Career Change, or improvements?

[wkilleffer]

Greetings, and Merry Christmas to us all!

Some people may say this is a strange place to ask a question like this one, but given the diverse group we have here, it seems I could get a useful answer.

Anyway, I'm 42 years old, liberal arts grad, working in the office for a large insurance company. The money's ok, job's ok, but as with any large company like this, you just don't know what the future might bring. As a liberal arts grad, I feel like I don't have much to set me apart from all the other umm.. persons with similar degrees. Lots of other people have good work ethics, are dependable, honest etc. So, I'm trying to think of ways that I can set myself apart, like having a special, useful skill, or something like that.

Not everyone gets to pursue their dream, but if I had nothing standing in my way, I would seek training to be a watchmaker and look into either setting up my own shop or seeking employment with one of the service centers in this country. From what I've heard, they would like to hire more people, the money is pretty good, but finding people with the right skills is a challenge for them. The problem with doing that is that training is offered in just a few places in the US, and none of them are near me. I have a house, bills, responsibilities etc, and don't see that it would be realistic for me to pull up stakes and relocate to an area where I could train for this. It's one of those things I wish I'd known about when I was younger, but didn't find out about until I was over 30.

So, the next idea is to find something that I could learn close to home and keep a job while I'm doing it. So the idea of computer science comes to mind. It was always an interest, but for whatever reason, sometime in late high school or early college, I got away from the programming/coding side of things. I'm confident that I could buckle down and learn what I needed to learn, but wonder if it's a good idea to try. If I do it right, the company might pay for some of it, and might have a job for me to jump into when I'm done. Also, I'm not afraid to get my hands dirty. One of my HS classmates completed a journeyman's electrician program about a year ago, and now he's making just under double what I do. He earns it, with some late nights, odd hours, and we all know that electricity demands a healthy respect. The head of the program lives just down the street from me, and it's tempting to run over there and have a chat with him...

So, I figure I'm not the only person on here who has decided there has to be more to life. Also, wishing I'd known a few things back when that I know now. So, for you workers out there, you career changers, wise sages, what are your thoughts, and how would you handle this if you were in my shoes?

Thank you,
-William

 

[Boink]

An age-old question... with no "simple" answers. For me, in considering moving to another position, it boiled down to walking away from a sure thing to an unsure one. You don't mention it, but I found it pivotal to consider wife and kids (schools, etc.).. and in my case, I was pretty satisfied (though a wise sage once told me to always keep your eyes and ears open). In the final analysis, it really comes down to how happy or unhappy you are. If you're having pangs about it all, have a passion for something else, and can swing it (financially), I'd follow those dreams.

P.S. - you are at a classic age where many have the same thoughts. You're certainly not alone in this regard. It's only life... and it's the only one you have. Maybe better to leap than wish you hadn't (in 20 years). At least you're asking around. Again, easy for me to type.

 

[wkilleffer]

An age-old question... with no "simple" answers. For me, in considering moving to another position, it boiled down to walking away from a sure thing to an unsure one. You don't mention it, but I found it pivotal to consider wife and kids (schools, etc.).. and in my case, I was pretty satisfied (though a wise sage once told me to always keep your eyes and ears open). In the final analysis, it really comes down to how happy or unhappy you are. If you're having pangs about it all, have a passion for something else, and can swing it (financially), I'd follow those dreams.

P.S. - you are at a classic age where many have the same thoughts. You're certainly not alone in this regard. It's only life... and it's the only one you have. Maybe better to leap than wish you hadn't (in 20 years). Again, easy for me to type.

Hey Boink, and thanks for your reply.

With regards to family, my parents are still living and my siblings are nearby. I have a GF and we seem pretty serious. She works a similar job and has some issues of her own, but I don't see her wanting to leave because some of the benefits are good. But I don't have kids or anything like that. It is nice, though, to know your bills will be paid every month.

