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TR2/3/3A Dayton Wire Wheels for TR3a

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Tcraftdriver

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Hi All,

I have just purchased a 1959 TR3a and plan on installing Dayton chrome wire wheels with knockoffs and stainless steel spokes, but not sure which model to order. The factory was non-committal and not much help. The guy at the Roadster Factory had a lot of info but said the tubeless wheels are not receommended as they will leak. But the factory says that no, they do not leak. The factory said the 5" wide wheels will "fill up the wheel well" but could not say if they would rub but did say they would be stronger and safer and accept tubeless tires so I could order better tires than what can be used, or even ordered, for the 4.5", 60 spoke wheels. I can use a thinner wheel for the spare. So which way to go? I can order 60 spoke wheels 4.5" wide or 72 spoke wheels 5" wide for only $20.00 more per wheel as compared to the cost for the 60 spoke wheels. So, now I am totally confused. What is the best Dayton chromed wire wheel for a 59 TR3a that will be a fair weather weekly driver but never raced. Comments will be truly appreciated.
 
I have tubeless chrome daytons (5 inch 72 spoke) and they're great. The way I see it, for an infreuquent driver, you should be checking your tires every time you drive anyways, so even if they do lose a little pressure over time, it shouldn't be a problem anyways. My wire wheel guy has done nothing but wire wheels and wire wheel restoration for the last 50 years and he says that the dayton tubless wire wheels are the best wire wheel ever made thus far. Stainless spokes, safety lips for the tires, forged and machined hubs instead of stamped hubs, etc.

The question is, do you want to go with 'originality' / period correctness, or go with a safer and more convenient wheel?

I've seen plenty of TR3s with 5" wide rims and none of them had rubbing problems, although I dont know what tire size they were using.
 
I have Dunlops in 5 1/2" x 15 with 185/70 tires. No problems with clearance or rubbing. I got a killer deal on them from Moss, and had them drop shipped to Hendrix Wire Wheel where they mounted the Vredestien tires and tubes that I bought from them. They re-trued the rims even though they were new, as they have tighter tolerances then the factory. Then they shaved the tires and balanced everything. Worth every penny that I paid for those services.

Edit: BTW, Hendrix (deemed by some to be the wire wheel guru of North America) considers the Dunlops to be every bit as good as the Daytons. They had troubles years back, but they've straightened out their act. The only area where the Dunlops aren't as good as the Daytons is in their chroming, which wasn't an issue with me, as I wanted the painted look.

Anyway, bottom line is get the wider wheels with wider tires. You'll be happy with them.
 

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My opinion, there is enough variation from car to car that no one can say for certain whether a particular tire & wheel combo will fit your car. But lots of folks seem to get by with the 72 spoke wires, as long as they don't go overboard on tire size. Since the wider wheels are stronger, flex less, and give you more options as to tire size; that is the way I would go.

FWIW, I'm running 205/55-15 tires on steel 5.5" rims. On the current TR3 I get just a little bit of rubbing on the RH side, when carrying a passenger and cornering hard (or hitting a bump in a turn). But it's not enough to hurt anything (the sidewall is a bit polished but not damaged) and I really like the handling of the wider tires & rims.

With my previous TR3A & the same tires & wheels, the body was off-center to the frame by about 1/2", which led to severe rubbing on the RH side. I literally took the body loose and moved it over about 3/8" to get enough clearance. Probably aftereffects of some previous accident (before I got the car), but I couldn't find any signs of damage. It appeared to have been simply made that way. After I moved the body until the fenders were more nearly equal distances from the frame, the tubes for mounting the rear bumpers no longer lined up. I also had to open up some of the mounting holes for that position.
 
Thank you guys for the great info on wheel size and tires. I think I will go with the 72 spokes but am not sure if those Dayton wheels come in 5" or 5.5". Moss shows them only in 5" but the Dayton Wire Wheel web site says they are avaiable as non-original in 5.5" width. Is ther emuch of a difference between the 5"a nd 5.5" wheels when it comes to tire width and tire options?

What is the difference between 205/55/15 tires or 205/80/15? Does the 55 indicate a tire narrower than a 70 or 80 tire?
 
205 is the tire width, the largest tire you can (safely) put on a 5x15 inch rim is a 205/70-R15 The 2nd number in modern tire sizing is the percentage of the width of the tire that the side wall is high. the first number is typically the width in millimeters.

Many of the older tire sizes are very hard to find or very expensive now. Stock TR6 wheels for example used 185/80-R15 tires, which are all but non-existant now, however 205/70-R15 is within a percentage or so in diameter.
 
Tcraftdriver said:
...The guy at the Roadster Factory had a lot of info but said the tubeless wheels are not receommended as they will leak. But the factory says that no, they do not leak...
Click to expand...

Had a contractor friend who used to say "There are 2 types of roofs -- those that do leak and those that will".

