TR2/3/3A 1961 TR3A won't start.

[RP3]

Hello,
I'm slowly piecing together a project car I received in boxes. I'm ready to see how the engine runs be it will not start, only backfires occasionally. I semi-rebuilt the carbs with new gaskets and seals from Moss, checked the compression (110-150 psi). I have a new wiring harness, plugs, wires, points and coil, set the points gapping, ignition timing per Macy's. Not sure where to go from here. Any suggestions and or constructive criticism would be welcomed.

Thanks,
RP3

 

[RichB4493]

Firing order correct? Is there fuel in the carb floats? Try filling the carb float bowls directly with fresh gas. If they work then you know which way to go in the problem solving. Make sure TDC is for the right stroke of cylinder 1. DIzzy could be 180 wrong.

 

[Rocky_LC]

You know the apicrophal story of George Holley and Henry Ford arguing when George delivered the first “iron pot” carburetor…

“Goshdarnit Henry – if I’ve told you once I’ve told you 1000 times, 90% of “carburetor problems” are caused by ignition issues!”

 

[auprichard]

Have you tried starter fluid? That would help distinguish fuel from electrical issues.
Check TDC is in fact TDC: if the crank pulley was ever taken apart it could be 60 degrees off
Check the distributor is not 180 off (as mentioned above): with the rotor pointing at #1, both valves should be closed
Check the intake manifold is securely mated to the head: there are a couple of guide pins which could be holding it up

 

[karls59tr]

Hello,
I'm slowly piecing together a project car I received in boxes. I'm ready to see how the engine runs be it will not start, only backfires occasionally. I semi-rebuilt the carbs with new gaskets and seals from Moss, checked the compression (110-150 psi). I have a new wiring harness, plugs, wires, points and coil, set the points gapping, ignition timing per Macy's. Not sure where to go from here. Any suggestions and or constructive criticism would be welcomed.

Thanks,
RP3

What are the four compression readings from front to back?

 

[bobhustead]

With 110 psi in one hole, it won't run worth snot and needs to come apart for a rebuild anyway. Likely distributor is in wrong position. Sooo. Replace the condenser (do not omit this). Put the crank pulley at TDC. Check to see that the rockers on #1 are both loose enough to wiggle by hand. This indicates TDC on compression stroke, where the spark bang should occur. If the rockers are tight (can't move em by hand), rotate the crank one full turn and check for loose rockers again. Once you have the engine at TDC compression stroke, open the dist cap and make sure the rotor is pointing generally to the plug wire that is connected to #1 spark plug. This is also, coincidentally, where the rotor should point appx. to the #1 plug hole. Then check that the plug wires are plugged into the dist cap so that, counterclockwise, the next wire is #3, then 4 and then 2. Make sure that the spring that pushes the points closed is insulated by two washers (one conical, one flat) from the dist plate and the stud that holds the spring and that the power wire and condenser wire are around the conical washer so they too are insulated from the subject stud but in contact with the spring. With all that done, the spark should be in about the right place (enough to run and not backfire). Try all that and let us know.
Bob

 

[sp53]

You will need to choke the engine? These cars are cold blooded cars. Are the 2 jets under the carbs pulled down a 1/4? if not, pull the jet down by hand 1/4 and stick a small spacer under the carb to hold the choke open then try starting. You will need to choke the engine after sitting like that.

Steve

 

[KVH]

Here are some thoughts. Folks have mentioned rotating the distributor 180 degrees in case someone dropped that in without first assuring the pistons/valves were at TDC of the compression stroke. By now you’ve checked that. You’ll never start if you’re on the wrong stroke.

Next, are you sure you’re getting current to the coil? Easy test with a voltmeter. That ignition wire is prone to fail. Whether heat, fiddling, making timing adjustments, whatever, that wire can be problematic. You say you have a new harness or wiring, but I’d still check that.

Also, are you sure you’re getting spark. While being careful, assuming you want to check, you can hold a plug wire 1/4 inch from a good ground while you crank the engine with the ignition on and see if you get a spark hopping the gap. Don’t use this old school test without first being sure the car in in neutral, out of gear, with brake on, and probably good to pinch off the fuel line. Shorts taps only on the key or solenoid button.

Is there a chance you shorted the points by not installing them properly with that round white nylon insulating piece. If the points are grounded out against that vertical holding bar (I’ve done it), you could crank forever and not start. By the same token, is there a chance the set screw slipped and you have no gap at all?

If your points and condenser are good and timing is right, and that still doesn’t do the job, maybe it’s a fuel problem, but someone mentioned your compression ratios. I believe 110 psi and quite low, and all 4 cylinders should be within a reasonable range of one another. Most likely, or hopefully, your issue is nothing that severe.

I assume no one recently removed and reinstalled the camshaft without carefully lining up the timing marks or doing it from scratch.

You have fuel in the float bowls? You set the mixture screws/nuts starting about 12 flats open? Your plugs need to be clean and properly gapped. You say you have new plugs. Have you checked they are correct? Champion, NGK? From Moss?

You mentioned timing per Macy’s. Does that mean you static timed with a bulb, so that the light goes on at TDC (4BTDC) as the points just start to open while rotating the distributor?

Good luck and let us know how it’s going.

 

[Brian_Jones]

With 110 psi in one hole, it won't run worth snot and needs to come apart for a rebuild anyway. Likely distributor is in wrong position. Sooo. Replace the condenser (do not omit this). Put the crank pulley at TDC. Check to see that the rockers on #1 are both loose enough to wiggle by hand. This indicates TDC on compression stroke, where the spark bang should occur. If the rockers are tight (can't move em by hand), rotate the crank one full turn and check for loose rockers again. Once you have the engine at TDC compression stroke, open the dist cap and make sure the rotor is pointing generally to the plug wire that is connected to #1 spark plug. This is also, coincidentally, where the rotor should point appx. to the #1 plug hole. Then check that the plug wires are plugged into the dist cap so that, counterclockwise, the next wire is #3, then 4 and then 2. Make sure that the spring that pushes the points closed is insulated by two washers (one conical, one flat) from the dist plate and the stud that holds the spring and that the power wire and condenser wire are around the conical washer so they too are insulated from the subject stud but in contact with the spring. With all that done, the spark should be in about the right place (enough to run and not backfire). Try all that and let us know.
Bob

For a car that has been 'in boxes' for a long time, possibly he has gummed rings in the low compression cylinder. Maybe getting it running will free the rings and bring up the compression. I'd try to see if that works before committing to a full rebuild.