Thoughts on model year...

[MadRiver]

Howdy all:

I believe that this is a topic that comes up from time to time. When thinking about a car's year, do you generally go with the year in which it was built or the model year (which is often hard to pick)? With my TR-250, that's easy. As I understand it, they were all referred to as model year 1968, and mine was built in '68. No brainer. However, my Tiger was build in September 64, my 3000 Mk I was built in November or December 1959, and my 3000 Mk III was built in December 1965. So, would the Tiger be a '65, the Mk I a '60 and the Mk III a '66? My MGC was built in November 1968. Model year '69?

Yes, clearly I'm bored at work today...

 

[RobT]

I'd go with "Model Year".

My Europa is a '74 model year built in mid 73, and the Lotus model number is "Type 74", so I think that, on more than one count, its fair to refer to it as a "74" no?

Also too much time on my hands today....

Rob.

 

[Andrew Mace]

...my Tiger was build in September 64, my 3000 Mk I was built in November or December 1959, and my 3000 Mk III was built in December 1965. So, would the Tiger be a '65, the Mk I a '60 and the Mk III a '66? My MGC was built in November 1968. Model year '69?...

Yeah, that's how I would view them! After all, would you have willingly bought a "brand new 1964" in December 1964? Probably not. No one wanted "last year's model" that late unless they were looking for big savings over the "new" model, right?

The situation arose in the UK in 1963 when the British number plates went to a suffix letter to identify the "year" of registration. When that started, the number plate year was Jan.-Dec., and people then tended to associate that with a model year (right or wrong). The system was changed in 1967 to Aug.-Jul., as I recall, because some people were upset about that "model year" perception of buying a brand-new Thrashwell-Snailby late in 1966 and having it be considered as a 1966 instead of a 1967.

It's really no different than the traditional US model year that still essentially begins around September. (In fact, even in the 1950s and 1960s, I believe that companies such as Standard-Triumph had mid-summer "production holidays" that more or less coincided with a new model year once production resumed. Granted, the changes were seldom as pronounced as the yearly US restyles, but....)

 

[MadRiver]

Andy -- you raise a great point. When did the use of the model year vs. production year come up? In other words, when you wandered into a Packard showroom in November 1930, were they pitching the cars as 1931 model years?

And of course, the interesting thing is the TR-250 and the MGC. Greenie and Abby were built within a week or so of one another in September 1968 (a fact that I love, given that they were direct competitors). So, Abby under the aforementioned logic would be a 1969 MGC, but Greenie is still clearly a 1968 TR-250, as there were no 1969 model year TR-250s.

 

[Roger]

I don't know about Packards, but we had an Austin Seven '32 saloon registered in December 1931, in England.

 

[Andrew Mace]

Andy -- you raise a great point. When did the use of the model year vs. production year come up? In other words, when you wandered into a Packard showroom in November 1930, were they pitching the cars as 1931 model years?

Good question, and I don't readily have any answer. I think it might have been similar back then, though. (Old magazine ads might help to confirm/deny that.)

And of course, the interesting thing is the TR-250 and the MGC. Greenie and Abby were built within a week or so of one another in September 1968 (a fact that I love, given that they were direct competitors). So, Abby under the aforementioned logic would be a 1969 MGC, but Greenie is still clearly a 1968 TR-250, as there were no 1969 model year TR-250s.

Yeah, but the rules changed, at least in the US, beginning with 1968 models, when cars had to begin to meet certain safety and/or emissions standards and "model years" became more important designators. Also, at that point, MG was going to get one more model year out of the MGC, while Triumph was working to begin production and sale of the TR6.

Perhaps even more interesting is the fact that there are some 1968 model year TR4As around, and those cars were still price-listed by Triumph in the US in the 1968 calendar year. Presumably these were all "leftover" cars appropriately retitled. But back then the safety and emissions laws stated something about "cars manufactured for sale on or after Jan. 1, 1968"; there were 1968 model year American cars built before Jan. 1, 1968, for example, that did not have the front outboard shoulder belts.

All rather confusing, I must admit! /bcforum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/grin.gif

 

[TR3driver]

To make life even more confusing, California also tracks "year first sold". Don't know if we have any left, but there were some emissions laws tied to YFS (for devices intended to be installed by new car dealers).

First car I bought here was a 67 Plymouth, and the dealer was supposed to disconnect the vacuum advance and connect a 'calibrated' vacuum leak in it's place; in theory to reduce both CO and NOx emissions.

 

[AltaKnight]

a 'calibrated' vacuum leak

As against the un-calibrated ones most of us have!

 

[drooartz]

My car (Bugeye Sprite) has 2 years -- year made and year titled. It was made in November 1959, titled in 1960. With the Sprite, at least, there really wasn't a notion of a "model year" since they just made changes as the new parts came online.