IOW, they may both be right: they do not leak and they will leak.

Sounds like you've about made up your mind but if there is doubt you might want to take a look at some photos of TR3s with 60-spoke vs 72-spoke and chrome vs painted.

And if you have ruled out Dunlops because of what one vendor (who sells Daytons) says about them you might get more opinions on that too. I've had the Dunlops for a dozen years and my experience squares with what Art mentions above.
 
Before selecting wider wheels, first thing is check if you have one of the "offset" cars. That's where one rear wheel is up to 1" closer to the fender than the other side. Weird, but they were made that way.

If you have one, the narrow side determines what size rim/tire can be fitted. Consider if the rear springs have dropped or correct height ?. Is the car going to be loaded with a full tank and passenger - the narrow side tire needs sufficient clearance so it won't rub when cornering.

Finally, a wider wheel won't fit in the spare trunk, so you need to keep one standard wheel/tire combo.
 
Vivdownunder, Thank you. This is good advice along with some fo the other comments. I will measure the spacing between the current steel wheels and tires and the inner fender wells inthe next day or two. Hopefully the body is centered.
 
The more spokes the stronger the wheel, other factors being equal- originally the early TR series had 48 spoke wheels, later 60 spoke. For normal driving 72 spoke is not necessary for a car the weight and power of a TR3, though if you want to use the really wide (and grippier) tyres some people have mentioned above the 72 spokes would be better because of the higher braking and cornering forces.

From a point of view of driving the car I feel a 185-70-15 is a good size, and should give good braking performance- I feel that using much heavier wheel and tyre coimbinations than the suspension was designed for does not give good results, nor do very wide tyres look good or feel very nice to drive- personal opinion, others will not agree!

I prefer to use tubes as I think they offer an additional measure of safety and puncture resistance.

Finally, I personally don't like chrome wires on older cars- too flashy, looks like costume jewelry to me. The chroming process causes hydrogen embrittlement of the spokes, so is a technically inferior wheel as well.
The black TR3 in the photo posted by Martx looks great to me!
 
Simon TR4a said:
The chroming process causes hydrogen embrittlement of the spokes, so is a technically inferior wheel as well.
Click to expand...

I believe both Daytona and Dunlop use polished stainless steel spokes now so this is not a problem.

Scott
 
HerronScott said:
I believe both Daytona and Dunlop use polished stainless steel spokes now so this is not a problem.
Click to expand...
I know Dayton does, as I have a set on my Stag.

Personally I quite like the look on the Stag, better than the factory alloys. My only regret is that I didn't go for the 15" wires instead of stock 14".

Only photo I have that shows the wires, which just happens to be my winning run at the 2005 VTR autocross. Wire wheels & low profile tires may not be totally optimum, but they do work pretty good, IMO.

113_1372cropped.jpg
 
I went to the Glenmoor gathering yesterday in Massillon, Ohio. Wonderful display of fabulously beautiful cars. Lots of Allard's, MG's Austin Healeys and Stutz Bearcats, Duesenbergs, Pierce Arrows, etc. etc., and many many of them had Dayton 72 spoke wire wheels. Most had highly polished SS spokes with chrome rims but a few were satin finished, and a few were painted. Dayton Wire Wheel people told me they can media blast their highly polished SS spoke splined wheels to make them a satin finish if that is what I want. Has any one had any experience with that media blasting to reduce the brightness a little?
 
If yer 'gonna blast em to make them dull then buy painted ones and save lot's of money. Chrome rims are SHINY....and should be IMO.

Gordon
 
I have glass beaded SS spokes for vintage motorcycle wheels to dull them similar to the original cadmium which is getting harder to get done and doesnt hold up well.Lots of guys do this and it is so commom the spoke companies now offer polished and satin SS spokes.I use fine glass bead,but I do the spokes and nipples and then build the wheel.I cant see blasting a complete chrome rim ss spoke wheel that is already assembled,but if the spokes are done before its a nice look.
Tom
 
Thank you Tom.

This is exactly what I am thinking of. A polished rim with satin SS spokes. The bright glittery look of a perfect mirror finish on the entire wheel is nice to look at, but I like a softer look for a 50+ year old car from a diffrent era. A Dayton representative is mailing me a polished spoke and a satin spoke so I can choose between them. I am hoping that means they can bead blast the spokes and nipples and then assemble the wheel. They referred to it as "media blasting" so now I know to ask if it's glass bead media.
 
To me bead blasting the spokes to dull a chrome wheel sounds a bit like having your Olympic gold medal bronzed.

I agree that the all chrome wheel is glittery and seems over the top for my taste, that is why I went with the painted 60-spoke.

Nexen.JPG


But (as is often said) it is your car and if you like the chrome rims you're certainly not alone.
 
I think the painted spokes have a quiet elegance about them but wonder if the spokes are painted stainless steel or painted steel that might be susceptible to rust.
 
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