Something that I'm not fond of about current job is that we're working 60-hr weeks during the worst time to have to deal with that. Granted, we get paid for the extra time. But it's like going to work tired all the time. I know there are people out there who do more than that. But it's almost like inviting yourself to make more mistakes on the job.

It's also hard to be passionate on the job. I want to do it well and correctly, but it's just something I do, you know? I wouldn't walk away just for that reason. Not everyone gets to follow that passion. But it would be nice to well and truly love, or at least have strong feelings for what I do.

I don't really see it as a sure thing the way some people would because a business decision could be made 500 miles away by someone I've never met, and all of a sudden, I'm out on my backside. Some of what I'm talking about could even be my way of having a Plan B in the event that something like that happens. I would have something I could fall back on and spend less time searching.

Like you, keeping eyes and ears open is important, and I've been doing it for a bit now.

Thanks again,
-William

 

[Boink]

William, you also don't mention how long you've been at this job. In my experience, jobs and careers have a feeling of cycles to them... sometimes miserable conditions greatly improve (or, gulp, go the other way). Sometimes developing outside interests end up being key distractions that re-invigorate OR expose you to other ideas for a career. Wish I knew the answer. I was truly lucky in job and career. Good luck.

 

[wkilleffer]

William, you also don't mention how long you've been at this job. In my experience, jobs and careers have a feeling of cycles to them... sometimes miserable conditions greatly improve (or, gulp, go the other way). Sometimes developing outside interests end up being key distractions that re-invigorate OR expose you to other ideas for a career. Wish I knew the answer. I was truly lucky in job and career. Good luck.

Oops, sorry about that. Been at the current job for about 2.5 years, and have four years prior experience with the company from 2000-2004. Left back then because the situation with the manager I had at the time was making me physically ill, and I only wish that I were joking there... I was glad they hired me again, and I'm thankful to have the job. Went without at a few other times, and don't want to experience that again if possible.

It's not miserable, but not exactly happy either. Boss seems to be fond of the micro managerial approach to things, which is annoying and seems to actually slow down getting the work done. Hard to just keep your head down and get your work done.

 

[CaptRandy]

Worked as lending officer. bank VP for 30 yrs and could not wit to be downsized. Was 50 at time and decided wanted to work outside for myself. Looked into franchises, new business ventures and such. Decided to start own business as pressure washer. Equipment was paid from payout for downsizing, more than enough for truck equipment and startup ads and all. Was successful and retired a couple years ago. Business requires your attention to details to be sure you are satisfying the customer because you pay for the first job through advertising but the repeat is free gravy. I had customers callme back 6-7 times to do the jobs as they needed. Clean decks and seal, clean houses of dirt and mold, clean trucks for delivery companies, parking lots of supermarkets. There are are many clients available. Keep away form gas stations as EPA may go after you to capture oil and gas residue.
I set my own hours, my own pay scale and best of all all $$ profit was mine. Bought a second home with the excess profits as well as new vehicles.
Not to say pressure washing is for you but go to net to see what is out there.

 

[DrEntropy]

I also am nobody to give advice, but I did listen to my dear departed Ol' Fella long ago. He said: "A degree would be great but if you can also know how to use your hands, you'll never starve."

He wasn't wrong. I went from professional photographer (photojournalist) to car sales, to non-destructive test inspector of nuke-grade tubular steel products, to Certified Porsche-Audi Tech, A.S.E. certified, to publisher of a newspaper, to restoring older European automobiles, to now an independent I.T. consultant with half a dozen successful local businesses as clients. Turned 66 recently and am "officially" retired but will continue with the consulting work as long as I'm able. The "hands and mind" thing has worked well for me.

Can you not find a way to get yourself into an on-line course to get started with the watchmaking? Haven't looked but would think by now ~somebody~ would be offering some sort of on-line course, even if rudimentary. Toe-in-the-water kinda thing.

Good luck with the decision, be glad of one thing: you are not yet responsible for little ones!

