Where To Begin?

[60Bugeye]

Kind of long-ish post...

Now that I have the '60 Sprite in the garage, I am a bit unsure where to begin.

I have boxes of parts, some (I assume) that can be restored, many that cannot. I am also missing all 4 steel wheels + the spare (I do have 4 AH hub caps though!).

Some bags of nuts, bolts, fasteners, etc. are labeled, others are not.

There are a few rust issues on the lower part of the body, especially in the right and left rear corners of the floor, which is rusted through up to the place where the leaf springs mount. The front end of the driver's side rocker panel has a nice hole, and the inner rocker is also looking bad. The trunk floor also has a few areas of rust.

Thankfully, the bonnet appears to be rust-free.

The engine is a 1275 (I think) from a later Sprite, and it has a transmission bolted up to it. It sat covered in plastic outside in Sacramento, CA (relatively dry), but some water poured out the rear of the gear box when unloading it from the truck! The water was clear, and I was able to turn the motor over by hand this afternoon, so maybe it's fine.

I also have another transmission in pieces in the box, presumably the original transmission for the 948cc, which is--as I understand--rusting away behind a barn in Lodi, but I wasn't planning on using it anyway.

I have 4 SU carbs, all that appear to be 1 1/4 inch (is that right/good?).

I have the front and rear drums, but the (uninstalled) fronts look bad and I would really like to convert to discs in the front anyway (assuming that is possible).

So, my general question is this:

Is there a logical place to begin?

Should I first take the small stuff out of bags, clean them up, figure out exactly where they go (using diagrams, etc.), relabel and re-bag?

Or, should I start with the big stuff, like the body and engine?

Any suggestions for making an overall restoration plan?

I am an engineer (of the software variety), so I am accustomed to solving tough problems. I am also not afraid to learn new skills and get my hands dirty, but I don't want to screw up too many jobs that should REALLY be left to the pros. Then again, I want to limit the amount of cash I give away for things I could potentially do--and enjoy doing--myself.

What can a fairly handy, quick study reasonably expect to do solo? Body work? Engine rebuild?

Are there specific books that I should invest in?

As I get a handle on where and how to break this project into smaller sub-projects, I will be able to post more specific questions, but for now I am simply looking for some general guidance on where to begin sorting this all out.

Thanks!!

- Chris

 

[smaceng]

If it was me, I would try to get organized first. Take the parts you have and separate them by vehicle group. Like front suspension, rear suspension, engine, transmission, interior, dashboard, exterior chrome, etc. Use the diagrams on the Moss website to identify what you have, and what you don't have. Don't take stuff out of the bags unless you know what it is and can relabel it. Relabel bags if you can. Then get a system to put all like parts together, as an example, I used big plastic tubs, ones that stack together. At this stage, you will have a general itea what you have, what you have and may not be any good, and what you don't have. Plus when you need a certain part, it can hopefully be found.
The list of what you need can be used over time to figure out where you will buy it, how much it will cost, and to buy it. All this can take a lot of time. Decide what level of car you are going to build? A driver, modified racer, show car? this will dictate what type and quality of parts to buy.
When my total cost came to $10K, I thought I was almost done. Well now that I am 98% done, I have spent over double that. Just to make sure you don't have your rose colored glasses on!
After that, I would start on the body work. Buy a welder and learn how to use it. Maybe take a class. That is a start, Scott in CA

 

[60Bugeye]

Excellent advice, Scott.

After reading your restoration diary and talking to a friend who has restored several classic VWs, I am under no illusion that this is going to be a quick or inexpensive endeavor.

I do have a solid idea of what I want in the end; a solid, mostly stock, driver--weekend, pleasure driving that is.

Taking a welding class is an excellent idea!

 

[toysrrus]

Hi Chris,

I would do all of the above that Scott has mentioned.

In my opinion; You want a "SAFE" car; Right! That area where the 1/4 Eliptical Springs mount is critical. I`m sure you would`nt want the "Rear End" falling off the car on a nice Weekend jaunt in the hills or on some nice curvy back road!

So; Bottom Line is: Take care of the "Body Work" 1st; From a "Structural" standpoint. This probably will be the most "Time & Dollar" consuming portion of the "Re-Build". Then the "Drivetrain" & Then all the peripheral boxed parts.

Whatever you decide to do 1st; "HAVE FUN AT IT"!!

Best Wishes,

Russ

 

[JPSmit]

Added to that I would get a copy of these two books.
Bentley

and
Haynes

Plus a Moss Motors Catalogue (www.mossmotors.com) The advantage of the catalogue ASAP is that it has exploded parts digrams for reference.

They are simple and easy and we are happy to look at pics.

 

[Whitephrog]

I would have advised to photograph everything in place before it's removed from a variety of angles. From the pictures looks like that idea is moot.

That said, I agree with all the above. Get a Sharpie pen and a set of small plastic bags from someplace like Staples (three sizes of bags). Get couple of boxes of quart, gallon and extra large plastic bags from the supermarket.

