problems when they find out it's for a 64 Healey. Sorry we don't have a reference for that.

In reply to where the Flasher relay came from, I don't know. PO installed it. Maybe this is what Moss is supplying. He did get most things from them.

I'll be trying all the things mentioned here and thanks for figuring out what I'm trying to get across. Sooner or later, I'll get the terminology correct. Cheers, Roger

[/ QUOTE ]
Roger,
The flasher unit, three terminal can, should make a light clicking in time with the light blinking. The relay box should only make a click, ONE time when the turn signal lever is first moved into a L or R turn position. It should stay engaged as long as the turn signal lever is in a turn position.

You could start by replacing the flasher unit, three terminal can, with a modern electronic replacement. The flash operation & rate are not dependent on the bulb loads as the original flasher is. Ed helped sort this out for me, although he used a different flasher than I did. Mine is a NAPA # 50-263-3 Signal-Stat turn signal blinker.

Remember that the relay box should click only once when the lever is first moved to a turn position.

I'll give this a try;
Measuring voltages to ground - Terminal 8 on the box should show 12 volts continuously when the turn signal lever is set for a right turn.

With the turn box mounted with the single mounting screw down, the terminals are numbered 1,2,3,4, RH side, top to bottom. 5,6,7,8 LH side, top to bottom.

Terminal 4 on the box should show 12 volts continuously when the turn signal lever is set for left turn.

Terminal 5 on the box should show only when the brake light switch is operated.

Terminal 1 should an intermittant 12 volts in time with the flasher rate when the turn signal lever is switched to L or R.

When set to turn right - no brake - terminal 6 to the right front light should show regular 12 volt pulsing & terminal 7 to the right rear should do the same.

When set to turn left - no brake - terminal 2 to the left front light should show regular 12 volt pulsing & terminal 3 to the left rear should do the same.

With no turn selected, operating the brake should show a steady 12 volts on terminals 3 & 7.
D
 
Quote;
" Mine is a NAPA # 50-263-3 Signal-Stat turn signal blinker. " .....
I used a Stant 550 generic flasher. It was less than $5 and should be found in any auto parts store.... Just giving you another option when shopping for generic flashers. Do the voltage checks that Dave has suggested if simply replacing the 3 terminal flasher can with a new one doesn't correct it right away. PS... Not enough
load on the flasher circut would cause the same symptom
that you have described. Not enough load means " forgot to properly connect up all of the parking/flasher lights " The answer to these questions would help us narrow down the source of the problem; Do the parking lights work ? Do the brake lights work ? Do the turn signals light up bright when turned on and then simply stay on bright ?
 
Hi Ed,
The $15 flasher flashes at the same rate no matter how many bulbs are connected. Not load sensitive at all. This may or may not be good. You certainly won't get the usual "bulb out" warning but the remaining bulbs continue to flash correctly. This is an item that I don't expect to buy frequently so the higher cost was not a factor. Again, thanks for the help.
D /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif
 
I'm not sure this symptom has anything to do with your problem: my left signal operated normally but my right signal flashed very rapidly, as if a bulb were burned out. After a lot of probing and measuring with a voltmeter, it turned out that the Prince of Darkness struck again. The bulb in the left flasher was standard American, 1197, I think, while the bulb in the right flasher was a Lucas variant. Replaced the Lucas bulb and solved the problem.

Like I say, may not be your problem but do check the bulbs.
 
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