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General Tech Engine Teardown on the Way

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TR3driver said:
Compression ring gaps should be 180 degrees, no?
Check the crosshatch on the cylinder walls. If the angle is too steep, it can cause the rings to turn on the piston.
https://www.brushresearch.com/engine-hone.php
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My sleeves almost look too shiny. Is that an issue? Fuel washed?

Also, I meant to point something else out. I put a dial gauge on my connecting rods. Manual spec allows up to .014 end float. My end float is .016. See below. Another came in at .019. What's the fix for that?

DialSetZero.JPG ConRodEndFloat.JPG
 
KVH said:
My sleeves almost look too shiny. Is that an issue? Fuel washed?

Also, I meant to point something else out. I put a dial gauge on my connecting rods. Manual spec allows up to .014 end float. My end float is .016. See below. Another came in at .019. What's the fix for that?

View attachment 46706 View attachment 46707
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I had to take the pan off my fresh motor the Po had rebuilt for a loud knock that was rod lock tab hitting the oil pan baffle.I plasti guaged some rods before I noticed the problem and also found one rod with excess side play at .019.
8k and no problems so far,so I would say run it.The fix is fit new wider rods or new crank.
As for your cylinders I think a few passes with a glaze breaker will show more than you can see before honing.,and if you don't have a bore mic you can use a ring to check for taper by checking gap top to bottom.
I would stay away from a ball hone.Use a flat stone flexible or ridged.
Tom
 
Rings spin while they run...so setting them opposite is only temporary. That's why 2 stroker rings are pinned to hold them. I am glad you found the problem and that the tear down was worthwhile. I am amazed it was the spacers.
 
Sometimes the collective knowledge & guesswork here arrives at exactly the right answer. I'm just glad it was conclusive and easily resolved (easily for someone who didn't have to pull the head or the pan).
 
If you reuse the rings you might want to have a look at how Hap Waldrop handled those spacers/expanders to prevent overlap.
 
Presumably you are using a ring expander tool for all the rings and not trying to fiddle them on with a screwdriver or bamboo skewer or what have you?
 
I finally got a good look at your pics on a bigger screen. Interesting...every composite oil ring I have dealt with has a red and a green end on the spacer. That way you can easily tell when they are correct. If you get overlap, then only red or only green shows. I can see where the spacers you have could be very easy to miss!
 
CJD said:
I finally got a good look at your pics on a bigger screen. Interesting...every composite oil ring I have dealt with has a red and a green end on the spacer. That way you can easily tell when they are correct. If you get overlap, then only red or only green shows. I can see where the spacers you have could be very easy to miss!
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Hastings rings spacers do not have colored ends....they can't overlap as easily if at all because they butt the same way Hap modified the Grant rings to stay butted.
 
I thought some where in this topic he said the ends were color coded, if so they weren't Hastings.
 
poolboy said:
I thought some where in this topic he said the ends were color coded, if so they weren't Hastings.
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From the prior thread on this problem...

KVH said:
...Are you referring by "center" as that funky oil control ring between the upper and lower band rings? I installed new County Pistons and Rings. Who offers a different kind of center control ring? I have a spare set of "Grant" rings, and those come with very specific instructions to avoid overlapping the ring ends. As I recall, the County ones aren't supposed to overlap either, and I believe I verified they weren't overlapping. I guess pulling a piston to verify isn't all that awful. Maybe next week. Beats watching the confirmation hearings.
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I figured I ask again......
You going to try to install that Grant spacer without 'modification' as per Hap Waldrop OR are you going to chance overlaping them ?
 
Sorry for the ignorance but I don't see what the problem is even with the pics. If someone can explain "scraper rings hopped into an overlap", does that mean the gaps or is the "sandwich" of rail/expander/rail becoming distorted? Thanks, Tim
 
TimK1955tr2 said:
Sorry for the ignorance but I don't see what the problem is even with the pics. If someone can explain "scraper rings hopped into an overlap", does that mean the gaps or is the "sandwich" of rail/expander/rail becoming distorted? Thanks, Tim
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The "oil ring" is actually three separate pieces, two very thin pieces shaped like ordinary rings (except for being so thin) and a split corrugated spacer that goes between then. The spacer needs to be large enough to support the thin rings where they drag on the cylinder walls.

I believe what happens is that if you overlap the corrugations, the spacer winds up being smaller diameter and wanders over to one side, leaving the thin rings on the other side unsupported where they drag on the cylinder walls. That lets them distort and run at an angle to the cylinder wall, which lets a much thicker film of oil get past. Still not very much oil for one stroke, but there are a whole lot of strokes in 1000 miles (roughly 3 million of them), so it doesn't take much per stroke. When the cylinder fires, most of the oil left clinging to the cylinder walls gets burned by the flame and goes out the tailpipe. The TR2-4 motor actually has a squirt hole in the connecting rod that sprays more oil onto the cylinder wall below the rings, so there is always more for the next stroke.

Ken, I couldn't find the link to Hap's mod just now. Perhaps you could repost it for Tim? As I recall, it made the issue much clearer (and my bad for not saving a link for future reference).
 
poolboy said:
I figured I ask again......
You going to try to install that Grant spacer without 'modification' as per Hap Waldrop OR are you going to chance overlaping them ?
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Yes im installing those Grant rings, color coded, but even then very carefully. What happens with an overlap is that the entire circumference of the ring shrinks and it distorts, and then oil is sucked by.
 
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