 

[NutmegCT]

Just a comment. Sounds like you're pretty free of financial entanglements. Not married, no dependents. You've got a lot more freedom for "change" than most of us had at your age.

That said, one thing I learned over the past 40+ years of working: it's possible - but not very probable - to support yourself doing only what you love.

But after a few failed attempts to do that, I accepted reality, and realized I could only afford to do what I loved (music, travel, old cars) only when I had a full time job. So I kept at it, found some small successes in my career (public education), retired with a pension, and am still enjoying those things I loved.

I never inherited any material things, or married into wealth, so I did what I could with what I had. No house in the mountains, so garage-mahal, no trips to the Caribbean.

There are no perfect jobs.

As Thoreau wrote: The mass of men lead lives of quiet desperation.

So ... I avoided Thoreau's mass, and found happiness by helping others, and enjoying my passions when I can.

Tom M.

 

[DrEntropy]

Worked as lending officer. bank VP for 30 yrs and could not wit to be downsized. Was 50 at time and decided wanted to work outside for myself. Looked into franchises, new business ventures and such. Decided to start own business as pressure washer. Equipment was paid from payout for downsizing, more than enough for truck equipment and startup ads and all. Was successful and retired a couple years ago. Business requires your attention to details to be sure you are satisfying the customer because you pay for the first job through advertising but the repeat is free gravy. I had customers callme back 6-7 times to do the jobs as they needed. Clean decks and seal, clean houses of dirt and mold, clean trucks for delivery companies, parking lots of supermarkets. There are are many clients available. Keep away form gas stations as EPA may go after you to capture oil and gas residue.
I set my own hours, my own pay scale and best of all all $$ profit was mine. Bought a second home with the excess profits as well as new vehicles.
Not to say pressure washing is for you but go to net to see what is out there.

:thumbsup: My Miami B.I.L got a degree in psychology, worked for the state for a couple years then started a business painting houses. Raised five kids and did very well. Now retired, he's comfortable and happy.

 

[JPSmit]

Can you not find a way to get yourself into an on-line course to get started with the watchmaking? Haven't looked but would think by now ~somebody~ would be offering some sort of on-line course, even if rudimentary. Toe-in-the-water kinda thing.

Doc beat me to it - Google it - there are a number of online courses. Then you can get your feet wet without much risk (a few hundred dollars). My Brother is building a retirement business repairing woodwind instruments - mostly online and practice - much like restoring old cars.

My daughter is doing tech at the local community college and recently we read an article that said that all the college openings for tech students only account for 1/3 of the demand.

That said, thinking about the next 20 years or so, consider very carefully whether what you are considering can be outsourced (my concern for my daughter's tech program) or, what will end up being done by a computer (hint - if it involves comparison and/or data bases computers will likely end up doing it including medical diagnosis/ significant aspects of Law etc etc.)

Around here, the trades are in huge demand (I have a friend who is a very specialty welder - underwater/ alloys etc - his son took a course offered here for traditional trades - became a stone mason and made more money than his dad his first day of work.

As you consider all this, let me point you at 2 books - The Hundred Dollar Startup and the Four Hour Work week. Very Very helpful to help focus your thoughts even if you don't want to ultimately work for yourself.

https://www.amazon.ca/100-Startup-R...61&sr=8-1&keywords=the+hundred+dollar+startup

https://www.amazon.ca/4-Hour-Workwe...61102&sr=1-1&keywords=the+four+hour+work+week

 

[wkilleffer]

I also am nobody to give advice, but I did listen to my dear departed Ol' Fella long ago. He said: "A degree would be great but if you can also know how to use your hands, you'll never starve."

He wasn't wrong. I went from professional photographer (photojournalist) to car sales, to non-destructive test inspector of nuke-grade tubular steel products, to Certified Porsche-Audi Tech, A.S.E. certified, to publisher of a newspaper, to restoring older European automobiles, to now an independent I.T. consultant with half a dozen successful local businesses as clients. Turned 66 recently and am "officially" retired but will continue with the consulting work as long as I'm able. The "hands and mind" thing has worked well for me.

