engine identification assistance

[Mike_Bouse]

I am the ?third? in line to attempt the completion of a Spit 6. Previous previous owner started the conversion and never finished. Previous owner got it running enough to plate it and put it on the road. Previous owner is basically clueless. PPO is unavailable.

The title says 1969 Spit, but the commission plate says April 1, 1968. is this possible?

More important to this post, is the question of engine identification. can anyone identify the year for this engine block# KE12476UE ??

 

[guzzul]

[ QUOTE ]
The title says 1969 Spit, but the commission plate says April 1, 1968. is this possible?

[/ QUOTE ]
I think you're talking here of the Spitfire (not GT6) body? Do you have a commission number on the plate? Seems a stretch to call it a '69. If it was made in late-68 (say October), then it may well have been sold as a 1969 model. It would be a Spifire Mk3, which was made up to December '70. A commission number would help nail it down.

[ QUOTE ]
More important to this post, is the question of engine identification. can anyone identify the year for this engine block# KE12476UE ??

[/ QUOTE ]
This engine number seems unusual to me. The KE-prefix engines were 9.25:1 compression ratio for the GT6 Mk3. About 13,000 Mk3's were built between October '70 and December '73. I have no idea what the starting serial number was, so I can't help much in placing which specific year for you, but it may not vary all that much.

The part I'm confused about is the "UE" on the end. Usually that means "USA Engine". But the US-imported Mk3's suposedly had a de-tuned engine (8:1 ratio), and had a "KF" prefix, not "KE".

Can you check and see if the carb(s) have a small brass tag on them, screwed under one of the corner screws right in top of the carb. If you can see the code stamped on the brass tag, that could help identify the specific year.

Also, Spitfire distributors (Lucas ones) have an embossed set of numbers on the side, indicating the dizzy model and then an arrow (-->) pointing to another set of numbers which indicate the year and week of manufacture. Check and see if you have either of these indicators.

 

[Andrew Mace]

[ QUOTE ]
The title says 1969 Spit, but the commission plate says April 1, 1968. is this possible?

[/ QUOTE ]More likely that date indicates that the car met Federal standards in effect as of that date; it's not really a build date. (If it were, that means a whole bunch of Triumphs were built April Fool's Day! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/jester.gif )

I agree that an actual commission number would help date it. But if that commission number begins with FDU, AND it's repeated on a tag on the windshield post (driver's side), AND if the car has the "Federal" dash with speedo and tach in front of the driver, then it's a 1969 Federal model.
[ QUOTE ]
More important to this post, is the question of engine identification. can anyone identify the year for this engine block# KE12476UE ??

[/ QUOTE ]I also would've expected a "KF" prefix; nonethless, this is likely a 1972 motor, with the "UE" indicating the "Federalized" low-compression, recessed-bore verion.

 

[Mike_Bouse]

i am certain about the spitfire commission number, it is repeated on the windshield. Sorry, i forgot this in my original post. the Spit commission number is FDU 31409 L

my research also showed that the UE stood for USA engine.

clarification -> "FEDERAL SAFETY STANDARDS APPICABLE ON April 1, 1968" i guess this is not the same as commission date. So the original car met '68 safety standards? Is that what i am reading? am i correct that it is a '69 Spit body?

here is the number off the brass tag on the carb:
two part number, the first over the second
2063
342 GR

the G could also be a 6.

the dizzy looks original, however who knows for sure. it has a vacuum advance diaphram, but the hose is disconnected and plugged. where should that hose be attached? i could find zero identification marks as suggested on the dizzy. where should i be looking? is it possible to post a picture?

also, what is a 'federal' dash? yes, my speedo and tach are behind the steering wheel; and not in the center of the dash. is that what makes a 'federal' dash?

 

[Andrew Mace]

[ QUOTE ]
i am certain about the spitfire commission number, it is repeated on the windshield. Sorry, i forgot this in my original post. the Spit commission number is FDU 31409 L....

[/ QUOTE ]OK, that does confirm it as a 1969 model!

[ QUOTE ]
...So the original car met '68 safety standards? Is that what i am reading? am i correct that it is a '69 Spit body?

[/ QUOTE ]Yes!

[ QUOTE ]
...i could find zero identification marks as suggested on the dizzy....

[/ QUOTE ]Info quoted previously was for a Lucas distributor; this likely is a Delco!

[ QUOTE ]
also, what is a 'federal' dash? yes, my speedo and tach are behind the steering wheel; and not in the center of the dash. is that what makes a 'federal' dash?

[/ QUOTE ]Yes, that's it. Mk3s in other markets carried the centered instrument panel to the end of production, but 1969 and later Mk3s for the US got the dash layout eventually phased in on all Spitfires beginning with the MkIV model.

 

[Mike_Bouse]

wow, thanks andy. that makes me feel a little better. now i can state with more confidence that i need '69 trim parts.

and i am gonna need a ton of them. going to get my first handful this weekend.

now if we could just get a handle on the year of this engine...

 

[guzzul]

The engine looks to be a 71-72. As Andy noted earlier, my guess would also be a '72.

The carb number you are looking at is 3426R. If there is a tag on the other carb it should read 3426L (right and left respectively). The 3426 carb spec was used on GT6 Mk3, USA market, 1971-72. The carb type is 150CDSE, and the metering needle in it should be B5CF.

I have attached a jpg of a Lucas distributor showing the id marks. These would nail down the year specifically for you, but as Andrew mentioned, if you have a Delco distributor I'm not sure they have the same markings. On the Lucas, these marks are at the back of the dizzy, the side facing the engine (of course to make it impossible to see without pulling it).