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TR2/3/3A TR3 will not start

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Adrio

Jedi Knight
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Some weeks I should not have got out of bed. In an attempt to solve my TR4 back fire issue I transplanted all the ignition from my TR3 to the TR4 (dizzy, coil wires and plugs). The TR3 worked fine when I took them out and the parts worked fine in the TR4. Then when I put them all back in the TR3 I could not get the TR3 started.

I set the timing, the point gap etc. I must have missed something but can't figure it out. The car cranks but does not seem to fire at all. If I remove a plug and check it while I crank there is spark.

Is there some way I could have put this together wrong? I kept track (and have done this many times in the past). From what I can see I can't even put the dizzy in backwards if I try. I know there must be a "finger problem" that I am missing.

Winter is comming fast and I have two LBC that don't want to start so I can get them to storage. I should have stayed in bed!
 
The tab on the bottom of the dizzy shaft is offset, but there is enough play in it that it can be installed 180 out. Pull out the plugs, and turn the engine over by hand "hand crank if you have it" Until you've confirmed it's at TDC compression stroke on #1. Then see if the rotor is pointing to the right terminal on the cap.
Or pop the dizzy back out and look very close at the offset to be sure it's right.
Also double check the firing order (1342).
Good luck Guv'na
 
I'm with Banjo -- if you're getting spark, but the car isn't starting, I think you're 180 degrees off.
 
Thanks guys. I will give it one more try to confirm I am not 180 out. I tried to swap 180 last night and was not able, but I will give it an other try. Also your hand crank idea with my finger over the plug hole should confirm compression stroke on number one.
 
[ QUOTE ]
...I set the timing, the point gap etc...

[/ QUOTE ]

In case you're not aware... you want to set the gap first, then set the timing as any change in gap changes the timing.

Okay, that's probably not a problem that would give you a no-start. Have you tried a bit of starting fluid just to confirm it is not a fuel problem or a weak spark?

As suggested crank it to the timing mark and see if the rotor points to #1 plug... then confirm #1 is on the compression stroke. One way is to have your finger in the spark plug hole while someone hand cranks or turns the engine using the fan. Another way is to remove the valve cover and watch the rockers. To me it seems unlikely you could insert a dizzy 180 degrees off w/o having some problems bolting it up... but I'll confess I've never tried.
 
You are right as to the order of operation, and I did do it in the correct order. Also I did try the starter fluid and nothing. I am sure there is some stupid little thing that I knocked or did wrong and continue to do wrong repeatedly. Very frustraiting because I have had this car and have been driving it for 25 years. I must have replaced those parts a dozen times over the years and never had a problem. I am sure when I find what it is I will be beside myself for not seeing it right away.
 
Have you tried a little spritz of starter fluid, just to see if it might be a fuel problem?
If it tries to start on the fluid, you'll know that's it.
 
Yes I did try the either. No joy. It was running great before I removed the dizzy. Then the next day I put the dizzy back and no joy.
 
1) So if I read this thread correctly, you've got a strong spark on the plugs when removed and grounded.
2) Did you check on each plug wire or just from the coil to dist wire? if the latter then you may have a bad cap/rotor.
3) Assuming all that is correct and the spritz of ether (oops, too much) didn't blow the cylinder head off the studs /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/ooo.gif then all that's left is the ign timing.
4) So you've confirmed the rotor's pointing at #1 when TDC on compresion stroke, you may have the dist body turned too far advanced/retarded,
5) Try moving it around by approx 30deg increments by trial and error until you get it to at least fire roughly and fine tune from there..
 
How does the spark look? is it bright and almost blue, or dim and yellow?
I just wonder if it's too weak to fire. I'm kinda Stretching now.
I just wondered if maybe the coil is giving up,(dosen't seem likley if it was just fine, unless it got dropped or somthing) or if the connections are poor.
Check that little, flexible wire that runs from the points plate to the body of the dizzy. If that is loose or broke the points don't ground well
Sorry about my last post. I missed where you said you tried starting fluid. Duh!
 
Is the distributor rotor turning with the engine? Maybe you didn't install the dizzy fully home? Worht a check. Peter
 
Get 4 of your best friends.
Give them each a plug wire.
Give it a spin.....
See who still luvs ya! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crazyeyes.gif
Problem isolated.

ps don't really do this! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/ooo.gif
 
Is the rotor back in the distributor? In addition, once I had a similar problem and the little spring loaded carbon center conductor was missing. If you are not sure what I mean, look into the center of an off distributor cap and you will see a little carbon stick that touches the center of the rotor. You need that.

George
 
Update - TR3 will not start - Now it starts

Well, after a lot of head scratching, it did turn out to be a "finger" problem sort of. The spark plugs did not work. Outside the engine they seemed to work fine. Just in case I got a spark tester and found there was a great spark (about 3/4 inch). In the process the fellow who loaned me the tester suggested I use it on the coil so that there are four times as many sparks. When I did this with the plugs I found that many of the sparks were not jumping the spark gap but rather going down the ceramic pedistal. This was with all of the plugs. They were Champion.

I intalled new NGk plugs and it fired up just fine. I now wonder if the TR4 back fire I am having is the same problem. I bought all the plugs for both cars at the same time back then. Today the local store only had 4 NGK, but will get me an other four in the morning so I will know for sure then.
 
Re: Update - TR3 will not start - Now it starts

That sounds very strange.
What plug gap are you using?
Should be about 25 thou with stock points/coil ignition.
If the gap is too wide for the HT to ionize and jump then it will take a different route down the ceramic, particularly if there's oil/dirt or carbon on the surface.
 
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