Can you not find a way to get yourself into an on-line course to get started with the watchmaking? Haven't looked but would think by now ~somebody~ would be offering some sort of on-line course, even if rudimentary. Toe-in-the-water kinda thing.

Good luck with the decision, be glad of one thing: you are not yet responsible for little ones!

There actually are a few online watchmaking courses. A place up in IL offers a correspondence program that appears to be based on the old Chicago Watchmaking School curriculum. They also have a brick-and-mortar facility that looks very impressive and woefully under-utilized. If I could just pull up stakes and make the move, it would totally be a place I considered going because of their instructors and access to all their tools. That's the downside to the correspondence program or an online offering. You have to buy the tools. Granted, even if I were just trying to do this as a high-end hobby, I would want to have all the tools. Heck, I want a lot of that stuff now! Sometimes the tools of the trade are just as much fun as the trade itself. But in order to go to the next level online or correspondence, you have to make that purchase, and it feels like jumping off a high rock into a lake that might be full of hidden dangerous logs waiting to impale you.

I'm also a *little* concerned that their program doesn't lead to a certification that is taken seriously. From the research I've done, WOSTEP is pretty much the crown jewel of that trade, and this country's now pretty much non-existent watch companies assisted with its development. But you just about have to go to Switzerland to make that happen. Rolex helped to develop SAWTA, and there are a few schools in the US that teach that, but none close to me. There's also the CW21 certification that's pretty much a written and skills exam that appears to be gaining respect.

In theory, I could just hang out a sign that said Watchmaker, do some advertising, and see what happened. But I'd likely either find myself in way too deep, or with way too much time on my hands. As a mechanic, you likely found that a lot of people attached significant meaning to the ASE Certification. We like things like that, and for good reason, even if we don't know exactly what it means.

Watchmaking isn't my only thought, it's just the preference if I could make it happen. I have other ideas, but seem to sense more roadblocks than open pathways to make something happen.

 

[catfood]

Things may be different on your side of the pond but I would avoid IT. I'm just the wrong side of my half century and have been working in IT all my working life (despite being an aeronautical engineer by degree). My point being most IT work is rapidly being outsourced to low cost economies and even from the inside its difficult to reskill as everyone want several years of experience in whatever tech you specialise in. Even if you study, pass exams and get good qualifications your age and lack of real world experience will count against you.

As others have said you have few ties. I would find a way to follow your dreams or you will regret it later.

 

[number6]

I learned clock making in my 40's. Apprenticed to a seated watch and clock maker. It takes a long time and unless you are very fortunate, little money to be made. There are only so many watches
you can repair in a week. Those who want to repair a family heirloom are shocked that it can run into the thousands and take several months. If you decide to become a watch maker, apprenticeship
is the only way I know how to do it. This is not something you can generally learn from a book. Most of the tools you use will be second hand. Watch material is avail, but generally not cheaply.
I did it because I love it, but I would hate to rely on it for a living. It helps to pick a specialty. I only deal with weight driven timepieces, none with strike mechanisms. Anyway, my two cents

 

[NutmegCT]

number6: I did it because I love it, but I would hate to rely on it for a living.

Words to remember.

 

[mikephillips]

With respect Steve I'd qualify what you're saying by noting it depends on what you do in IT. I've done mainframe DB2 and IMS support for close to 35 years now and on the tech side its difficult to find bodies. For example I'm turning 60 and am one of the youngest members of my team. Younger people all seem to want to develop the next great web app and become billionaires. Writing code can be an outsourced job, but the experience and knowledge that the tech guys have, well there just aren't enough to go around. I think I can work probably as long as I want to full time.

