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Door Glass
- Thread starter AUSMHLY
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anthony7777
Yoda
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keoke, dat zakly what i said!!!!!!!
Hello again team:
I posted again to this thread, because it has been helpful. A follow-up question with respect to the nylon guides for the door glass frame.
They were renewed with moss parts, but man was it ever a tight fit to the vent channel and the hidden channel.
Since there was a lot of effort in riveting the frame and seat the glass I dont want to make a mistake now..... Is it common to have to sand the nylon guides down a bit to get them to tolerance and slide more easily?
To clarify, I do understand the fitting of the hidden channel with multiple washers, rather, the darn nylon guides seem too big?
As well, what is the composition and purpose of the material that is glued to the door frame and protects the rear of interior panel from the door glass assembly... sources?
- Andrew -
I posted again to this thread, because it has been helpful. A follow-up question with respect to the nylon guides for the door glass frame.
They were renewed with moss parts, but man was it ever a tight fit to the vent channel and the hidden channel.
Since there was a lot of effort in riveting the frame and seat the glass I dont want to make a mistake now..... Is it common to have to sand the nylon guides down a bit to get them to tolerance and slide more easily?
To clarify, I do understand the fitting of the hidden channel with multiple washers, rather, the darn nylon guides seem too big?
As well, what is the composition and purpose of the material that is glued to the door frame and protects the rear of interior panel from the door glass assembly... sources?
- Andrew -
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I know that it's good for padding post totals, but could we keep this a little more on topic, please... /bcforum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/thankyousign.gif
healeynut
Jedi Knight
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Andrew -
I would try using a plastic or wooden dowel to spread the channel widths a bit. The Nylon guides from Moss should fit right in... unless they have switched manufacturers or something.
Of course you can sand the nylon guides a bit too, but just be careful not to over do it, as once they are loose, they seems to get worse... they tend to work better when working with a snug fit. That's why I think trying to spread the channels a bit (uniformly) will be the first thing to try... then work on the guides.
I would try using a plastic or wooden dowel to spread the channel widths a bit. The Nylon guides from Moss should fit right in... unless they have switched manufacturers or something.
Of course you can sand the nylon guides a bit too, but just be careful not to over do it, as once they are loose, they seems to get worse... they tend to work better when working with a snug fit. That's why I think trying to spread the channels a bit (uniformly) will be the first thing to try... then work on the guides.
Ed_K
Jedi Knight
Offline
Hi Andrew,
I'll try to answer your questions;
"Is it common to have to sand the nylon guides down a bit to get them to tolerance and slide more easily? " .... I didn't have to sand or do anything to the new nylon guides that I got from Moss.
"To clarify, I do understand the fitting of the hidden channel with multiple washers, rather, the darn nylon guides seem too big?" .... I think you are saying that the nylon guides appear to be too large and taking up too much space ? Do they appear to be too large in size to fit into the hidden track as well as the vent window track ? If so, I wonder if you have the right nylon pieces ? Try sliding the nylon piece down the length of the hidden channel when it is out of the door. You might find some places along the hidden channel that was pushed together and you may have to open them up some with a pair of pliers so that the nylon piece will travel smoothly along the entire length of the hidden channel. If there does not appear to be enough total end clearance of the nylon pieces to both window tracks, you can try two things; loosen the screws that attach the bottom of the vent side window track to the door and push the end of the track toward the door hinges in order to " open up " the overall clearance for the window. You can also form ( bend ) the mounting tabs of the hidden window track flatter so the hidden window rack will come to rest closer to the inside edge of the door. This will also open up more end to end clearance of the whole window. The hidden window track may require bend the tab flat on one end and putting a washer or two under the other in order to open up a " uniform " clearance between the nylon pieces and the bottoms of both window channels. I put a strong florescent shop light down inside door and then looked down from the top opening in the door to view how the nylon pieces were fitting as I rolled the glass up and down, making a few adjustments as I described until I got it to work smoothly. It was a trial and error process in which I took the hidden track out at least three or four times to make various adjustments until it worked smoothly. But before you start, make certain that the nylon pieces will fit and slide up and down the length of the channels without the glass. If they don't, you will have to figure out why and then fix the problem.
" As well, what is the composition and purpose of the material that is glued to the door frame and protects the rear of interior panel from the door glass assembly... sources?" .... It appeared to be some kind of vinyl. I had some holes in one of mine. I just attached some heavy MIL black plastic under it to maintain the moisture barrier that protects the underside of the door interior trim panel. That is what it's purpose appeared to be to me.
I hope this helps as I have only done my two doors months ago. Others have probably done this many times and will give better tips than me.
