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I'm frustrated. Each time I go to mount a part on my '61 Bugeye it seems that I need a fastener of a size I don't have. I have every manual known to mankind, but none shows the size fastener needed. For example, what size bolt is needed to mount the water pump? Is there some reference book I don't have that will give me this information? Home Depot and I are way too familiar with each other.
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Bolts, washers, nuts
- Thread starter bberwick
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Keoke is right, as usual. The Anderson/Moment Restoraton Guide contains a key to the factory service parts manual, which lists all bolt sizes, types and finishes. The problem with using bolts commonly available at Home Depot, local hardware stores, etc. is that the heads betray the fact that they are not original, factory bolts. Certainly it's not the most important part of a driver restoration, but it is a bit nagging to see an otherwise careful restoration sporting bolts that obviously came from NAPA. British Car Specialists does market a bolt hardware set advertised as similar to OEM. Does anyone have experience with this set?
anthony7777
Yoda
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keoke,if he doesnt have a bolt at all,what good is a thread guage going to do him?you need a factory parts manual and key.
anthony7777
Yoda
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talking nuts and bolts,i have an on going friendly debate as to whether the healeys rear shock bolts originaly came with a coller and not just fully threaded to the head,[no coller would account for egg shaped mount holes].and im also told none of the bolts on any healey ever had collers on them for any use.true or false.the rear shocks i just replace had collers and i replaced them as such with new.
Offline
[ QUOTE ]
talking nuts and bolts,i have an on going friendly debate as to whether the healeys rear shock bolts originaly came with a coller and not just fully threaded to the head,[no coller would account for egg shaped mount holes].and im also told none of the bolts on any healey ever had collers on them for any use.true or false.the rear shocks i just replace had collers and i replaced them as such with new.
[/ QUOTE ]
The parts book for the earlier Healeys, don't know about yours, show a HZS 0608 bolt for the rear shocks. This is a fully threaded "no coller" UNF hex screw that is 3/8" dia. X 1" long. HBZ would be a hex bolt with unthreaded shank.
Maybe later models had unthreaded shanks. If the bolts get loose so the shock moves, it really isn't going to make much difference whether the shank is smooth or threaded. The soft aluminum will pound out (displace) either way.
D
talking nuts and bolts,i have an on going friendly debate as to whether the healeys rear shock bolts originaly came with a coller and not just fully threaded to the head,[no coller would account for egg shaped mount holes].and im also told none of the bolts on any healey ever had collers on them for any use.true or false.the rear shocks i just replace had collers and i replaced them as such with new.
[/ QUOTE ]
The parts book for the earlier Healeys, don't know about yours, show a HZS 0608 bolt for the rear shocks. This is a fully threaded "no coller" UNF hex screw that is 3/8" dia. X 1" long. HBZ would be a hex bolt with unthreaded shank.
Maybe later models had unthreaded shanks. If the bolts get loose so the shock moves, it really isn't going to make much difference whether the shank is smooth or threaded. The soft aluminum will pound out (displace) either way.
D
Keoke
Great Pumpkin
Offline
[ QUOTE ]
keoke,if he doesnt have a bolt at all,what good is a thread guage going to do him?you need a factory parts manual and key.
[/ QUOTE ]
WOT ! Is the the hole that the water pump stud goes in missing too!---Keoke /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif An besides I already told him about that Parts Book thing. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/yesnod.gif
keoke,if he doesnt have a bolt at all,what good is a thread guage going to do him?you need a factory parts manual and key.
[/ QUOTE ]
WOT ! Is the the hole that the water pump stud goes in missing too!---Keoke /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif An besides I already told him about that Parts Book thing. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/yesnod.gif
GregW
Yoda
Offline
[ QUOTE ]
im also told none of the bolts on any healey ever had collers on them for any use.true or false.
[/ QUOTE ]
False, and I want you to unscrew everything until you find them. Actually there are 2 bolts on the bell housing to engine called alignment pins or something like that.
im also told none of the bolts on any healey ever had collers on them for any use.true or false.
[/ QUOTE ]
False, and I want you to unscrew everything until you find them. Actually there are 2 bolts on the bell housing to engine called alignment pins or something like that.
Keoke
Great Pumpkin
Offline
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
im also told none of the bolts on any healey ever had collers on them for any use.true or false.
[/ QUOTE ]
False, and I want you to unscrew everything until you find them. Actually there are 2 bolts on the bell housing to engine called alignment pins or something like that.
[/ QUOTE ] Well Greg, I think if you found collars or sleeves in the bell housing to engine alignment bolt holes it just may be that someone buggered the original holes and took the bell housing to a machinist who installed the collars to correct the hole size,location and subsequent alignment of the tranny to the engine.---Keoke ???
Note: "Bolt---dowel---clutch housing to rear plate-Type BMC AEC 3487"
[ QUOTE ]
im also told none of the bolts on any healey ever had collers on them for any use.true or false.
[/ QUOTE ]
False, and I want you to unscrew everything until you find them. Actually there are 2 bolts on the bell housing to engine called alignment pins or something like that.
[/ QUOTE ] Well Greg, I think if you found collars or sleeves in the bell housing to engine alignment bolt holes it just may be that someone buggered the original holes and took the bell housing to a machinist who installed the collars to correct the hole size,location and subsequent alignment of the tranny to the engine.---Keoke ???
Note: "Bolt---dowel---clutch housing to rear plate-Type BMC AEC 3487"
Offline
Hi Keoke,
I interpreted 7777's "collars" to be the smooth, non threaded bolt shank, as opposed to fully threaded.
Quote:
"rear shock bolts originaly came with a coller and not just fully threaded to the head"
-------------
Greg,
The gearbox side cover & brake pipe connector block appear to have HBN bolts also.
