Horn and rear right indicator stopped working...head scratch imminent

[The Cone of Silence]

Finally got to use Ruby ('67 BJ8) as a wedding car for my mates and on leaving the church, noticed the horn not working. Disaster! Was also informed the right rear indicator had stopped working....as this was only repaired recently (a short) I was a bit surprised.

All other lights working as expected, including traffic indicators.

If the trafficator was the problem, wouldn't the front right have stopped too? Am I looking at two separate and coincidental electrical issues or could they be related?

Where's the best place to start checking, chaps?

Appreciate your thoughts and expertise as always...

Bobby

 

[rjc157]

I would check connections clean them up maybe the bulb is bad

 

[AH100M]

Don't forget to check the ground (earth) connections.

 

[steveg]

Another possibility, a friend had had a similar problem - a short had fried some wires inside the trafficator harness part way down the steering column. In his case, the horn would intermittently sound by itself.

 

[The Cone of Silence]

In his case, the horn would intermittently sound by itself.

While highly annoying, that'd also be amusing....and you could probably get away with in a Healey....just keep waving as if you know the other drivers.

Will check connections and hope I find the culprit re the indicator...but the horn worries me about having to take the trafficator apart; a job for which I haven't the required patience.

 

[rjc157]

Check to see if there is power going to the horn on the fuse box its the purple wire check the connection there

 

[steveg]

While highly annoying, that'd also be amusing....and you could probably get away with in a Healey....just keep waving as if you know the other drivers.

Will check connections and hope I find the culprit re the indicator...but the horn worries me about having to take the trafficator apart; a job for which I haven't the required patience.

It can be a little more serious than that - in my friend's case, the short had fried several adjacent wires inside the steering column.

New trafficator harnesses are available and pulling them is easy if you remove bullets 2 - 4, heat shrink the wires together and use the first bullet to attach a pulling wire.
see: https://www.pbase.com/stevegerow/image/128474252
and two following pictures

For comprehensive trafficator repair with lots of pictures, see:
https://www.healey6.com/Technical/Trafficator Repairs.pdf

 

[steveg]

Check to see if there is power going to the horn on the fuse box its the purple wire check the connection there

Since the horns are hot all the time, undo the single connector under the grille where the brown/black wire from the trafficator harness joins the hot purple/green wire from the horns. Test the horns by grounding the purple/green wire (honk ensues) or with a test lamp to ground. This will let you know if your connections are good up until just before the steering column. If the horns don't sound, you'll know your problem is in wiring or connections between the fusebox and trafficator harness. If you reconnect the trafficator harness and it's more iffy you'll know your problem is in that wiring or in the horn push.

 

[DerekJ]

The first and easiest thing to check for the horns is the fuse.

 

[GregW]

Since the horns are hot all the time, undo the single connector under the grille where the brown/black wire from the trafficator harness joins the hot purple/green wire from the horns.

I've never heard of a purple/green wire. On a '67, hot horn is purple, ground is purple/black. The brown/black wire from the trafficator is a ground wire, so doesn't connect to any hot wire in the harness.

 

[steveg]

I've never heard of a purple/green wire. On a '67, hot horn is purple, ground is purple/black. The brown/black wire from the trafficator is a ground wire, so doesn't connect to any hot wire in the harness.

I was reading the colors off the factory circuit diagram for the late BJ8. The point is to disconnect the wire which goes through the trafficator harness to the horn push and see if the horns work by grounding at the connector. That would indicate all the wiring and connections before the trafficator harness are good. Then one can proceed checking the trafficator harness.

The horns are in series on a hot wire; the horn push connects the very end of this to ground.

If the fuse turns out to be blown, there's a reason.

 

[GregW]

I was reading the colors off the factory circuit diagram for the late BJ8.

With respect, I'd recheck that.

The point is to disconnect the wire which goes through the trafficator harness to the horn push and see if the horns work by grounding at the connector. That would indicate all the wiring and connections before the trafficator harness are good.

I'm on board with that, though you could partially remove a purple/black wire from a horn and slip a grounded wire onto that without crawling under the car.

where the brown/black wire from the trafficator harness joins the hot purple/green wire from the horns

My main issue is calling the purple/green hot. Someone not familiar with the wiring might be temped to find a hot wire when they can't locate purple/green. Connecting to the solid purple would result in blowing the fuse (best case) or melting the harness.

The horns are in series on a hot wire; the horn push connects the very end of this to ground.

??? The horn is the load in the circuit. Everything on the opposite side of the fused wires from the horn is ground. The horn diaphragm is isolated from the horn's body, otherwise it would just sound until it burned out.

 

[steveg]

With respect, I'd recheck that.


I'm on board with that, though you could partially remove a purple/black wire from a horn and slip a grounded wire onto that without crawling under the car.

My main issue is calling the purple/green hot. Someone not familiar with the wiring might be temped to find a hot wire when they can't locate purple/green. Connecting to the solid purple would result in blowing the fuse (best case) or melting the harness.



??? The horn is the load in the circuit. Everything on the opposite side of the fused wires from the horn is ground. The horn diaphragm is isolated from the horn's body, otherwise it would just sound until it burned out.

Greg - You're right about it being purple/black - the small reduction in my Bentley manual is slightly blurred and at first looked like a 'G'. Grounding the horns at the point where the wire leaves the horns to go to the trafficator harness is easier than grounding at the harness connector. If the horns work faultlessly when grounded at the horns, then the problem is between there and the horn push.

I originally posted this because a friend had a short which fried the wires inside the trafficator harness. The original post in this thread mentions a short and the horn not working - two conditions similar to what happened to my friend, only in his case the horn would sound on it's own. I'm not saying this is the cause here, only that if the other culprits don't pan out this may be a direction in which to look.

 

[The Cone of Silence]

Thanks gentlemen,

It's a lovely and warm Sunday morning, I have a cup of tea and a test light. Garage beckons. Will try to find where the issue is and pray that it won't involve me taking the trafficator apart!

I'm very much obliged for your help and wisdom. Incidentally if anyone has a link to a colour BJ8 Wiring Diagram, that'd be splendid. Google searches are revealing all manner of other wiring diagrams but not the one I'm after.

Bobby

 

[GregW]

It used to be on this forum years ago. Let's see if I can re-load it here.

Well, the forum resized it much smaller. Let me know if you need larger and I can email it to you.

 

[The Cone of Silence]

FIXED!

Got Ruby up on the ramps and traced the green and white RH rear indicator wire back to the relay. Everything looked fine. Same with the fuses. Still, I thought I'd separate the bullet connectors and keep using the test light to see if there was power. Nada. Noticed that there were two green and white wires coming from the bulkhead with a double female bullet connector. Cleaned and replaced the male green and white bullet head that was coming from the back of the car and up through the engine bay and put it back in - PRESTO! Rear right indicator now working, an audible clicking and the horn started working again!

Still don't get why this affects the horn.....but there you go. Very happy to be leaving the steering column and trafficator alone.

The real winner is the test light. $10 (Australian) from Repco. Brilliant. Might get another one to live permanently in the Land Rover too!

As ever, thank you for taking the time to provide your insights.

GregW - legend - I'd love a larger copy if you don't mind sending one. Email is robert.warren@macquarie.com.

Much obliged,

Bobby

 

[GregW]

PRESTO! Rear right indicator now working, an audible clicking and the horn started working again!

Still don't get why this affects the horn.....but there you go.

LOL, good thing you didn't start on the horn problem.