RUST!!!!!

[Guest]

After removing my transmission (finally getting overdrive!) I decided to tidy up under all my carpets and discovered much to my horror rust on the floorboards on both sides with multiple pinholes on driver's side. Needless to say I have gone into depression. I have so prided myself in having a rust-free roadster. (There really is no rust anywhere else - have been into every body panel in the car) Anyway, I wire-wheeled the rust away and treated it with rust oxidizing chemical. Floors are still solid, albeit perhaps thinner. Cutting out the floorpans is not an option. I plan on heavily coating the entire floor with a PPG epoxy coating
(similar to POR 15) that I have used before and is very durable, and seals extremely well. Any suggestions out there? Fiberglas? Pinholes ok? Valium for the depression? Seems constant washing and putting away over the years has left damp carpets that have taken their toll. Plan on leaving a small fan in the floorboard areas for air circulation from here on out to assure a drying effect. Need advice.

Bill

 

[Guest]

Also, I had lightly tacked the underlayment that came with the carpet set with spray adhesive and think this is part of the problem. What is a better underlayment or pad if you will, that can be removed with ease and checked for moisture in the future? Again, I am sick. Help.

Bill

 

[piman]

Hello Dr. Bill,
A good paint treatment is probably good for a few years, more if you regularly re-coat it.
I would suggest that the pin holes be welded or brazed up. I personally don't think that putting fibreglass over the panels will be effective.
Underlay is not normally attached in any way to the floor, it just lies there and the carpets should be secured with pop studs.

Valium, no, just get in the car and Drive it

Alec

 

[gjh2007]

I never installed my carpets permanently; on my original TR 250 I cut slot along the seat tracks in the carpets so I could pull them out. I used to leave the car out all the time & would just pull out the rugs if a period of rain approached. Watch the rug glued to the sills also; it will wick up the water!

I always loved vehicles that had snap in rugs, my '71 Saab had wool carpets that snapped right out. My '88 range Rover has velcro that hold the rugs in place. 1st thing I did when I got the Rangie was tear out the foam that was glued in on the floors.

I drive most of the summer with only the floor mat/rugs & generic rubber mats to catch the "stuff"

I even get wet floors on the Rover after a heavy rain; pull rugs, wipe with towel & leave open to dry.

Unless your doing concours, who cares?

 

[Guest]

POR 15 makes a floor repair kit that works well on pin holes. I wish all I had was pin holes

 

[vagt6]

Piman, I agree with you. The epoxy treatment may be a decent short-term solution, but replacing the rusty metal is optimal. I bought a '70 GT6 with moderately rusty pans, thought I could epoxy and forget them. I was told by at least 3 professional body repair guys to forget the epoxy, especially if I intended to keep the car for a few years or more. They all provide epoxy rust abatement & restoration services but won't guarantee the durability of epoxy work.

Since I intend to keep the car forever (don't we say that about all the LBCs we purchase?), I'm biting the bullet and replacing the pans, plus the outer and inner seals and seal supports. I'm also prepared to replace other stuff if more rust is found during the process.

I think it's also a safer solution.

 

[Bugeye58]

Pinholes? Those are actually "Timed release" drain holes, set to activate after a certain amount of moisture has been absorbed by the carpet. As the carpets absorb greater amounts of water, the drain holes enlarge to compensate for the additional moisture, until no further damage can possibly be done to the structure.
Gotta go, the men with the nets are here for me.
Jeff

 

[BOXoROCKS]

If done properly fiberglass is the best way, short of removing the floors and replacing with new. When my typer gets ready, I will be happy to go into more detail. In the mean time think of this, take a piece of metal, slitly rusty, coat with fiberglass resin and mat two coats, both sides. After it dries, bury it in the ground, dig it up 5 yrs from now, metal will still be slitly rusty as before. no more no less. Also resin and mat add strenght

 

[piman]

Hello BoR,

I'm not sure that is an applicable test? Parry Thomas's land speed record car, Babs, of the 30's (ish, I'm not too sure of the dates) crashed on Pendine sands killing the driver. The car was buried there and then on this beach (Salt etc) It was dug up (and rebuilt) some thirty or so years later. It had not rusted away to nothing.
However a car floor, with vibration, condensation etc I bet moisture would get trapped between the resin and the steel and corrosion would surely split the two and as the moisture has a harder time of evaporing would, I think, agravate matters.
Once you lay glass fibre and resin on the steel, there is no way of checking the steel. Regular repainting with a quality paint gets my vote if the original panels are retained.

