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TR2/3/3A Clutch Hydraulics II

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TR3MT

TR3MT

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My situation is similar but different from last years Clutch Hydraulics Thread. My 59 TR3A #550035 with a Girling system disengages and shifts gears fine, but is sluggish in engaging (when I release the clutch). I have a strong return spring with plenty of tension. I would appreciate some opinions on some things that I am wondering about with the slave cylinder. 1. Is 3/4" travel in the push rod normal? 2. I had to mount the slave cylinder flanges behind (on the tranny side) of the mounting bracket in order for the 4 1/2" push rod to reach the clutch lever. Why should this be? I believe the slave cylinder should be mounted forward (engine side) of the mounting bracket according to the book. 3. When I push the push rod back into the slave cylinder it is very stiff (with spring disconnected). Takes all of my strength to do it with one hand. Is this normal? The clutch lever is vertical when the clutch is engaged. There is proper free play between the rod and the lever. I did rebuild the clutch master cylinder in my current restoration project, but did no work on the clutch or clutch slave cylinder. They were working fine when I took the car out of service ten years ago. 4. Does anyone think the master cylinder could be the problem? If I can get this clutch to work right, I will be ready for the road after a long restoration project. Thanks for any advise that anyone can offer.
TR3MT
 
If the flexible line is old, it could cause your problems. Tom
 
A couple things I have experienced. Some master cylinder pistons have 2 groves and if the front one has an O ring or felt or something--- that slows down the return. If you have a 7/8 inch slave cylinder instead of a tr3--- 1 inch--- the pedal is very difficult to push down. IMHO a light spring works the best on the slave return; the factory spring pulls things back too hard. Just try a weak spring and see. I will try and find a picture of what side the cylinder bolts somebody might have one handy.
 
Thanks for the feedback. The flex line looks good, but it is old. In a thread started by Lukens on 6-17-15 called Clutch hydraulics? someone mentioned that he removed the slave return spring and the clutch worked better. I disconnected mine and could not tell any difference. I don't think a weaker spring would make a difference either. IMO, something is really restricting the return of the piston in either the master or slave cylinder. Bottom line, when I engage the clutch it acts in slow motion. There is no problem in dis-engaging. In the Lukens thread, it was mentioned that there is a foot valve in the master cylinder that has to work to allow the slave cylinder to retract. Does anyone think this could be the problem?
 
Many have struggled with some of clutch issues you motioned. I would purchase a new master cylinder and put that on and see if that fixes it. IMHO- These old hydraulic clutch do not grab like an old Ford or Chev. They are a little slower and do not have that bite. I had a master cylinder move so slow once the clutch would slip just a little between gears. I used to repair the masters, but now I buy them new and rebuild the slave.
 
Heck I now just saw you are the original owner, right on. I am sure you know more about these cars than I. Plus glad you are here I like getting knowledge about how they came off the line.
 
sp53--for $33 I think I will just replace the MC like you suggested. In the meantime the car is drivable, but just not right. I got it new back in Norfolk, VA when I was a ltjg in the Navy. It was all red, inside and out, with a white top. I have restored it to red outside and black inside with a black hood--much more practical but still correct, I think. Having owned this TR3 for 57 years I though I knew a lot about Triumphs, that was until I started the restoration. This forum and the participants have really helped.
 
TR3MT said:
sp53--for $33 I think I will just replace the MC like you suggested...
Click to expand...

But please save the original (if the one on there is an original) as it is my understanding that all the repros are not quite correct. Specifically, the outlet leans forward on the repros whereas on the originals both fittings exit straight up. Might not matter to you (doesn't matter to me) but it may matter to someone someday so a correct part should not be discarded.
 
The Master cylinder uses a threaded push rod with clevis on the end. Also, some cars have a pair of fitted bolts with lock nuts to limit the amount of return (where the pedal rests). Somewhere in the Triumph manual are great details given to exactly how to adjust these two 'features'. It seems to me that if the Master (internals) were not returning all the way 'home', it may not be properly releasing the fluid. (I think it's the foot valve you mention.)

I assume your clutch pedal does return without force. The shaft of the two pedals on mine was so rusted they resisted any movement. The pedals (without the MC's connected) should move up and down with very little effort.

But, the slave has nothing but the added spring, (after the clutch pressure) to return it. If "pumped up" without anything connected to it, it probably would not return by itself.

...the original owner. That's awesome. I hope you get it back on the road soon and it's more fun than you remember.
 
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