BJ8 Laygear Wear

[AUSMHLY]

Hello,

Back story.
2nd gear has never slid into place as easy and smoothly other BJ8's I've driven. 1st, reverse, 3 and 4 work fine.
Tranny was overhauled 15yrs ago and shifting into 2nd was one of the problems. Even after that rebuild, shifting into second wasn't as smooth as it should be. Been dealing with and would really like to put it behind me.

3 months ago a British mechanic replaced the baulk ring for 2nd gear with one from Moss. It helped a little, didn't think it really fixed it, then 2 month latter, I couldn't get into 2nd gear. Clutch in, move the shifter to 2nd, grind grind grind, as if I wasn't using the clutch.

Two days ago, a different British mechanic opened up the tranny to find the area on 2nd gear where the steel baulk rings goes has been worn down so much the baulk ring slides up to the edge of the gear and spins freely. 2nd gear teeth look good though. Time to find a good used 2nd gear. Any recommendations where to find one? (Denis Welch, BCS, Healey Surgeons if they're still in business, Ebay, Craigslist).

The Laygear's 2nd gear has groves worn on one side (same side) of every gear. Laygear's 1st/reverse 3/4 gears look like normal wear.
Why is 2nd gear grinding a grove in the Laygear's 2nd gear? Why don't I see any damage excessive wear on the 2nd gear's teeth that is grinding groves in the laygear 2nd's teeth? The other opposite side of the Laygear's teeth have some wear which looks smooth. Should that area show wear too?

When parts were new, I'll assume the gear's mesh was tight. As normal wear occurred, the gap increased. Being the Laygear's 2nd gear teeth don't seem to have worn thiner, would filing the grove area a little to make it smooth, help or will it affect the gear mesh tolerance so much as to make it worse? Or leave it alone, it's normal wear?

Being I'm problem solving;
Replaced baulk ring, little improvement then within 2 months, can't shift in at all. Did the new baulk ring grind away so much metal in that short time to need to replace the gear? Can a new bad baulk ring do that? (I will be replacing all 3 baulk rings with DW ones)
Why is the laygear getting worn where it is.
I'll attach photos of the Laygear. Should I replace the laygear? I need to address what's causing grove wear in the laygear, unless... that's normal?

1-4 photos of the Laygear. Last photo show 2nd gear with the baulk ring touching the edge of the gear. Notice the teeth don't seem worn and yet they are grinding groves in the layer's 2nd gear. ?

 

[AUSMHLY]

I'm going to replace the laygear.
Survey:

1) Buy the new once piece now available from Moss or AHSpares
2) Buy the reconditioned ones where they weld on the front gear.

Why would you buy 1 or 2?

 

[Bob_Spidell]

1 (but it's your wallet)

 

[AUSMHLY]

1 (but it's your wallet)

Why would you buy 1

 

[Bob_Spidell]

In general, for my classic cars, I will take a new part over used/repaired (unless 'new' are suspect; e.g. graphite release bearings). Of course, new OEM parts are preferred, but scarce (and usually not 'cheap'). I don't think many of us think of our cars as 'beaters' we just want to keep on the road. I checked out the new ones and the price didn't seem extravagant given the amount of machining required for a limited production run (and, they won't likely be cheaper down the road; I bought a Lempert 3.54 diff set for $200 when Michael first offered them; try to find a set for that now). Also, until a few years ago I took an annual Healey road trip of up to 5,000 miles, often in the middle of nowhere. I went for best quality parts I could find. OTOH Randy Forbes, previously a 'regular' here, has had good service from a repaired gear he bought years ago, but new weren't generally available back then.

IIRC, you've already had issues with a repaired laygear, but it could have been caused by something as yet undetermined (I gave you my best guess). I've rebuilt my BJ8's gearbox twice, most recently at about 205K miles and the laygear was perfect.

Disclaimer: I have no idea how good the new ones are, but they come from a reputable seller.

 

[AUSMHLY]

When did they start making new laygears?
Who makes them?
Where are they made?
Who besides Moss/AH Spares sells them?

Some reproduced AH parts are made in Taiwan, China other places. I find some of those parts are of questionable quality.
I believe the laygears with the new front gear replaced, welded on, are of good quality and have a good track record.
I don't know about the reproduction laygears, hence my questions.

 

[Bob_Spidell]

This thread is the first I've heard of new ones. AHSpares says "They have been manufactured to the highest standard and are a direct replacement part so you will not need to change any existing internal components to fit them." I suggest calling them: tel:00441926817181

 

[AUSMHLY]

Hello Bob,
Chances are Moss's laygears come from AHSpares. Moss's only description is; Laygear 22B141
What is the small tube next to the laygear in their photo. I'll assume they include it.

 

[Bob_Spidell]

No idea. Why not talk to someone at AHSpares, the Brits are generally helpful (I got a call from Jeremy Welch on an inquiry about their replacement steering boxes)? I'd be interested in what they have to say.

 

[John Turney]

I vote for #1 also. You already have a #2, which shows uneven wear on the teeth, which tells me it may have a slight wobble in it from not being perfectly aligned when the two parts were welded together.

 

[red57]

I just happened to be looking for something else on Michael Salter's eBay site and noticed this laygear and his notes about having installed several of them. I'd trust Michael over most of the players out there. FYI Mk III laygear

 

[AUSMHLY]

I just happened to be looking for something else on

eBay site and noticed this laygear and his notes about having installed several of them. I'd trust Michael over most of the players out there. FYI Mk III laygear

His ad description is:
This is one part that the "repro" guys actually did get right (eventually).
I've installed lots of these and they "work a treat".

A couple days ago I asked him:
Who makes this part? Where is it made? Is it the exact one Moss and AHSpears sells?
His reply:
This part was purchased something like 25 years ago from a gear manufacturer in the U.K. It is the last of a lot of 15 that we purchased by special order from a lot of 100 that were made around that time. As far as I'm aware no more were produced by that manufacturer. Unfortunately I cannot remember the name of the company. I believe it was something like Burman.

I wonder who is making AHSpares laygears. (I'm assuming Moss's is from the same manufacturer.)
After years of laygears only being available reconditioned and on an exchange only basis, A.H. Spares have invested in giving customers the choice of brand new units. They have been manufactured to the highest standard and are a direct replacement part so you will not need to change any existing internal components to fit them.

I've also found someone selling a old "new" one piece reproduction from Ahead4healeys.

Current choices for one piece repros are:
Michael Salter's Ebay
AHS/Moss
Ahead4healeys