I tend to refer to the car as a 1959 Sprite, since that's when it was made. Either date is reasonable to use, I just like the 1959 year as a Bugeye is really a 50s design.

 

[skucera]

Some states, like Oregon, didn't used to care what year a car was actually built or what model year it was. They recorded whatever year the dealer selling a new car wrote on the form. My Spitfire Mk. 1 was built in late 1964, and was registered as a 1965. It was built as many of the Mk. 2's parts were being cut into production, but not all of them. It had the Mk. 2 turn signal lenses, but the Mk. 1 "Spitfire 4" badge and dashboard trim and controls. Whoever bought it new in Portland in 1965 probably didn't know or care that it wasn't what historians now would call a 1965 Spitfire... it was a new car to them and was registered accordingly.

This same phenomenon affects the registered year for Nash Metropolitans (some were registered as new 1960 and even 1961 cars), Edsels (I saw one at a Sunday cruise that was registered as a 1961), and 1984 De Loreans.

I've read that Carroll Shelby registered a few dozen Cobras as having been assembled in 1964 that were never actually assembled. The article said he will "finish" one of those every now and then for a really good charity cause. The end recipient ends up with a brand new "1964" Cobra.

Scott

 

[Andrew Mace]

No offense intended to anyone, but I've long been amused at some owners of very early US-spec. Spitfire 4s who INSIST that their cars are 1962 models. Fact is, the Spitfire wasn't even INTRODUCED into the US until January 1963, at which time there literally were only a couple of cars available (something about a shipping or dock strike). /bcforum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/wink.gif

 

[Brosky]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:] I've read that Carroll Shelby registered a few dozen Cobras as having been assembled in 1964 that were never actually assembled. The article said he will "finish" one of those every now and then for a really good charity cause. The end recipient ends up with a brand new "1964" Cobra.[/QUOTE]

Carl Tasca, one of the sons of Bob Tasca Sr., a legend in Ford sales and racing (Father of the Cobra Jet) and a good friend of Carroll Shelby's, has one of those "new" 1964 Cobras. I saw it last fall one night when I was having my car serviced. It's candy apple red with 2007 running gear and improvements and it looks fantastic.

Of course, Bob Sr. still has one of the very low number original 427 Cobras that travels in a trailer to and from his storage to one of his dealerships for shows. It's blue and perfect in every way.

Being a big part of Ford's racing history has it's benefits.

 

[mrv8q]

...because some people were upset about that "model year" perception of buying a brand-new Thrashwell-Snailby late in 1966 .....

I wonder if Moss will develop a turbocharger for the Thrashwell-Snailby; I know many owners have been anticipating it!

 

[Andrew Mace]

I wonder if Moss will develop a turbocharger for the Thrashwell-Snailby; I know many owners have been anticipating it!

The Moss R&D folk tell me that will come as soon as they're finished with one for the Rolls-Canardly*.

*I'm dating myself here; that's an obscure reference to an old Steve Allen joke about the car that Rolls down one hill and Canardly get up the other. /bcforum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/grin.gif

Hello...is this thing on? /bcforum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/whistle.gif

 

[Banjo]

And then you have todays model year standards.
this week, the last week of JANUARY 2008, our Toyota dealer took shipment of an 09 Corolla!!!!!! (all new body and engine)
I'm dead serious.
The 08 Land Cruisers, and Sequoias have only been out for a month or so.
Don't ask me... I'm expecting to see the 10s in May, and have 12s coming in my October... Jeesh.

 

[toysrrus]

Hi Folks,

Here in PA the only thing that counts is what is shown on the "TITLE".

Ex: I had a `61 Jag E-Type (Side Bonnet Lock), Titled as a `62. It seems that in the past; Cars got titled a given year when they were sold; Especially foreign cars.

To me; The date of mfg is what is most important. Hence, We pay a good $$$ for those "British Heritage Certificates".

Regards, Russ

PS: Banjo, Your right! New cars are (Have Been) coming out earlier and earlier ea. yr. Its like "X`mas" at the department stores. X`mas trees up for sale in July! Why not just leave them there yr round & offer a "Fire Sale" on them??

 

[swift6]

When I was reading up on the production history of English Fords, after I bought the Cortina I recently sold on again, I read about how the factories (this was Ford UK) would shut down in August for holiday. In September, when production resumed, they were building the next years cars so they would arrive in the showrooms just before the new year. The MKII Cortina that I had was built in November of 1967 but it is a 1968 model. The first few months though would often use up the surplus of parts left over from the 1967 models. Making parts buying for that particular car more like a scavenger hunt. As it was part 1967 and part 1968.