Is oil killing our cars? Part 3

[77_MG_Midget]

By: Keith Ansell, Foreign Parts Positively, Inc. (December 7, 2006)

Summation of what has been learned so far. First is that there is a problem, lack of ZDDP (Zinc DialkylDithioPhosphate) in modern oils kills at least our cams and tappets. There seems to be no known alternative. Second, our cars are a small percentage of the total market and BIG Corporate, the American Petroleum Institute and possibly government have made decisions that are detrimental to our cars. This problem isn't going away. Third, that many oil companies may have products that will continue to function well in our cars. Castrol, Redline, Valvoline, Mobil, Amsoil and others have now commented on my original article and are making suggestions. For some companies they are offering short lists of "acceptable" oils, others just one. One company has responded without any substantive information in a two-page "bulletin". By their account all their oils are superior and applicable. This is typical of most larger companies. Fourth, some oil manufacturers are pointing to metallurgy, blaming poorly built cams and followers. This may have some validity but the bottom line is that there has been a big increase in failures with products that have been on the market with identical products that are now having greatly increased failures. To me the bottom line is, if the lubricants are working there is no contact between surfaces, it shouldn't matter what the materials are, within reason. Fifth, on "modern" production cars, stay with the manufacturer's suggestions. For any car produced before about 1990 the owner needs to be aware that the suggested lubricant may have changed and may not be applicable. Flat tappet, stock, performance or modified may be affected. Sixth, Yes there is more! Directly from Castrol Engineering November,27, 2006 " Also, at this time we are not recommending use of heavy duty truck products due to different formula objectives between cars and trucks."

Now the important information: Oils that seem to be correct for our cars:
Castrol: Syntec 5W-40, Syntec 20W-50,
Grand Prix 4-Stroke Motorcycle oil in 10W-40 and 20W-50,
TWS Motorsport 10W-60*,
BMW Long Life 5W-30**= full synthetic, available only at BMW dealerships
Redline: 10W-30, 10W-40 (Synthetic oils)
Valvoline: VR-1 20W-50 (Conventional oil)
Amsoil: Unknown
Mobil: Mobil 1 5W30 and 20W-50 (Synthetic)

What are we going to do at Foreign Parts Positively has been difficult to determine but with few options left, the following is what we are forced to do. Some of our choices have been based on the manufacturer's willingness to help.

Break in: Delo 400 30WConventional oil:
Valvoline VR-1 20W-50Synthetic:
Redline 10W-30 in newer engines, 10W-40 on older engines.

Break-in is now 3,000 miles (using Delo 400 30W) beforec hanging to running oil. Oil change interval: 1 year or 18,000 miles with Redline synthetic 1 year or 2,500 miles with conventional oil (Valvoline VR-1 20W-50). Oil Filters: Correct Fram or Wix (Spin-0n), Felt in can type, changed with every oil change. We emphasize Correct as many oil filter manufacturers do no have proper backflow preventers, pressure bypasses or fine filter media. Thank you to Castrol, Redline, Christiansen Oil, Valvoline, Mobil and Amsoil for input. We're sure this subject will continue: Please forward any newinformation you may encounter. Keith M. Ansell Foreign Parts Positively, Inc 360-882-359

 

[jlaird]

Thank you for that John. Too late for Miss Agatha. She's already loaded up with Castrol 20-50. Shoot, 3000 mile run in. I'd be working on that years down the road.

 

[ALLAN]

Some of the charts that show the amount of zinc in the oil brands and weights have been conflicting, one chart says that Redline and Mobil 1 have no zinc. How do we know the oil recomended above is correct? I would like to see an up to date chart with all the oils and their zinc levels done by a reliable source and then decide what oil to run.

 

[RomanH]

There may still be appropriate oil that we can use in our flat tappet engines. It seems that certain Exxon Superflo oils are not API SM certified "Energy Conserving" and are only rated to the API SL standard.
This is from Exxon's site:
Superflo 10W-40, 20W-50, SAE 30 and SAE 40 viscosity grades meet API SL requirements.
Their web site does not list zinc content or ZDDP content but since it not rated to the newest standard might there be hope for it?

 

[Gearhead]

Keith/John PLEASE keep us updated on this subject as we all need this type of info to keep our LBC's on the road also any other oils on the list I've been using Valvolines high mileage oil any info on this oil Thanks again.Mark

 

[sparkydave]

Thanks for posting the info. I've been hearing lots of noise about modern oils, lack of ZDDP, and flat tappets from various sources, but getting conflicting info on what oil to use. Did Castrol actually say the Syntec grades are good, or are they just trying to sell Syntec? Previously, I had heard that Castrol GTX 20W-50 was fine, but the Castrol GTX 10W-30 was questionable. I asked around on BITOG to find out if GTX 10W-30 was really so bad since the car is already well broken in, and I change it once a year with less than 1000 miles on it. The response I got was that it would be fine, but now I wonder. I saw a friend's VW bus camshaft get pretty flattened, I wonder if he was a victim of the energy conserving oils?

 

[Hap Waldrop]

I know I'm starting to sound like a broken record, but it seems every month or so, another group discovers the oil/zinc issue and post something regarding this, so here goes again.


Most of what I read and a been told by buddies in Nascar, is the time to worry with a flat tappet motor is break in.
This is all kind of new on the car forums, but I've known about it for awhile. I break all engines in on Rotella 15/40. I would not recommend breaking a engine in on synthectic oils, been there, done that, the rings don't seat. After the engine is properly broke in any of the oil we came accustomed to using should be fine.

The other big issue with our cars is lifter and cam quality. Alot of the reground cams being offered are not hardened aand if some are the hardened ones are only parkerized, I would only use a nitrited reground cam or a billett and high quality lifter. I recommend APT billet or nitrited cams with their Rockwell 60 lifters, these may cost you a little more money but more than offset the expense of re-doing your engine.