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Bob_Spidell
Yoda
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Not sure I understand the question but, yes, VR1 is a mineral oil (non-synthetic).
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3000 bj8 Oil Pump
- Thread starter James A
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Not sure I understand the question but, yes, VR1 is a mineral oil (non-synthetic).
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Hi James,
I assume by "mineral format and none." you mean mineral oil (conventional oil) or synthetic oil. Either is fine, go with the one that costs less. VR1 synthetic oil is available here, but is not common.
DerekJ
Luke Skywalker
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Mobil 1 10W-60 is the only fully synthetic oil they make (at least over here) that has the 'normal' ZDDP (or equivalent) levels that are 'expected' for older engines. That is around 1200 rather than 600-800 level to maintain emission standards. Whether this is actually necessary, who knows? We've discussed it to death. Synthetic oils are definitely better though, and the engine turns easier from cold with the 10W grade.
I can't honestly say I noticed any difference in oil pressure, maybe very slightly higher, definitely not lower but then it is a 60 weight at operating temperature.
I can't honestly say I noticed any difference in oil pressure, maybe very slightly higher, definitely not lower but then it is a 60 weight at operating temperature.
Healey Nut
Luke Skywalker
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Heres the way I look at .
Our cars were designed /built before synthetic oils were even dreamed of . All you had was mineral oil and it says in the book 20/50 . So if it was good enough then its good enough now if your still driving a stock engine .
Now if your driving your Healey in the great white north and snow etc (totally sacraligeous) then you may benefit from the easy flowing cold start ability of synthetic .
If all you do is good weather normal road driving then synthetic is wasted money IMHO . Oil changes are cheap , do it often and happy driving .
As for leaks ...... its not a leak its an automated rustproofing system .....find me a Healey that does not leak , weep & drip , its about how big and where said leaks are that I am more concerned about .
Our cars were designed /built before synthetic oils were even dreamed of . All you had was mineral oil and it says in the book 20/50 . So if it was good enough then its good enough now if your still driving a stock engine .
Now if your driving your Healey in the great white north and snow etc (totally sacraligeous) then you may benefit from the easy flowing cold start ability of synthetic .
If all you do is good weather normal road driving then synthetic is wasted money IMHO . Oil changes are cheap , do it often and happy driving .
As for leaks ...... its not a leak its an automated rustproofing system .....find me a Healey that does not leak , weep & drip , its about how big and where said leaks are that I am more concerned about .
davidb
Jedi Trainee
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I use standard Castrol GTX 20/50, and add small bottle of Eastwood ZDDP. Sadly, not a technical person like most of you folks, but haven't ever had a problem in 35 years of Healey ownership. Mind you I've only driven the beasts about six months of that entire time. Ha. Sort of.
I read somewhere that a synthetic oil change "strips" away whatever protective elements are in standard oil, whatever that means.
I read somewhere that a synthetic oil change "strips" away whatever protective elements are in standard oil, whatever that means.
RAC68
Darth Vader
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Hi James,
Although I would normally agree with the Healey Nut, on this I would state that the oils mentioned in the owner's manual differ from oils available today in formulations and additive packages. When my Healey was new, I used Esso 10W30 all year round. Today, I use Mobile 1 Synthetic 15W-50. Prior to switching to Mobile 1 Synthetic, I depended upon Valvoline Racing Synthetic 20W-50 VR1 and, to make its high retail price more affordable, I waited till the close of Racing Season to purchase the remaining stock from a local retailer.
Although the Racing Synthetic performed well, I find the Mobile 1 to give easier cold starts (15W rather then 20W), needs changing less frequently due to a more conventional additive package, and, although VR1 Racing contains a more generous quantity of ZDDP, this version of Mobile 1 contains a more then adequate level at 1000 PPMs.
James, based upon the ambient Summertime temperatures you provided (68F-77F), I would look for a synthetic oil having a viscosity profile of between (10-15)W-(40-50). Keep in mind that pressure represents resistance to flow and a higher pressure reading does not necessarily translate to better lubrication...only that the volume of oil delivered is greater then can pass through engines oil channels and just changing oils could give the gauge reading you feel more comfortable in having.
All the best,
Ray(64BJ8P1)
Although I would normally agree with the Healey Nut, on this I would state that the oils mentioned in the owner's manual differ from oils available today in formulations and additive packages. When my Healey was new, I used Esso 10W30 all year round. Today, I use Mobile 1 Synthetic 15W-50. Prior to switching to Mobile 1 Synthetic, I depended upon Valvoline Racing Synthetic 20W-50 VR1 and, to make its high retail price more affordable, I waited till the close of Racing Season to purchase the remaining stock from a local retailer.
Although the Racing Synthetic performed well, I find the Mobile 1 to give easier cold starts (15W rather then 20W), needs changing less frequently due to a more conventional additive package, and, although VR1 Racing contains a more generous quantity of ZDDP, this version of Mobile 1 contains a more then adequate level at 1000 PPMs.