Good luck !
Ed
I'll try to answer your questions;
"Is it common to have to sand the nylon guides down a bit to get them to tolerance and slide more easily? " .... I didn't have to sand or do anything to the new nylon guides that I got from Moss.
"To clarify, I do understand the fitting of the hidden channel with multiple washers, rather, the darn nylon guides seem too big?" .... I think you are saying that the nylon guides appear to be too large and taking up too much space ? Do they appear to be too large in size to fit into the hidden track as well as the vent window track ? If so, I wonder if you have the right nylon pieces ? Try sliding the nylon piece down the length of the hidden channel when it is out of the door. You might find some places along the hidden channel that was pushed together and you may have to open them up some with a pair of pliers so that the nylon piece will travel smoothly along the entire length of the hidden channel. If there does not appear to be enough total end clearance of the nylon pieces to both window tracks, you can try two things; loosen the screws that attach the bottom of the vent side window track to the door and push the end of the track toward the door hinges in order to " open up " the overall clearance for the window. You can also form ( bend ) the mounting tabs of the hidden window track flatter so the hidden window rack will come to rest closer to the inside edge of the door. This will also open up more end to end clearance of the whole window. The hidden window track may require bend the tab flat on one end and putting a washer or two under the other in order to open up a " uniform " clearance between the nylon pieces and the bottoms of both window channels. I put a strong florescent shop light down inside door and then looked down from the top opening in the door to view how the nylon pieces were fitting as I rolled the glass up and down, making a few adjustments as I described until I got it to work smoothly. It was a trial and error process in which I took the hidden track out at least three or four times to make various adjustments until it worked smoothly. But before you start, make certain that the nylon pieces will fit and slide up and down the length of the channels without the glass. If they don't, you will have to figure out why and then fix the problem.
" As well, what is the composition and purpose of the material that is glued to the door frame and protects the rear of interior panel from the door glass assembly... sources?" .... It appeared to be some kind of vinyl. I had some holes in one of mine. I just attached some heavy MIL black plastic under it to maintain the moisture barrier that protects the underside of the door interior trim panel. That is what it's purpose appeared to be to me.
I hope this helps as I have only done my two doors months ago. Others have probably done this many times and will give better tips than me.
Good luck !
Ed
OP
AUSMHLY
Yoda
Offline
Well explained Ed,
I spent more time on this window project than almost any other Healey project. Let me see if I can ad to anything Ed wrote. Eventhough he did use all the big smart words, and covered most everything in detail, I've got my dictionary here and will step up to the plate.
1. Take both guide rails out and make sure the nylon tabs will slide the entire length. Make adjustments as needed.
2. With the nylon tabs inserted in the glass frame, with the glass in the frame, slide one side of the frame down the guide rail to see if they have the same curve. Make adjustments. Do the same to the other side.
3. Install the guide rails back into the car, allowing them to have a little movement. Try and slide the window assembly down and watch where it binds up.
4. Adjustment to the back guide will be side to side only.
5. Adjustment to the front guide will be more complex.
Ad washers to the bottom to shim it out if needed.
Adjust forward or back angle. The bottom has two screws, the top where the vent is can go forward or back. Note that moving it too much forward will make the front of the vent surround hit the windshield post.
6. Check to see if back or front guides are twisted and putting pressure on the tabs. Make adjustment. (That's where my problem was).
A lot of trial and error. A lot of patience.
Now it slides up and down smoothly. Think your done?
Once you attach the crank handle bar to the guide track on the bottom of the window, does it still slide OK?
If so, consider yourself lucky.
If not, like me, take a step back, take a moment, take a breath and say #$&^@#
1. Sell the car.
2. Keep the car and clean the regulator gears and the roller at the end of the arm.
3. If the guide track on the bottom of the window is not in the right place, make adjustment.
4. An adjustment may have to be made to the regulator arm, as in bending it for proper pressure.
Now it slides up and down smoothly. Think your done?
Feeling lucky?
Install both the felt strip and the chrome finishing strip that holds the rubber weather strip on the top of the door.
Wind the window up and down. Feeling lucky?
1. Sell the car.
2. You may have to tweak the opening on top of the door to make clearance for those two pieces. I fond that flatting the black felt strip helped a little (Someone will correct my terms I'm sure. Felt?) I'm assuming your installing new rubber and felt.
Now stand back and admire your efforts. She works. And she works smoothly with a lot less effort. And this entire job only took and hour and a half. NOT. For me it was a week project. Per door. It may have gone a lot quicker if everything wasn't a figure it out as you go. Plus the down time I had combing my hair after seeing my refection in the window after every up and down trial.