 

[wkilleffer]

Things may be different on your side of the pond but I would avoid IT. I'm just the wrong side of my half century and have been working in IT all my working life (despite being an aeronautical engineer by degree). My point being most IT work is rapidly being outsourced to low cost economies and even from the inside its difficult to reskill as everyone want several years of experience in whatever tech you specialise in. Even if you study, pass exams and get good qualifications your age and lack of real world experience will count against you.

As others have said you have few ties. I would find a way to follow your dreams or you will regret it later.

Hi Steve,

Mike brought up some interesting points. From my perspective, in this country, tech/IT can be one of those things where we do a bit of talking out of both sides of our mouth. Companies over here will lament the shortage of qualified workers and will ask permission to bring foreign workers in under guest worker visas. This sort of thing makes certain people really angry. And it sometimes appears that the same companies lamenting the shortage of domestic talent will be doing all they can to send that type of job offshore.

Now reality is likely much more complicated than that. If employers need the workers, they're going to do what they can to make sure the work gets done. Sending it offshore is just one option. Frankly, I think we do a poor job not only of educating student in fields where they could enter that career field, but we also do little in the way of sparking that area of their minds where they start thinking of what they might want to do once their compulsory education ends. We do a great job of convincing everyone that work in an office is where it's at and that the trades are dirty and dangerous. That, or we let everyone who plays a sport think they've got a shot at a career as a professional.

I'm not looking to make the next break thru phone app and a million bucks, though it would be nice if it happened. I'm just trying to add another skill set I can use to set myself apart and give myself a few other options. The reason something tech/IT related came to mind was because of prior interest, and also because it's something that could be learned/studied at the same time that I hold down my current job. Given that, am I thinking in a flawed way?

 

[George_H]

If you are really interested in watchmaking, I suggest joining the NAWCC and go to your local chapter meeting. Talk to some members and get some feedback. Most members are collectors and many do repair work.They also run a very good school in PA. I have done clock repair for many years and quite frankly, I could never make a living at it.

 

[wkilleffer]

If you are really interested in watchmaking, I suggest joining the NAWCC and go to your local chapter meeting. Talk to some members and get some feedback. Most members are collectors and many do repair work.They also run a very good school in PA. I have done clock repair for many years and quite frankly, I could never make a living at it.

I've been a member off and on for several years. Downside is that any chapter is a good two hours away by car. They have their regional in my city every Labor Day weekend, and I go visit. Met some nice people, including one who acted interested in having me do some cleanings for him. But nothing ever came of it. This might be best kept in hobby territory and make the effort to maybe boost it into sideline territory.

 

[DavidApp]

Hello William
I presume that in Watch/Clock repair you would be a one man band. Would you be comfortable doing the paperwork? Billing, selling your services etc. That was one area that I knew that I would not do well and that was a big reason that I never ventured out on my own.
Now retired I do a bit of consulting work and manage the paperwork but it is an add on to my retirement not my main living.
I found something I got a kick out of doing most days of the week so work was not so much of a task.

Good luck with your quest.
David

 

[wkilleffer]

I just thought of another idea. Granted it's not original, but seems doable: Delivery and assembly service for flatpack (IKEA) furniture. The nearest store is down in Atlanta, which is about two hours south of here. One has opened in Memphis, and there are rumors that one could open near Nashville. Either way, the store isn't here.
Buy a used box van with a lift, make a run down there twice a week on Monday and Wednesday. Plan to be gone all day those days. Gut feeling tells me those are likely to be the store's least crowded days. Other details would include whether to charge a markup on each item, or a percentage delivery fee, or both. How much to charge for assembly. Extra charge for same-day service, and extra charge for a Saturday run? Then there's how to effectively advertise etc. Someone did this out west using a used SUV and trailer that cost around $5k total, netted $30k the first year.

The whole tech/IT thing is rooted in that curiosity of how things work. It's what lead me to want to work on cars, and it's why I learned how to disassemble and reassemble a watch. Nothing wrong with wanting to put that curiosity to work. But being my own boss would have its perks, too.