The Moss-US catalog is a good source to identify parts. The Moss-Europe is much better. Larger, more detailed illustration and the use of the original BMC part numbers. In addition I would suggest that you find a BMC Service Parts List which is much more comprehensive than any vendors catalog.

Take the time to inventory and label everything first. Make a spreadsheet and enter each part as you place it in the large plastic tubs. Size wise buy plastic tubs only as large as you can comfortably lift when full of parts.

 

[60Bugeye]

Hi Chris,

I would do all of the above that Scott has mentioned.

In my opinion; You want a "SAFE" car; Right! That area where the 1/4 Eliptical Springs mount is critical. I`m sure you would`nt want the "Rear End" falling off the car on a nice Weekend jaunt in the hills or on some nice curvy back road!

So; Bottom Line is: Take care of the "Body Work" 1st; From a "Structural" standpoint. This probably will be the most "Time & Dollar" consuming portion of the "Re-Build". Then the "Drivetrain" & Then all the peripheral boxed parts.

Whatever you decide to do 1st; "HAVE FUN AT IT"!!

Best Wishes,

Russ

Thanks, Russ. I assumed the leaf spring mount area was going to be an issue.

Has anyone else here dealt with this, and if so, are there patch panels to replace the area around the mount, and/or mount parts to be had?

I know every car/job is different, but is there a common set of steps, things to replace in this case?

I have to think rust in this area is fairly common given the location and potential for water to pool on the interior.

 

[scoutll]

https://www.cardomain.com/ride/2203663

Chris,

Check out the link. Peter Plouf started with one a lot worse than yours and documented the entire rebuild. A lot of great pictures and experience there. He created a fantastic guide of what and what not to do. I would add it to my favorites page and use it regularly.

Bryan

 

[ichthos]

Scott, my wife's Bugeye is the first car I ever restored. I had to learn how to do everything myself, including welding. I would agree with all that has been stated already. Think about what you want as a final product before you start. I decided to go stock, mainly because as a beginner it was easier for me to work on it using work manuals. I started by stripping my car down to every last nut and bolt. If I had it to do over again, I would have done it differently. As Russ mentioned, you need to consider the fun factor. My car sat for years. Those are year I could have spent having fun driving the Bug. In retrospect, I would rather have put my car together, made sure it was working mechanically, and then taken it apart to work on the body. That way I would have had a little driving time in between restoring parts. And like was stated previously, take lots of pictures and keep things in labeled bags. Another piece of advice I would give is to check into repairing/restoring pieces before just going out to buy new ones. As Scott mentioned, a restoration can end up being very expensive. Forum members are great resources for this. I asked a lot of questions as a beginner, and everyone was always patient with me. Just my two cents.
Kevin

 

[RickB]

Looks like a really great project - have fun with it.
There will be times if you are like a lot of us when you will discover yourself heading for the car with a BIG FREAKING HAMMER in your hands.
Time to put the tools down and walk away.
Just step away from the car, have a beverage or two and start again another time.

About labeling things.

No one thinks at the beginning of a project that it might drag out to years or even be passed on to someone else.
None of us have a guarantee that tomorrow will come, also things happen that sometimes interrupt our plans.

My advice is to label things and pictures as though someone else will discover them years from now and be able to figure out just what they were and where those things fit.
So - good labels on the bags or boxes that will stand the test of time, preferably water proof. Don't just write on the bags - that does not last (don't ask me how I know). Document your pictures, sometimes I look at a picture of a part of a car and wonder why in the world I took it. An easy way to do this is on a site like Picasa web albums. You can write a blurb with each picture.

And remember to have fun. :laugh:

 

[drooartz]

I'll agree with the above. I took my radiator out for a rebuild, and it turned into a 3 year complete mechanical overhaul. I had lots of very frustrating periods.

Had I to do another resto, I'd try and do it one section at a time.

 

[60Bugeye]

https://www.cardomain.com/ride/2203663

Chris,

Check out the link. Peter Plouf started with one a lot worse than yours and documented the entire rebuild. A lot of great pictures and experience there. He created a fantastic guide of what and what not to do. I would add it to my favorites page and use it regularly.

Bryan

Fantastic! Thanks!

 

[60Bugeye]

I would have advised to photograph everything in place before it's removed from a variety of angles. From the pictures looks like that idea is moot.

That said, I agree with all the above. Get a Sharpie pen and a set of small plastic bags from someplace like Staples (three sizes of bags). Get couple of boxes of quart, gallon and extra large plastic bags from the supermarket.

The Moss-US catalog is a good source to identify parts. The Moss-Europe is much better. Larger, more detailed illustration and the use of the original BMC part numbers. In addition I would suggest that you find a BMC Service Parts List which is much more comprehensive than any vendors catalog.