Hope this helps and good luck.
Ps. wake up. Seems I went on and on, blah blah blah. You'll find this in paper back soon
Roger
I spent more time on this window project than almost any other Healey project. Let me see if I can ad to anything Ed wrote. Eventhough he did use all the big smart words, and covered most everything in detail, I've got my dictionary here and will step up to the plate.
1. Take both guide rails out and make sure the nylon tabs will slide the entire length. Make adjustments as needed.
2. With the nylon tabs inserted in the glass frame, with the glass in the frame, slide one side of the frame down the guide rail to see if they have the same curve. Make adjustments. Do the same to the other side.
3. Install the guide rails back into the car, allowing them to have a little movement. Try and slide the window assembly down and watch where it binds up.
4. Adjustment to the back guide will be side to side only.
5. Adjustment to the front guide will be more complex.
Ad washers to the bottom to shim it out if needed.
Adjust forward or back angle. The bottom has two screws, the top where the vent is can go forward or back. Note that moving it too much forward will make the front of the vent surround hit the windshield post.
6. Check to see if back or front guides are twisted and putting pressure on the tabs. Make adjustment. (That's where my problem was).
A lot of trial and error. A lot of patience.
Now it slides up and down smoothly. Think your done?
Once you attach the crank handle bar to the guide track on the bottom of the window, does it still slide OK?
If so, consider yourself lucky.
If not, like me, take a step back, take a moment, take a breath and say #$&^@#
1. Sell the car.
2. Keep the car and clean the regulator gears and the roller at the end of the arm.
3. If the guide track on the bottom of the window is not in the right place, make adjustment.
4. An adjustment may have to be made to the regulator arm, as in bending it for proper pressure.
Now it slides up and down smoothly. Think your done?
Feeling lucky?
Install both the felt strip and the chrome finishing strip that holds the rubber weather strip on the top of the door.
Wind the window up and down. Feeling lucky?
1. Sell the car.
2. You may have to tweak the opening on top of the door to make clearance for those two pieces. I fond that flatting the black felt strip helped a little (Someone will correct my terms I'm sure. Felt?) I'm assuming your installing new rubber and felt.
Now stand back and admire your efforts. She works. And she works smoothly with a lot less effort. And this entire job only took and hour and a half. NOT. For me it was a week project. Per door. It may have gone a lot quicker if everything wasn't a figure it out as you go. Plus the down time I had combing my hair after seeing my refection in the window after every up and down trial.
Hope this helps and good luck.
Ps. wake up. Seems I went on and on, blah blah blah. You'll find this in paper back soon
Roger
Ed_K
Jedi Knight
Offline
Roger,
Good job. I did leave out the " lubricate everything inside the door " part. That is important because I forgot to lubricate everything on one of my doors and I had to remove the inside door trim panel after I had it all the way together, just so I could lubricate the window regulator and the door latch hardware ! That was a big waste of time due to me forgetting it. Removing the pins from the door and window handles and then reinstalling them again didn't seem to get any easier the 2nd time around !
Ed
Good job. I did leave out the " lubricate everything inside the door " part. That is important because I forgot to lubricate everything on one of my doors and I had to remove the inside door trim panel after I had it all the way together, just so I could lubricate the window regulator and the door latch hardware ! That was a big waste of time due to me forgetting it. Removing the pins from the door and window handles and then reinstalling them again didn't seem to get any easier the 2nd time around !
Ed
OP
AUSMHLY
Yoda
Offline
Ed, don't even get me started with how much fun those pins (aka as cut nails)are. As Rosanna Rosannadanna would say, if it's not one thing it's another.
Dude, you got it down to two times? You da man. I've been in and out of those doors more times than I have fingers and thumbs. But...I am Johnny on the spot now. Go Flash go! Look for the paperback in a Healey store near you. And remember kids, we're not professionals, so do try this at home. And don't forget what uncle Ed says, "lubricate everything inside the door". Cheers, Roger
Dude, you got it down to two times? You da man. I've been in and out of those doors more times than I have fingers and thumbs. But...I am Johnny on the spot now. Go Flash go! Look for the paperback in a Healey store near you. And remember kids, we're not professionals, so do try this at home. And don't forget what uncle Ed says, "lubricate everything inside the door". Cheers, Roger
Roger, thanks for this thread—I’m just finishing a door rebuild and his was hugely helpful. I took my window apart, but couldn’t get the Moss rubber glazing to work, so it’s at the glass shop. The mechanisms are all cleaned, greased, and working smoothly! Happy motoring..Kirby