James, based upon the ambient Summertime temperatures you provided (68F-77F), I would look for a synthetic oil having a viscosity profile of between (10-15)W-(40-50). Keep in mind that pressure represents resistance to flow and a higher pressure reading does not necessarily translate to better lubrication...only that the volume of oil delivered is greater then can pass through engines oil channels and just changing oils could give the gauge reading you feel more comfortable in having.
All the best,
Ray(64BJ8P1)
Hi and thanks for the reply!!
I have found the oil but there seems two different types at the same price, a black bottle (5L) that states valvoline racing vr1 20W 50 Mineral, and a silver bottle that states the same except for the word mineral.
Can you tell me which is right? It is 25%off this weekend so a quick answer would be great
))Thanks! Over half the price of what it is here
Still unsure if so should opt for the mineral version or synthetic!
Bob_Spidell
Yoda
Online
What follows is just my opinion. I'm not a lubrication engineer, and this is a complex--and controversial--subject. Spend some time here: https://bobistheoilguy.com/motor-oil-101/
Long story short: 'Synthetic*' motor oil is generally considered to be superior to mineral oil across-the-board (in particular, they don't thin out over time/mileage). However, there is a caveat to that: Syns are more appropriate for modern engines, and engines that are driven mostly on the highway on longer trips. The reason? Any oil will accumulate combustion byproducts--water and oxides of nitrogen in particular--over time. These mix and produce acidic compounds that will, well, they do what acids do: eat metal. More modern cars have a PCV system that does a reasonably good job of 'recycling' these byproducts and helps keep them from accumulating in the oil, but some will persist regardless. Healey engines don't--well, most don't; I've installed a PCV valve but it's not a 'system'--so some of whatever gets past the rings will end up in the oil. Since Healey sumps are vented to the atmosphere, you will get water condensing in the oil whether you drive the car or not, and your oil should be changed once/year or more. Because Healeys aren't typically used as daily drivers any more--most are used on day or overnight trips--you should change the oil every 3,000 miles or so or once/year; whichever comes first, whether you use synthetic or mineral oil. In other words, the oil change regimen is more important than which oil you use. Synthetics are most appropriate for modern cars with extended oil change intervals; they won't hurt in a Healey engine, but you're basically dumping money into the recycling barrel. FWIW, I put approx. 110K miles on my BJ8's engine using only mineral 20W-50, and there was essentially no wear on moving parts; the crank and rod journals are still stock diameter, and there was minimal wear on bearings. Some cam lobes and tappets were shot, but I think that's an issue with ZDDP. I take one or two long road trips--3-4K miles--a year, and a few long day/overnight trips. I usually don't even start it unless I plan to drive at least 20 miles or more at highway speeds.
I do use synthetic oil in my gearboxs/ODs and the differential. I tried Redline MT-90 in the gearbox, hoping to get a little quicker OD engagement, and felt shifting was a bit smoother; and since these oils don't get changed out very often I felt it was worth the extra money.
*The word 'synthetic' has been disabused of late. There are oils which are 'true synthetics,' being made with synthesized base stock--I forget the compound's chemical name, but I believe it's an olefin--and some use base stock that is just a highly refined mineral oil! IIRC, there was some lobbying done by some oil companies to be able to use the word 'synthetic' for oils that are actually just real good dino oil.
Long story short: 'Synthetic*' motor oil is generally considered to be superior to mineral oil across-the-board (in particular, they don't thin out over time/mileage). However, there is a caveat to that: Syns are more appropriate for modern engines, and engines that are driven mostly on the highway on longer trips. The reason? Any oil will accumulate combustion byproducts--water and oxides of nitrogen in particular--over time. These mix and produce acidic compounds that will, well, they do what acids do: eat metal. More modern cars have a PCV system that does a reasonably good job of 'recycling' these byproducts and helps keep them from accumulating in the oil, but some will persist regardless. Healey engines don't--well, most don't; I've installed a PCV valve but it's not a 'system'--so some of whatever gets past the rings will end up in the oil. Since Healey sumps are vented to the atmosphere, you will get water condensing in the oil whether you drive the car or not, and your oil should be changed once/year or more. Because Healeys aren't typically used as daily drivers any more--most are used on day or overnight trips--you should change the oil every 3,000 miles or so or once/year; whichever comes first, whether you use synthetic or mineral oil. In other words, the oil change regimen is more important than which oil you use. Synthetics are most appropriate for modern cars with extended oil change intervals; they won't hurt in a Healey engine, but you're basically dumping money into the recycling barrel. FWIW, I put approx. 110K miles on my BJ8's engine using only mineral 20W-50, and there was essentially no wear on moving parts; the crank and rod journals are still stock diameter, and there was minimal wear on bearings. Some cam lobes and tappets were shot, but I think that's an issue with ZDDP. I take one or two long road trips--3-4K miles--a year, and a few long day/overnight trips. I usually don't even start it unless I plan to drive at least 20 miles or more at highway speeds.
I do use synthetic oil in my gearboxs/ODs and the differential. I tried Redline MT-90 in the gearbox, hoping to get a little quicker OD engagement, and felt shifting was a bit smoother; and since these oils don't get changed out very often I felt it was worth the extra money.
