Electrical: What is this relay good for?

[TRnorwegian]

And what are the consequences when the upper right connection is broken off?
In the Moss catalogue, this relay seems to be the horn relay.
And is there a somewhat simular ignition relay (with only difference one more connection, in the upper left corner)? Placed where?

BTW, when I'm grinding my starter, one of the wire connectors are starting to glow. Normal?

Anders

 

[Tinster]

And what are the consequences when the upper right connection is broken off?
In the Moss catalogue, this relay seems to be the horn relay.
And is there a somewhat simular ignition relay (with only difference one more connection, in the upper left corner)? Placed where?

BTW, when I'm grinding my starter, one of the wire connectors are starting to glow. Normal?

Anders

Anders, I don't know if this helps you BUT I started your car several times
and it fired up on the first turn of the key. No grinding required. I do
not think ANY wires should ever glow. What wire is glowing? Sounds like a short somewhere.

Crawl under you car and verify ALL the wires on the starter are properly connected.

Hey Anders! For your info- I drove my car a total of two hours today
with zero problems.

Send photos of food!!

dale

d

 

[TRnorwegian]

It's one of the connecting points on the bendix (placed on the starter motor).

What kind of food did you have in mind?

Anders

 

[Tinster]

Kind of food?

Something traditional from your country.
Here is a typical meal in Puerto Rico.

 

[Mickey Richaud]

Kind of food?

Something traditional from your country.
Here is a typical meal in Puerto Rico.

ARROZ CON JUEYES!

You just had to post that picture, didn't ya?!

AAAARRRGH!

 

[TR3driver]

Looking at Dan's schematic, a 73 would have only one relay, for the horns; plus one for the OD if the car has an A-type OD. Other years had various other relays for hazards, starter, bulb test, etc. but I don't see an "ignition relay" anywhere. Kind of hard to tell with the blue overspray, but one of those wires does look purple, which would also indicate horn relay.

If that is the horn relay, the broken terminal will almost certainly disable the horns.

Glowing wires are absolutely NOT normal ! Most likely explanation is a poor ground between the engine block and battery, but of course it could be something else. You might also check the white/yellow wire at the coil. It may have fallen off and shorted to ground, which would cause a short only when the starter is operating.

 

[mrv8q]

When you get time, you might want to take that fuse block apart and give it a good cleaning. It will disassemble, to allow for good clean connections. A little 0000 steel wool on those terminals, and many things will work better.....

I wonder if there's a fiberglass patch around there....

 

[prb51]

Wondering the same (fiberglass patch and whatever) ...that relay is probably grounded directly to the firewall thru the screws but if the fiberglass patch is not allowing a proper connection....

 

[TR3driver]

Like most relays, the Lucas relays do not ground through the can.

Which is a Good Thing for the horn relay, since the horn button grounds the relay to sound the horns ...

 

[TRnorwegian]

Looking at Dan's schematic, a 73 would have only one relay, for the horns; plus one for the OD if the car has an A-type OD. Other years had various other relays for hazards, starter, bulb test, etc. but I don't see an "ignition relay" anywhere. Kind of hard to tell with the blue overspray, but one of those wires does look purple, which would also indicate horn relay.

If that is the horn relay, the broken terminal will almost certainly disable the horns.

Glowing wires are absolutely NOT normal ! Most likely explanation is a poor ground between the engine block and battery, but of course it could be something else. You might also check the white/yellow wire at the coil. It may have fallen off and shorted to ground, which would cause a short only when the starter is operating.

The horn is not working.... so that would explain something. No OD on the car either, the ignition relay is just taken from the Moss TR 5-6 catalogue (and bearing in mind the ignition problems, it bore promise).

I'll check the ground from the battery. Should be grounded to the engine block, not the chassis? When detected, the car was hooked up to a big battery charger, no explanation there?

BTW, the colors on certain wires has been sprayed over, so it's not always easy to operate barely on what they looked like new. The engine compartment needs some work and de-fibreglassing here and there.

 

[TR3driver]

I'll check the ground from the battery. Should be grounded to the engine block, not the chassis?

I just meant the problem is somewhere between those two points.

However, as I recall, the original ground cable did run from the battery to the engine, with an extra terminal in the middle that was bolted to the firewall.
https://www.zeni.net/trf/TR6greenbook/35.php

 

[tom628]

Anders, all my wires in the engine compartment were painted green when we got the car. Drove me nuts tracing or troubleshooting anything. But, a little lacquer thinner on a rag removed the paint pretty easily. Too vigorous rubbing, however, will remove the tracer color from the wire.

Tom

 

[Brosky]

Where is the fuse that belongs on the top connectors of the fuse panel?

 

[TRnorwegian]

I checked the ground from the battery. It ended in the engine block, but no extra terminal in the middle (see picture). Strange.... Isn't it rubber all the way between the block and the chassis?
Must be another flexible connection somewhere between the block and the rest?
See also picture of the point glowing on the starter engine/ bendix.

The relay is definately the horn relay. When loose parts are held together, the horn works. That case closed.

And Brosky - the fuse belonging to the top connectors in fuse panel was found in the glove compartment. I've put it in (35 amp) in that third socket, and Eureka, I had tail lights and stuff. Only hoping there wasn't a reason it was not in place. Now only missing the instrument lights. And the wipers (but perhaps I haven't understood the button correctly. Pull or twist or caress?)

Dale - I'm working on the food pics. Needs some marinating. I have also discovered the rebuild was more recent than we thought. Done from Dec 05 till Dec 07, in Florida (Tamarac or Ft. Lauderdale). Driven only 1000 miles since rebuild, 800 of them on your island (Jan - June 08). It seems...

 

[DrEntropy]

There ought to be a ground strap somewhere at the trans/engine bolts to the chassis, IIRC... The "glowing" is from NOT having that ground. It's arcing at the most convenient place for the electrons to bail to "earth".

NOT a good place below the carbs, tho. Webers tend to leak...

 

[DrEntropy]

As to the original post: that relay is good for seein' how far you can chuck it. It's a standard Lucas relay. Easily replaceable.

 

[brent615]

according to several on the forum and TRF catalog the horn relay and OD relay are the same. On Ebay you pay half the $ for a OD relay (or less) than you will for a horn relay. Who knows why?

Anyway, I have learned more about horns and horn relays than I ever wanted to know lately and I haven't come across anything that relates that to the starter. My question regarding the glowing wire is does it glow continously or only while the starter is engaged?

The previous owner of my car had installed an alarm with a starter disabler. Once all the alarm junk was removed the starter cranked well. Before that, nothing!

 

[DrEntropy]

My question regarding the glowing wire is does it glow continously or only while the starter is engaged?

my guess is it only arcs when loaded with the starter draw.... but the rest of the time the engine is being 'grounded' thru the choke and throttle cables. NOT an optimal condition. Needs addressing before the next turn of the key, IMO.

 

[TRnorwegian]

Glows only when the starter is engaged.

On the six-pack I was made aware of this older thread:

https://www.6-pack.org/sixpack/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?t=6779&highlight=*sparky

Seems he fixed the ground, and problem solved.

 

[poolboy]

I noticed you mentioned instrument lighting. In that department don't overlook the possibility of a faulty dimmer switch (rheostat). They corrode. But they are easily bypassed to give you full current to the bulbs.