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Cliff or Clutch?

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dizzplaced

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Well, I finally got my new tires for the tr6 today, Pirelli 4000 STs, came home, mounted them, took the thing from heck off the jackstands, started it stupidly believing I'd actually drive it anywhere...ever.
It will not go into gear. It just grinds in every gear. I bled that crappy shotglass of a master cylinder until I was bathing in brake fluid. Nothing. Is the **** clutch yet another item I'll need to add to the 15 page list of replaced, rebuilt, overhauled, upgraded and improved parts this "car" needed.
heck, when I bought it from that thief in PA I should have just ordered every single thing in the Moss catalog and sent them my bank routing number. Or, in hindsight, I'd have tossed the catalog, parted out the car, accepted my stupidity and bought a fully restored vehicle. Had I done that, I'd have saved THOUSANDS of dollars and god knows how many endless hours soaked in oil, grease, dried crud, rust flakes, bondo dust, welding fumes, stripper and paint fumes, exhaust and gas fumes, brake fluid, gear lube, carpet fibers, steel shards, glue, the list goes on. All leading up to the day when it STILL doesn't drive. I'm looking for that cliff around here to shove it off except I'd have to tow the mess there. I naively thought this was going to be a fun and satisfying experience. I hate this car with a passion.
 
sounds like a challenge to me, I thought about the same thing, and I went ahead and paid a higher price for my TR6 just because you can never get out of a car what you put into it, I will tell you that my issue is carburators, I purchased a set of mikunis from a guy in oregon wont name names as of yet and I sent them back because they didnt work and I didnt get any support from the guy, Now I have a triple set of webers I am trying to tune plus a new fuel pump and MSD system. if the clutch cylinder is not blead your clutch will not disengage, I took the slave cylinder off the car tilted the bleader screw up and opened it and gravity blead the air out, you might try that also only use castrol brake fluid for some reason all other fluids make the rubber swell up good luck
 
Gee, where have I heard this story before.

Sounds like a typical Triumph love/hate relationship.

That said, from the intensity of your posting, I really think that you should consider getting out from beneath this beast before it consumes you. I'll bet that a really nice Miata or Beemer Z-car would suit you just fine. This is supposed to be fun, not pain. Do yourself a favor and bail.

Bill
 
I just had an engine/tranny swap that had a wall around every corner that I turned. Sometimes it's best to walk away for a little bit and clear the head. Find a friend who will take you for a ride in their car to refresh the batteries.(and hope it doesn't break down along the way).
Are you losing any fluid from the reservoir? Look under the drivers carpet to see if the master might be leaking. While you are there, have someone press the pedal and check to see if you are getting movement at the slave cylinder. It should move about 3/4" or so. What hole on the clutch arm is your rod attached? Usually the middle is good, but the top hole may be necessary. If you have movement, with the wheels on the ground and in neutral, try pushing the car to see if the flywheel is frozen to the clutch disc. If the car has been sitting for an extended period of time, this can easily happen. Then it is time to tie on the tow rope and break it free.
If this is not the case, a new clutch may be the answer.
If you have a hydraulics problem, you can try to rebuild the master, but don't waste your time with the slave, buy new.
 
Don't give up! I do know how you feel - I was ready to light my car on fire a couple weeks ago for a reason I don't want to talk about at the moment. You make the assumption that if you had spent a lot more money that you would not be having problems. Check out the internet. It is filled with websites of cases where someone bought their great looking dream car that they had spent a whole lot of money on only to find out later they had to do a total restoration anyway. I admit I am afraid to add up my reciepts. I bought my car for $2,000, and I will have probably spent the same on parts just to get it running properly. I do get discouraged at times, but I keep thinking of that day I finally make it out onto the road for the first time. Personally, there is something satisfying about reserecting my car from the dead. (It has been sitting for over 25 years.) Not all people have that patience. Look at it this way. By the time you finish, you should have a very sound car you will not have to do any serious work on for a while. You are also learning an icredible amount of knowlege as you work toward completion. If you read this forum, you will see there are lots of problems, but also many people there to help you out.

I bought my 69 TR6 last September. It was the best I could afford at the time, and the only way I was going to be able to own one of these. I have been working on this car off and on since last September. I have been meticulous at getting NOS or used parts on Ebay. I have made mistakes, and have had to rebuild almost everything on this car. I have had to ask a lot of advise from many people, including this forum.

By the way, I hate to admit it, but I had to pull my transmission three times before I figured out all the problems with the clutch. I agree with Bill that you need to take a break, but you have gone too far to give up now.
 
I feel your pain ...
I'm only two years into restoration of my 71 tr6 project and already I think I have replaced or rebuilt almost every major component on this car. The only problem is im hooked on Triumph's. before this I had a 73 GT6 with similar problems, all I could say is keep the faith...Doug has some sound advice for you!
Good Luck!
 