Alec

 

[BOXoROCKS]

Hi Piman,
Lots of good points. But here are a few more of my reasons.
If he already has pin holes in his floors, the surrounding areas will be deeply pocked, and starting to be wafer thin. Flowing brass might help, but in the wafer thin areas great chance of blowing through. Not to mention, heat swelling and warping. Been there, done that. I have done my fiberglass procedure many times, if you thoroughly sand,clean and prep the floor,then put small, isolated patches over the pin holes and thin areas, let dry, sand smooth.I use mat, not cloth. It is much stronger. Then you cut another piece of mat, the exact size of the floor area, with a 3/4 in. rollup onto the sides of the floor. Here is how you start from scratch. Sand, clean, and degrease floor. Mix your fiberglass resin to directions, adding slightly more hardener than called for. Paint the patch areas with resin, lay mat patch, coat patch with more resin. Let dry thoroughly hard.A heat gun helps here. 36 grit sand, after hardens. Clean dust away. Cut full floor patch out of mat to fit contour of floor. Again, with a 3/4 rollup. Pull floor mat out. Coat bare floor with resin. Lay in mat, as you would with wallpaper. Press and pull out wrinkles and bubbles. Now apply a full coat of resin on all areas. You do not paint on the resin, you daub it on with a small, natural brisol brush. Until everything is absolutely saturated, and there are no air bubble gaps underneath. When all looks well, speed up the drying process with a heat gun, or hair dryer. By the way, immediately put your brush in laquer thinner or it will harden. Also, mix up more resin than you think you will need. Don't want to run out in the middle of the job. When resin is dry, thoroughly sand with 36 grit. Clean dust, then apply another coat.This all takes a couple days work. Once the steel is hermetically sealed, no air or water will get in. Fiberglass resin and mat is flexible, and will not crack, plus it also adds strength to the steel. I have done this many times, and I will guarantee the floors will still be there when the rest of the car has disappeared to dust.I am a believer in fiberglass, done properly. It got me and my 13 ft. Boston Whaler across the North Channel of Lake Huron,to Canada and back in five foot swells.Believe me, plenty of flex in my boat.If I can think of anything else, I will add more.

 

[Guest]

Hey Piman and Box,
Great advice, on both counts. My first TR6 had a fiberglas floor installed and the current owner (16 years later) says it's still there. I just checked with him. Wish I had remembered to call him earlier. I went ahead and did the PPG epoxy paint, two part mix. Coated the whole floor with one thick layer. That stuff don't come off! Guess I will just keep a sharp eye for moisture and have totally removeable carpets, like I should have had from the beginning. Even under the seat. Think I will rig someway to slip the under-seat piece out without removing said seats, as one of the previous posts suggested. So, too late for the glas, gotta stay with the repainting. The dissertation on laying the fiberglas was priceless! Piman, you done good too.
This forum is priceless..

Bill

 

[68v]

Fiberglass will work fine. Heck my 68 vette has fiberglass floor from front to back and my buns dont drag on the ground!!! So since your only fixing pin holes it should be fine! Just thought I'd add my 2 1/2 cents. By now you should have enough to get the fiberglass......heheeheh

 

[piman]

Hello BoR,

OK, I'll give in, however, as you say it has to be done properly. I would have new floors in place in half that time though.

Alec

 

[MGA Steve]

I noticed that every post fon this thread was from the eastern US or the UK. Just move to the "rust-free" Southwest, then you won't have to learn any of those skills!

 

[MDCanaday]

One more thought from a PDB that deals with this profesionally. New panels are best of course, but clean up the old ones first and think POR15. if the holes are fairly small they may seal off when treated. Larger holes can be welded if not too numerious.After POR15 has dried any remaining holes should be covered with windshield ureathane to smooth out the area and protect from further damages.Now get under the beast and treat the bottom with POR15(or equal). The reasons for ureathane???? 1 lasts forever.2 cant crack peal or even be removed by sandblasting. 3 will never be affected by moisture.
One thing, DONT get it on your hands, it is nearly impossible to remove and has to wear off.Spread it with a plastic spreader and then throw it away. This goes for the POR too, get it on you and they will call yoiu "spot" for quite a while!!!
MD(mad dog)

 

[philman]

Eastwood products has a rust encapsulator that is supposed to be as good if not better than por15 and comes in a spray can. A friend that has used both likes Eastwood's better because of the spray application. I used Eastwood's on the bottom of my floorpans (spray can application)

 

[Guest]

Mad Dog,
What exactly is windshield ureathane? Never heard of it.

I did the PPG brand 2-part epoxy (similar to POR15) and thought I would just cover said with carpet.

Bill