Take the time to inventory and label everything first. Make a spreadsheet and enter each part as you place it in the large plastic tubs. Size wise buy plastic tubs only as large as you can comfortably lift when full of parts.

I'll order my catalogs today, thanks!

Spreadsheet idea is great. I have a current copy of Excel, so I'm set.

Also, I believe I have the parts list, and I have a handbook/service manual (see below). Both came with the car from my father-in-law.
[img:center]https://www.flickr.com/photos/castleberry/5166697075/[/img]

[img:center]https://www.flickr.com/photos/castleberry/5166697159/[/img]

 

[60Bugeye]

Looks like a really great project - have fun with it.
There will be times if you are like a lot of us when you will discover yourself heading for the car with a BIG FREAKING HAMMER in your hands.
Time to put the tools down and walk away.
Just step away from the car, have a beverage or two and start again another time.

About labeling things.

No one thinks at the beginning of a project that it might drag out to years or even be passed on to someone else.
None of us have a guarantee that tomorrow will come, also things happen that sometimes interrupt our plans.

My advice is to label things and pictures as though someone else will discover them years from now and be able to figure out just what they were and where those things fit.
So - good labels on the bags or boxes that will stand the test of time, preferably water proof. Don't just write on the bags - that does not last (don't ask me how I know). Document your pictures, sometimes I look at a picture of a part of a car and wonder why in the world I took it. An easy way to do this is on a site like Picasa web albums. You can write a blurb with each picture.

And remember to have fun. :laugh:

I just started a set on my Flickr account where I plan on posting pics of parts.

There are a couple of boxes of bags with some parts labeled, others either not labeled, or labeling is illegible. I'll use the service parts list and the forum to figure it out, and I plan on cleaning and attempting to restore everything that is practical to do.

And yes, fun is definitely in order. I already enjoy wrenching on my Rover, so the Bug will give me that much more to do!

 

[60Bugeye]

Looks like a really great project - have fun with it.
There will be times if you are like a lot of us when you will discover yourself heading for the car with a BIG FREAKING HAMMER in your hands.
Time to put the tools down and walk away.
Just step away from the car, have a beverage or two and start again another time.

About labeling things.

No one thinks at the beginning of a project that it might drag out to years or even be passed on to someone else.
None of us have a guarantee that tomorrow will come, also things happen that sometimes interrupt our plans.

My advice is to label things and pictures as though someone else will discover them years from now and be able to figure out just what they were and where those things fit.
So - good labels on the bags or boxes that will stand the test of time, preferably water proof. Don't just write on the bags - that does not last (don't ask me how I know). Document your pictures, sometimes I look at a picture of a part of a car and wonder why in the world I took it. An easy way to do this is on a site like Picasa web albums. You can write a blurb with each picture.

And remember to have fun. :laugh:

I just started a set on my Flickr account where I plan on posting pics of parts.

There are a couple of boxes of bags with some parts labeled, others either not labeled, or labeling is illegible. I'll use the service parts list and the forum to figure it out, and I plan on cleaning and attempting to restore everything that is practical to do.

And yes, fun is definitely in order. I already enjoy wrenching on my Rover, so the Bug will give me that much more to do!

And it is funny that you mention, "There will be times if you are like a lot of us when you will discover yourself heading for the car with a BIG FREAKING HAMMER in your hands."

My father-in-law included a BIG hammer with the deal (seriously). :wink:

 

[startech47]

We purchased my sons 79 Midget completely apart. He put the car together, which allowed us to determine what parts were missing and those that needed replacing. We than rebuilt the parts as we disassembled the car. This prevented the project from being abandoned part way through. When he thought about quitting we went to the basement and viewed all of the completed parts. It also taught him about working on the car making assembly easier with less damage. I recommend that you assemble the car as the first step.

 

[Silverghost]

Your next step is to go out and find a complete running 2nd car for a DRIVER. You'll use it to get parts, drive to support, er...club meetings, and for therapy when the restoration has you pulling your hair out...nothing like jumping in and going for a ride when those frozen exhaust studs refuse to budge!!

Then, when you're done with the restoration, you and your SO will have similar cars so you can go to events in His N' Hers!!

My "support" car is a 68 MGB...purchased for exactly what I said above. It's working out GREAT!!

 

[RickB]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:]My father-in-law included a BIG hammer with the deal (seriously).[/QUOTE]

Well there are times it's needed to actually do the job - that's not what I was talking about though, more like the times you start thinking about smashing it up into small enough packages that can be taken away on garbage day.

 

[60Bugeye]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:]My father-in-law included a BIG hammer with the deal (seriously).

Well there are times it's needed to actually do the job - that's not what I was talking about though, more like the times you start thinking about smashing it up into small enough packages that can be taken away on garbage day. [/QUOTE]

Yes, of course. I get it.

 

[jlaird]

I have four very nice orginal Bugeye wheels that need a home for a smalish fee and postage.

Oh yea. take pics of what you have and don't know what it is or understand, help is on the way, lol.

We love pics