Your comment "try pushing the car to see if the flywheel is frozen to the clutch disc. If the car has been sitting for an extended period of time, this can easily happen." interested me. The po of my TR6 had this problem on several occasions, and now my "6" has been sitting up for years. Could you describe this problem, what causes it, and detail the fix. Many thanks!!
 
I admit I actually drove it to the have the top installed on Friday, the first real drive of any distance. It drove okay, a little gear grinding, but I got there and back. I took the wheels off to get the new tires installed and while it was on jackstands I bled the brakes. The next day (today) I can't get it in gear. No leaks anywhere. Anyway, I'll try the recommendations but probably will end up getting a new slave cylinder. Sigh
 
Love the title - I have a friend called Cliff who is looking for a TR6. Guess what gets my vote.

Seriously - you'll feel like this off and on until you fix everything. When you do you'll be a lot happier.

Now if I ever get to that happy nirvana I'll post again, until then Good luck - I feel your pain more than you know...
 
I know what you mean-- see my post on "one of those days" was taking the car in for the 4 time related to the starter when the clutch went out. After the tow, new clutch master cyl kit, etc, etc and repaired starter (not the way I wanted). But I got it home yesterday, cleaned it up and was on the road again, cruising around in my TR3 Triumph, runnin' like a champ.
Now just gotta find the gas leak... and find a mounting adaptor for TR6 fan so it won't overheat.... oh, and that floppy RR shock absorber...
 
I don't recommend a bandaid approach to fixing your problem, but just in case BPNorthwest sells a long throw slave cylinder that could in theory disengage the clutch better. You may have other problems like a broken pin on the throwout arm, etc. I was plagued with this about 10 years ago and solved it by getting a new throwout arm and getting a higher displacement m/c.

Good luck, and don't forget summer is coming.
Randy
 
Regarding the clutch freezing to the flywheel. I've had it happen twice in 18 years of Triumphing. On both occasions, my car was resting in the basement of an old damp barn. The cause? I can only guess that the temperature fluctuation and dampness caused corrosion on the face of the flywheel and possibly a slight breakdown of the clutch disc allowing them to bond together.
The symptom is the car is always "in gear". We towed my car in neutral, starting and stopping several times trying to break the bond free. The first time it broke free rather quickly, the second took a while.
 
Something to try, and its free, is to use a piece of wood or metal wedged against the drivers seat to hold the clutch in the depressed position, then leave it that way for a full day.
This has worked for me in the past when I had air in the system, and it will give you time to calm down and think things over, something else I have sometimes had to do!
Good luck! Simon.
 
if you hold the clutch down for the entire day, do you have to open the bleed valve at the same time, or just let it bleed passive? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/driving.gif
 
To own one of these cars has got to be a labor you love or you know a good mechanic... Just hang in there and invite some lbc lovers over for a little workfest... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cheers.gif
Dennis
 
Have been down this path several times. TR6 clutchs can be hard on the head. From what I have read, since the car has been driven at least once fairly lately, the clutch plate is not stuck to flywheel. TR6 are bad to do that has well but it is usually after at least 6-12 months sitting. To see if it is hydualic condition, crank car, pump the clutch pedal at least 6-10 times fairly quickly and try to engage transmission. If it goes in, then you know it is probably the master cylinder. Another thing to do. Jack up car, have someone push clutch and watch travel of rod, if slave cylinder spacer is close to coming out of cylinder, the rod will need to be made longer. This also indicates clutch plate is bad or one of those no good aftermarket clutchs. That a whole other story. Just my two cents worth. There are still other things to do, but lets see what this turns up

Marv
 
me,
trfourtune
tr four tune
tr fortune (what it costs!)
now you get it.
welcome to the curse.
it's like my wife, nice but bites.
rob
 
I erred in my comment on how to free a frozen clutch. The car must be IN gear. It would take a looonnnng time to get it unfrozen in neutral.
 
Marv...."slave cylinder spacer"??? There was nothing between the pushrod and the cylinder piston. Should there be? I did get a new slave cylinder today, installed it, bled the system (going on my 3rd gallon of castrol expensive ****ing brake fluid) and tried it. It worked. Shifted fine in all gears. Went downstairs, told girlfriend we were taking a drive, took a shower, came back, started it....GRRRRRRINNNNDDDDDD. GRIND GRIND GRIND. She said "So, I guess we're not going anywhere...AGAIN?"
Someone mentioned leaving the bleeder open for a day. Wouldnt all the fluid drain out of the thimble size MC pretty quickly?
 
Try pumping on the clutch pedal rapidly a few times and see if it will go into gear OK. If so, you're clutch master is probably toast. I know you rebuilt the whole car, but you're very close now, and no need to push it off the cliff. Since you did get the clutch to work by putting in a slave cylinder and bleeding, the problem is hydraulic, and the only thing left is the master. BTW, master cylinders most of the time leak internally past the seal, so you don't see any "leaks". They just lose their ability to supply pressure to the slave./ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cheers.gif
 
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