D
I interpreted 7777's "collars" to be the smooth, non threaded bolt shank, as opposed to fully threaded.
Quote:
"rear shock bolts originaly came with a coller and not just fully threaded to the head"
-------------
Greg,
The gearbox side cover & brake pipe connector block appear to have HBN bolts also.
D
Keoke
Great Pumpkin
Offline
OK Greg thats one interpretation I had not considered.Yes Dave, there are a number of the HB types in the cars. Acually the dowel bolts are to the HB configuration but are unique. Terminology ifin he had just said set pin we would ah knew what he meant.---Keoke /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif
anthony7777
Yoda
Offline
dave,thanks but your responses seam to be in conflict,do you mean to say earlier issues had fully thread bolts and sub.had collers[smoth section up to the bolt had]? the collered bolts are slightly thicker in diameter at the coller then the threaded section .IMO.this smoth section helps in straingth when sheer loads are present i.e rear shock mounts,the threaded bolt especially when loss will act like a seratted ginsu knife.keoke,when one purchases a 'bascket case'manny fasteners are missing,hens a thread gage is as usesfull as a snoose butten on a fire alarm!! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smirk.gif
anthony7777
Yoda
Offline
hay captain bob is that you?who do you know with a big black healey that does all his own work,and allows you to just sit in his garagge and watch while you drink all his boose? if that is you,i must tell all the other members here that you never get your hands dirty anyway!and that you know i have any fastener you may ever need , and if your ever in a pinch you are wellcomed to them.if you are not 'capt bob' [newbie]wellcome to our glorious sight anyway.anthony7777 1963 3000 mk.2 /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crazyeyes.gif
anthony7777
Yoda
Offline
greg, ive allready done just that many times over,im amazed at how pre.owners of some of these cars become very innovatitive when sellecting a replacement fastener,i once found a galvanised lag bolt holding on a front fender[probably once owned by keoke befor he got his 'thread guage'] /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/blush.gif
Sorry to disappoint, but Capt. Bob I ain't. I'm Teacher Bob who entered the money pit world of Bugeye restoration about 2 years ago. I've never done anything like this before, having a ball, and solving one little challenge after another. I count on folks such as yourself to keep me on the straight an narrow. Who'da thunk that a question about bolts could generate such chatter.
Offline
[ QUOTE ]
dave,thanks but your responses seam to be in conflict,do you mean to say earlier issues had fully thread bolts and sub.had collers[smoth section up to the bolt had]? the collered bolts are slightly thicker in diameter at the coller then the threaded section .IMO.this smoth section helps in straingth when sheer loads are present i.e rear shock mounts,the threaded bolt especially when loss will act like a seratted ginsu knife.
[/ QUOTE ]
Hi Anthony,
I said that the earlier models had fully threaded bolts (should have said capscrews) & I didn't know about the later models. From other responses, it looks like none of the models had smooth shank bolts. However, you are correct. The smooth shank bolts with larger diameter shanks would certainly be "some" improvement & I would use them even if not "original". As I said, they won't completely prevent damage if they get loose, but every little bit helps.
D
dave,thanks but your responses seam to be in conflict,do you mean to say earlier issues had fully thread bolts and sub.had collers[smoth section up to the bolt had]? the collered bolts are slightly thicker in diameter at the coller then the threaded section .IMO.this smoth section helps in straingth when sheer loads are present i.e rear shock mounts,the threaded bolt especially when loss will act like a seratted ginsu knife.
[/ QUOTE ]
Hi Anthony,
I said that the earlier models had fully threaded bolts (should have said capscrews) & I didn't know about the later models. From other responses, it looks like none of the models had smooth shank bolts. However, you are correct. The smooth shank bolts with larger diameter shanks would certainly be "some" improvement & I would use them even if not "original". As I said, they won't completely prevent damage if they get loose, but every little bit helps.
D
Offline
Hi Alec,
I agree.
With the widely varying backgrounds & geographics of the forum members, it's not surprising that confusion sometimes arises over terminology. Usually, the meaning can be interpreted from the context. Occasionally it leads to people discussing the same thing in different words, or worse, two different things in the same words. It usually gets straightened out eventually. Many people separated by a common language - which isn't really so common. For eg, I have never heard of "collars" = shanks on bolts, but obviously others have.
Really serious technical publications begin with a list of definitions & terminology descriptions. It takes up a lot of extra space & would not usually be needed in forum discussions.
D /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif
I agree.
With the widely varying backgrounds & geographics of the forum members, it's not surprising that confusion sometimes arises over terminology. Usually, the meaning can be interpreted from the context. Occasionally it leads to people discussing the same thing in different words, or worse, two different things in the same words. It usually gets straightened out eventually. Many people separated by a common language - which isn't really so common. For eg, I have never heard of "collars" = shanks on bolts, but obviously others have.
Really serious technical publications begin with a list of definitions & terminology descriptions. It takes up a lot of extra space & would not usually be needed in forum discussions.
D /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif
Keoke
Great Pumpkin
Offline
[ QUOTE ]
greg, ive allready done just that many times over,im amazed at how pre.owners of some of these cars become very innovatitive when sellecting a replacement fastener,i once found a galvanised lag bolt holding on a front fender[probably once owned by keoke befor he got his 'thread guage'] /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/blush.gif
[/ QUOTE ]
NOPE, not Keoke he only uses Stainless Steel ones. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif
greg, ive allready done just that many times over,im amazed at how pre.owners of some of these cars become very innovatitive when sellecting a replacement fastener,i once found a galvanised lag bolt holding on a front fender[probably once owned by keoke befor he got his 'thread guage'] /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/blush.gif
[/ QUOTE ]
NOPE, not Keoke he only uses Stainless Steel ones. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif