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I really need to learn rust

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M

mightymidget

Jedi Knight
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I hit the search button for rust and I think about every thread posted came up. I have surface rust and pitted rust, I have rust throughs, I have rust in places where panels are put together, So I think I have about any kinda of rust you want to talk about. I need some talk from the experience maybe some old threads I can research.

Or maybe a good book on the subject. Just need the basic steps on how to attack rust (most of it is inside the car)properly. I paln on keeping this car so I don't want to worry about rust returning later.

this is example of what I call surface rust (lower rear at gas tank)

also is it pretty simple to strip the body then have it soaked, or is it a night mare. trying to find all the different fastners and such
 
I have to ask... are you more interested in enjoying the car, or in working in the garage, getting very dirty, spending a LOT of money and driving very little? Is this particular car emotionally significant?

Do you have a large, heated, vacant garage? A compressor? A welder? Lots of tools? Lots of spare time? A forgiving wife?

In my experience (and I'm sure others will agree) it's always much more expensive to restore a car than it is to save & buy the condition you want. Ten times more so if you factor in your own time, which you never can! :wink:

There are *lots* of Spridgets out there. If you want to learn how to restore cars, then by all means, get some books, ask a bunch of questions... everyone on here is super. (Have a look at the VW thread in my signature, and you'll see where I'm coming from!)

But if your real interest is in putting the top down and blasting down a back road? I would give serious thought to looking for a car that's already in the condition you want.
 
Stripped shell into heavy PVC frame/plastic "pool" with washing soda, long stainless rod electrodes and a battery charger should do it. Skim off the scum now and then and move the electrode around as needed.

I've done this in a plastic storage tub big enough to submerge half a Morris Minor front grill, in various buckets and tubs with dozens of rusty parts and it worked great. Rinse, dry and primer right away.

I've never had to try this on a whole car, but if you're nuts enough to try, be sure to post pictures!!

Glen Byrns
 
tosoutherncars said:
I have to ask... are you more interested in enjoying the car, or in working in the garage, getting very dirty, spending a LOT of money and driving very little? Is this particular car emotionally significant?

Do you have a large, heated, vacant garage? A compressor? A welder? Lots of tools? Lots of spare time? A forgiving wife?

In my experience (and I'm sure others will agree) it's always much more expensive to restore a car than it is to save & buy the condition you want. Ten times more so if you factor in your own time, which you never can! :wink:

There are *lots* of Spridgets out there. If you want to learn how to restore cars, then by all means, get some books, ask a bunch of questions... everyone on here is super. (Have a look at the VW thread in my signature, and you'll see where I'm coming from!)

But if your real interest is in putting the top down and blasting down a back road? I would give serious thought to looking for a car that's already in the condition you want.
Click to expand...
This is wise advice and I wish I would follow it but I never do. I always rescue a vehicle from the grave and have much more time and money in it at the end, than buying one in good shape. The only plus to that is that you know what is in there and where the problems are and you can make it like you want it to be.
 
In response to Duncan's post,

I know exactly what you are talking about. went through that with a 440-6 Cuda years ago. End results was selling before completion.

Basicaly what I am asking is for leadership I guess on how to most effectively to treat the different rust I have on this car, It has been butchered up to bad to be a show car or a total restoration job. but I still like to do things once, right.Just want to know what works best at stopping the rust, and then what process to use so it never returns.

So I was hoping that what other people have been able to do in there shops themselves could be discussed here.

I live in South Carolina, have a decent size unheated shop, know basic mechanics,light body work, and use to be a professional automotive painter. I also own a small mig welder among other standard tools. I just finished a redo of 88 GT convertible (no rust) that took 18 months. So I am patient

I do want to get the car on the road but not until I have gotten the body solid, plus like most, my income is way down. So I figure I can do alot of my own labor right now getting body "up to snuff" since extra money is non-existant now. I really didn't have the money to purchase this car, but I could not let myself lose the change of buying it. I have been looking for one I could afford for many years
 
Surface rust is no problem at all to fix (if, in fact, it's <span style="text-decoration: underline">only</span> surface rust - rusted-through panels are whole 'nuther level). If fact, if you're a mentally warped LBC lover like me, it can actually be sorta fun. :crazyeyes:

Go to the store and buy some wire wheel brush attachments for your drill; some Simple Green or similar (environmentally-friendly) degreaser/cleaner; a paint primer or rust inhibitor; some color-matched spray paint (your local automotive paint store will mix it for you), and be sure to buy and USE PPE (personal protective equipment) such as gloves, safety goggles, and an appropriate breathing respirator while you're painting and sanding.

First, carefully clean/degrease the surface. Then use the wire wheel attachment on your electric drill (or similar tool) to remove the heavy surface rust. OR, if the rust is light simply sand it off with an abrasive such as steel wool or sandpaper.

Again thoroughly clean the de-rusted surface with a specific cleaner (find at your auto paint store or Eastwood website), dry it completely, and prime it. Then, paint.

That's it. In the meantime, go to the Eastwood website or Google the subject and educate yourself a bit to make the work easier.

My process, above, is a bit over-simplified, but it gives you the overall picture. Anyone can do it.

