Front wheel question?

[Tinster]

It kinda scared me when the Crypt Car's rear wheel
and hub assembly became unattached from the car,
while driving.

I have attempted almost nothing on the front suspension
since it was a low priority for a dead car. After the rear
wheel episode, I think I better replace the front suspension
before I attempt to drive the " Beast from heck" again.

The Moss diagram totally confuses me. What part(s) holds the
front wheels onto the car so they do not fly off while
driving? I think this is a good place to start replacing
pieces to get the car streetable again.

Can someone knowledgeable tell me where to start replacing
the front suspension system? Keeping the wheels on the car
and safety are my first concern. Smoothness of ride not important at this time.

Thanks as always,

d /bcforum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/thankyousign.gif

 

[Guest]

Dale, taking down the front suspension is fairly straight forward, however, DO NOT follow the Bentley manual when they tell you to remove the front spring using only a floor jack. It is imperative that you use the threaded rod spring compressor that you can either buy already made up (50 bucks) or make one. Easier to buy one, they are well made. Taking this spring out without the compressor tool is suicide.

 

[Tinster]

Thanks for the tip Bill,

I had that one figured when the four new coil
springs arrived and I felt the compression power
of the rears. I have concepted a compression tool
I can make myself but will probably purchase the
Moss tool.

Thanks as always. One day in the future, this "parts car"
DPO Pedro sold Wendy will be a REAL car able to drive
down the streets safely and reliably.

d

 

[John_Mc]

Hey Dale
I'm in the final throes of reassembling my front suspension. As Bill says, it's pretty straightforward. My goal was to replace all the bushings to improve the ride. Since my tires haven't fallen off in 25K miles, I figured I didn't need to worry too much about that...yet. In the moss diagram the wheel hub fits over the stub axle (No. 50) which is fastened through the vertical link (No. 20). There's a castellated or nyloc nut on the back side that holds the stub axle into the vertical link, but I did not remove the stub axle from the link to know exactly how it goes together. Here's a semi-reassembled picture:

I have found this to be a fun and satisfying project, although I'm very ready to have it back together.

 

[DrEntropy]

you're already so close to that ~I~ can smell it clear over here. If you just put the front-end up in the air and give it a good inspection first, maybe it's not as awful as you think. You may only need to repack or replace the front bearings 'n seals. I wouldn't start looking for stuff to replace unless it needs replacing. /bcforum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/wink.gif

Dave drove it, if there was a serious front-end problem he'd have felt it, most likely.

 

[RobT]

Dale:

Although I've heard more than one story of rear wheels coming astray and trying to over-take their parent vehicle, I've never heard of the front end being a problem. Which is just as well, much worse to loose a front wheel. The only week spot seems to be where the lower wishbones attach to the frame. These can rust out and fail pretty dramatically. If a wheel bearing goes, it will typically make a lot of noise, rumbles, then will (eventually) seize, jerking the car violently to one side. Not pretty either. Trunions and ball joints will make the steering wheel wiggle and squirm a lot, particularly at speed. DON"T PANIC though - in general you should get a lot of warning before something unpleasant happens up-front, unlike the rear hubs that can go walkabout without notice (as you have already discovered I'm afraid).

Rebuilding the front suspension is pretty straight forward – nothing like those #!%$ rear T/A bushes to deal with! As others have said, a spring de-compressor is essential. Other than that, its just a lot of nuts and bolts. Mind keep track of which wishbone arm goes in front - the front and rear arms are different lengths, but this is not obvious. Another thing they don't tell you in the book is the felt sided washer on the hub goes felt side AWAY from the wheel bearing. You'll see what I mean when you get there - took me a while to figure that one out.

Good luck, and have fun (yeah right!)

Rob.

 

[14dna]

Dale
Paul is gonna tell you the same thing, so here goes. Put the backend together and drive that baby like ya stole it!!!
I never felt anything in the front that would concern me. Besides, until you get it working again, you'll never know how it is. Do 1 job at a time, are you tryin' to make an old mechanic look lazy?
Dave

 

[RonMacPherson]

Jack the front of the car up, rock each front wheel, left to right and up and down, feel where you have movement. If it's just slight in one direction, not both, see if you can see where the movement is(tie rod end-steering rack) upper ball joint, lower trunnion, or wheel rocking on the axle. Pop off the bearing caps, use a chisel and small hammer and work your way around the cap slowly(or use a professional tool repair cap remover) undo the nut on the end of the axle, rock the wheel and the outer bearing should fall out in your hand, pull the wheel out and you'll see the original felt seal left on the hub, the inner bearing will be on the stub axle or still in the wheel inner race. Take the bearings and seal to a bearing supply house and get uprated Timken bearings(they have more rollers than the original 6's and replace the seal with an updated modern Chicago Rawhide or National rubber seal, remove the old races(a drift with hammer) install the new races and pack the bearings and reassemble. Or take the spindles to a shop where they can remove and reinstall the races.

 

[Guest]

Take the bearings and seal to a bearing supply house and get uprated Timken bearings(they have more rollers than the original 6's and replace the seal with an updated modern Chicago Rawhide or National rubber seal, remove the old races(a drift with hammer) install the new races and pack the bearings and reassemble. Or take the spindles to a shop where they can remove and reinstall the races.

TRF sells the whole sheebang as a kit, but I kinda think that the Timkens are now made in China. I am serious.....

 

[Tinster]

Thanks one and all, you've been a great deal of help.
I think I'm pointed in the right direction.

John, fantastic photo to help me figure things out.
Your photo also caught me eye in that I probably should
replace the steering mechanism. DPO Pedro specifically
mentioned the steering was in good condition but might
need a "little work". That tells me it's totally shot,
dangerous to drive and held together with Elmer's glue
and K-mart brand duct tape.

Bill-I see some of the parts for the suspension replacement
are no longer available. Maybe I can get mine refurbished?

David, yes I'm not going to multi-task this difficult
project. The front end is much more complicated that the
rear and way too many parts to lose. I'll install Paul's
T/A when it arrives and then it's a one week cruise with
Wendy.

When we return I'll put the Crypt Car back up on jack stands
and begin to disassemble the front end so I understand how
things fit together. I'll purchase new parts poco a poco as
we say here on the island.

Dr- I totally missed the failed trailing arm when I had
the car up and down off jack stands many, many times. My
skills in auto mechanics are too lacking to diagnose any
front suspension problems. Best I replace everything before
I lose my steering or a wheel disappears. Remember this is
DPO Pedro's nightmare car- a rolling death trap.

regards,

all

d

 

[YankeeTR]

GREAT picture John Mc....