*The word 'synthetic' has been disabused of late. There are oils which are 'true synthetics,' being made with synthesized base stock--I forget the compound's chemical name, but I believe it's an olefin--and some use base stock that is just a highly refined mineral oil! IIRC, there was some lobbying done by some oil companies to be able to use the word 'synthetic' for oils that are actually just real good dino oil.
Mobil 1 10W60 is a fully synthetic oil sold for racing and older engines. Two differently labelled containers and one type of oil. The properties required to protect racing engines are the same as those that prolong the life of old type engines.
There are Mobil 1 videos on YouTube dispelling old wives tales and reassuring owners that it's perfect for the likes of Healey's and also numerous "experts" propagating the opposite. It's exasperating and what you expect from the Internet.
Sadly Camshaft and Tappet wear is typical of older engines, so blaming a lack of ZDDP is probably misguided. All you can say with certainty is that fully synthetic oil will reduce this wear because it's quite a lot better than old mineral oil.
There are Mobil 1 videos on YouTube dispelling old wives tales and reassuring owners that it's perfect for the likes of Healey's and also numerous "experts" propagating the opposite. It's exasperating and what you expect from the Internet.
Sadly Camshaft and Tappet wear is typical of older engines, so blaming a lack of ZDDP is probably misguided. All you can say with certainty is that fully synthetic oil will reduce this wear because it's quite a lot better than old mineral oil.
Bob_Spidell
Yoda
Online
"Motor oil that is labeled for RACING ONLY is not usable for every day driving. Often these have more additives that are toxic to your catalytic converters and the environment. These oils generally do not have detergents. These are very important for your engine unless you plan on taking it apart every few weeks and cleaning every single surface. The oils do not meet the API / SAE requirements for ratings as SJ, SL or now SM." - From the link I posted above.
Mobil 10W-60 sounds like an excellent oil for Healey engines--if you can afford it--but I haven't seen it advertised in the US.
Mobil 10W-60 sounds like an excellent oil for Healey engines--if you can afford it--but I haven't seen it advertised in the US.
4tecdog
Jedi Hopeful
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Hi James seems you have opened a real oil can of worms, my thoughts are its safe to stick with mineral, I have seen what
synthetic oil and so called synthetic blend oils can do in a marine engine that is used for short and occasional runs. Condensation is the biggest problem and synthetic oils are more prone to destabilise and sludge when this is present.
synthetic oil and so called synthetic blend oils can do in a marine engine that is used for short and occasional runs. Condensation is the biggest problem and synthetic oils are more prone to destabilise and sludge when this is present.
Bob_Spidell
Yoda
Online
Wonder why DWR calls their vane pump 'High Capacity?'
Hi All, Thanks for your ongoing advice, I have learnt a lot already!
I think I will go for the valvoline racing VR1 20w-50 mineral oil.
In my search however I found Gulf Classic SAE 20-50
https://gasolin.no/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=24_75&products_id=12936
Any idea if this is the same, better or worse??
James
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No idea, it's not a US oil and the UK postings don't have any details on the additive package.
The vane pump originally fitted to the 100/6 was more efficient, especially at low revs, than the geared pump that replaced it because the drive shaft had a tendency to fail.
Later cars had a much much stronger oil pump drive shaft and you can use either and the vane type will probably give better oil pressure at lower revs. However a friend of mine compared two good pumps and didn't see much change.
Geared pumps are more prone to wear, which means a lower oil pressure, whereas the vane pump still gives good pressure when it's scored. My BJ8 engine has a vane pump.
The properties required for oil in racing engines are much the same as those for older, more highly stressed ones, hence Mobil selling the same oil for both jobs.
Bottom lime is that modern oils are better than the ones you could buy in the day, so don't get hung up on it. Synthetic oil is a lot better than old fashioned mineral and will better protect Camshaft and tappets, big ends in very high ambient temperatures and top piston rings because it doesn't dissolve in gasoline.
FWIW. P&A Wood the world heritage Rolls-Royce dealers (Rolls-Royce recommend fully synthetic oil for all their engines from day one - they say that after a rebuild it is so good you may never need another) have a WW1 Fighter plane with a rotary engine that works best with fully synthetic oil.
Later cars had a much much stronger oil pump drive shaft and you can use either and the vane type will probably give better oil pressure at lower revs. However a friend of mine compared two good pumps and didn't see much change.
Geared pumps are more prone to wear, which means a lower oil pressure, whereas the vane pump still gives good pressure when it's scored. My BJ8 engine has a vane pump.
The properties required for oil in racing engines are much the same as those for older, more highly stressed ones, hence Mobil selling the same oil for both jobs.
Bottom lime is that modern oils are better than the ones you could buy in the day, so don't get hung up on it. Synthetic oil is a lot better than old fashioned mineral and will better protect Camshaft and tappets, big ends in very high ambient temperatures and top piston rings because it doesn't dissolve in gasoline.
FWIW. P&A Wood the world heritage Rolls-Royce dealers (Rolls-Royce recommend fully synthetic oil for all their engines from day one - they say that after a rebuild it is so good you may never need another) have a WW1 Fighter plane with a rotary engine that works best with fully synthetic oil.