And, the results can be spectacular. :thumbsup:

No biggie, surface rust removal. :smile:
 
What you have there is NOT surface rust it is rust through that is bubbling through a respray. Unless my eyes are deceiving me, you also will need a new floor pan. If you just want to enjoy the car, then start cutting and patching with sheet metal pounded out to give an approximate shape. Then sling some filler on it and sand it down flat and respray. again... over simplified, but do not get stuck in the mentality that you need to replace entire "expensive" panels. Just cut a couple inches beyond the rust through and keep working.
 
I will probably concentrate on surface rust first,till I get a good work process going then build up to the more indepth rust. I understand what VAGT6 is talking about I have done that on smaller scale. So basicaly just clean out old rust with wire brush till metal shines. then find proper solution to treat bare metal, follow up with metal air sprayed sealer, prime , sand then paint.

What about areas where floor pan and wing meet, there is a valley that a wire brush will not be able to clean out, I did look at Eastwoods quickly last night and notice a aersol spray that claims to stop rust in hard to reach spots,(actually on sale) will this product penertrate and seal off oxygen to rust will stop? so I can seal and spray paint

If I could confortably take care of this rust I was thinking of auto body drip rail chalk to fill up these vallleys. Is it safe to say the inside of the trunk sweats and water runs down sides of body causing rust on the inside like this?
 
Take a closer look at what you are calling "surface rust". Give it a good jab with a screwdriver. I'd bet money that the screwdriver punctures the car. It is rusted through. I'm not trying to over complicate things, but I would hate to see you spend money trying to stop "surface rust" that is actually just rust (no metal).
 
Yes some of those areas you see are real rust. The far right side of trunk is really bad where it meets the wing(photo) the other side is just surface rust and the floor is 95% solid. the right rear is rust through and area near gas tank in the other photo is probably rust through on valance. but there are many areas of the car body that are surface rust as in left inside wing, under dash, trunk floor and etc.

I want to go ahead and take care of the easy stuff and learn how wnd what works as I disasemble interior parts. I just want to fix it so I do not need to worry my car is rusting away in my garage after I get it together.
 
I assume the bead that runs along the top of the wings is some sort of gasket, rubber?. that is placed there during assembly of vehicle. can you reamove the outside half of wing to recondition then reinstall?
 
That bead is metal and should remain, most of us prefer the look. My cohort in crime says there is no money in rust. It needs to be removed or stopped from spreading. I chemically removed all the paint from my car exposing the parts that had to go. There is no sense in painting over rust as it will be ther like a bad cold. Eastwood makes a nice product called Encapsulator which sprays on real nice. The also make an etch and neutralizer that will take care of some surface rust but a wire brush on a grinder will really give you what you want unless you have a blaster.

Have fun, hours of fun

Mark
 
Yes I don't have a problem with bead and kinda of like it.

I was just online looking at the Rust converter Kits they have at Eastwood.
After the rust converted application they recomend the encpsulator, then a paint for best performance. so seems this is a good way of treating rust for long term.

I was about ready to order a kit to do the inside of my trunk. A good place out of view to experiment. Once this treatment is done will I be able to go in later and weld in patch panels where metal has been treated ?

If I order the 1 gallon will it be able to be used over 6 month times once opened. Or should I just get quart kit. not really sure yet how much or how far it goes.
 
mightymidget said:
I will probably concentrate on surface rust first,till I get a good work process going then build up to the more indepth rust. (...) What about areas where floor pan and wing meet, there is a valley that a wire brush will not be able to clean out, I did look at Eastwoods quickly last night and notice a aersol spray that claims to stop rust in hard to reach spots,(actually on sale) will this product penertrate and seal off oxygen to rust will stop? so I can seal and spray paint

If I could confortably take care of this rust I was thinking of auto body drip rail chalk to fill up these vallleys. Is it safe to say the inside of the trunk sweats and water runs down sides of body causing rust on the inside like this?
Click to expand...

Well, you sound pretty well-prepared to tackle a project!

You're referring to the pinch weld where the floor meets the inner rocker? How extensive is the rust? Your idea of acid might work for a while, but if the back side of those two panels has already started to rust, it's definitely coming back in a year or two!

It is possible to cut out just just a small strip of floor along that joint, and clean as you go. MIG in a new piece, prime and paint. And yes, joint sealer is a good idea there once everything underneath is 100% clean. 3M makes a nice version, and I use Eastwood's version which I find quite good.

If you can find a magasine shop in your area that sells Practical Classics (UK car mag) one of their editors has been doing similar work on a chrome-bumper Midget for the last couple of months. If you can't find back-issues, shoot me an email and I'll photocopy the previous months for you.
 
Thanks Duncan, the area I was concerned about is where trunk floor turns down and rear wing is attached by spot weld. the area behind tire. It forms a small valley that trash and debris can gather and I am sure have rust I can not see.
 
mightymidget said:
Thanks Duncan, the area I was concerned about is where trunk floor turns down and rear wing is attached by spot weld. the area behind tire. It forms a small valley that trash and debris can gather and I am sure have rust I can not see.
Click to expand...
I had good luck with por15. I used it in the places I could not get too and the places that I thought rust might be likely to try and get in later. Its thin like kerosene when you applt it and it soaks in good in the rust and when dry is hard as a rock and can only be removed with grinding or sanding. I removed all the rust from my floor pans and welded patches of 11 gauge metal over any holes and then cleaned it all up and coated the entire floor with por15 and then before it dried coated the whole floor with liquid truck bed liner. I don't think I will have any more floor rust problems even if it gets wet in there.
Where do you live in SC, mightymidget?
 
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