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I have a 1967 BJ8. I have installed all new choke cables and have dripped oil down the cable covers to make things work easier. I have to use vise grips to pull the choke out all the way. Also, it does not lock in position, but will slip back. I had the carbs rebuilt by Healey Surgeons. I also have a couple of light springs that help the choke to release all the way (which it seldom does!). Is this typical for BJ8 chokes? I am very frustrated with this. My brother in-law has a 1957 AH with actual rods that control the choke. It works MUCH better. Why would Austin Healey come up with a peace of crap for a choke in a newer car? Any way that I can make this choke work?
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BJ8 Choke Impossible to Live With
- Thread starter 67BJ8
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AUSMHLY
Yoda
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Hello 67BJ8,
I hear ya. I used to put my left hand against the dash top to get leverage so as to pull the choke with my right hand.
The problem maybe the choke cable (moss 734-190) is bending too much under the dash. Try and make that as straight a path as possible. That cable set up is new?
1. Confirm the dash choke cable is as straight as possible.
2. Connect to the remote control cable block. Pull the choke and feel if there is any resistance. There should be a little, because of the inner cable against the outer sleeve and whatever bends in the path under the dash. The choke should be able to pull out and twist to hold in place.
3. Connect the two carb cables to the remote control cable block only. Pull the choke knob to see if any more resistance is added. If the cables are new, there should not be. If there is, there's the problem.
4. Connect both cables to the choke cable brackets. Make sure the metal outer cable sleeves fit down into the bracket opening. You don't want it bending at that junction. Pull the choke knob and feel the resistance.
5. Connect the inner cable to the carb jet housing arm. Pull the choke knob and feel the difference.
6. Connect the springs. You only need enough spring tension to pull the housing arm back when you push the choke knob back in. If the spring pulls too much, it will pull the choke knob back into the dash. You may have to try different springs. I'll attach a photo of my front spring.
The two carb cables should have a black plastic tube over the metal flexible cable. Not sure what it's purpose is other than looks nice and for the reinforcement bracket (moss 372-065) to clamp to, rather than the metal cable sleeve.
I used tri-flow to lubricate the insides of the cable.
Best of luck problem solving. Maybe you'll get lucky and find the under dash cable was bending too much.
Happy Healey Motoring!
Roger
I hear ya. I used to put my left hand against the dash top to get leverage so as to pull the choke with my right hand.
The problem maybe the choke cable (moss 734-190) is bending too much under the dash. Try and make that as straight a path as possible. That cable set up is new?
1. Confirm the dash choke cable is as straight as possible.
2. Connect to the remote control cable block. Pull the choke and feel if there is any resistance. There should be a little, because of the inner cable against the outer sleeve and whatever bends in the path under the dash. The choke should be able to pull out and twist to hold in place.
3. Connect the two carb cables to the remote control cable block only. Pull the choke knob to see if any more resistance is added. If the cables are new, there should not be. If there is, there's the problem.
4. Connect both cables to the choke cable brackets. Make sure the metal outer cable sleeves fit down into the bracket opening. You don't want it bending at that junction. Pull the choke knob and feel the resistance.
5. Connect the inner cable to the carb jet housing arm. Pull the choke knob and feel the difference.
6. Connect the springs. You only need enough spring tension to pull the housing arm back when you push the choke knob back in. If the spring pulls too much, it will pull the choke knob back into the dash. You may have to try different springs. I'll attach a photo of my front spring.
The two carb cables should have a black plastic tube over the metal flexible cable. Not sure what it's purpose is other than looks nice and for the reinforcement bracket (moss 372-065) to clamp to, rather than the metal cable sleeve.
I used tri-flow to lubricate the insides of the cable.
Best of luck problem solving. Maybe you'll get lucky and find the under dash cable was bending too much.
Happy Healey Motoring!
Roger
Offline
I'm sure that all of Roger's suggestions will help.
I think it depends on how much trouble you are willing to go to to solve the problem.
Firstly, cables are or should be designed to pull, not push. There are many low friction cables which typically have low friction jacketed cores and inner liners. Stranded rather than solid inner cores are much more flexible that solid cores. They do need to be terminated with the correct ends.
Boats, motorcycles, bicycles, & aircraft all use high quality low friction control cables in various sizes. AH & most Brit cars used the very cheapest, low quality cables available.
Many motorcycles have used four or five seperate throttle cables to pull multiple throttles against much more spring tension than two or three Healey chokes.
There are endless possibilities for better cables. Likely on a high quality bicycle or boat near you.
D
I think it depends on how much trouble you are willing to go to to solve the problem.
Firstly, cables are or should be designed to pull, not push. There are many low friction cables which typically have low friction jacketed cores and inner liners. Stranded rather than solid inner cores are much more flexible that solid cores. They do need to be terminated with the correct ends.
Boats, motorcycles, bicycles, & aircraft all use high quality low friction control cables in various sizes. AH & most Brit cars used the very cheapest, low quality cables available.
Many motorcycles have used four or five seperate throttle cables to pull multiple throttles against much more spring tension than two or three Healey chokes.
There are endless possibilities for better cables. Likely on a high quality bicycle or boat near you.
D
Offline
I used to do exactly this method shown in picture to get the choke cables to return and I suspect it was this way that eventually wore out my throttle shafts. I ended up placing springs between the cable adjusting locknut and the aircleaner connection. I believe I used standard ballpoint pen springs when I did them and they look "original". Still working great several years later.AUSMHLY said:
Patrick
Thanks everyone for your advice. I looked at my choke cable last night and it does NOT go in a straight line to the firewall. It makes a kind of S turn. Maybe I need to shorten the cable somewhat. Patrick, could you send me a photo or diagram of how you hooked up the ball point pen spring? I can't visualize how it works.
Larry
Larry
Offline
One way is the BP pen spring would go between the cable anchor bracket & the choke operate lever. Over the inner cable only.
In Roger's pic above, a small compression spring over the inner cable directly above but instead of the tension spring shown in the pic.
D
In Roger's pic above, a small compression spring over the inner cable directly above but instead of the tension spring shown in the pic.
D
Offline
Regarding these choke-return springs and the throttle shafts--
I don't see how either the spring shown or the ballpoint pen springs would have any affect on the throttle shaft, since the choke mechanism does not act on the shaft.
To me it seems the HD8 return springs operating off the lever shown in the upper left of Roger's picture would be the real culprit. Earlier carbs had circular springs concentric around the throttle shafts, which seems better to me.
However, having said that, my wife's original 240Z with license-built SUs has the exact same setup shown in the picture including the springs Roger added and it has never had a problem with leaking butterfly shafts.
I don't see how either the spring shown or the ballpoint pen springs would have any affect on the throttle shaft, since the choke mechanism does not act on the shaft.
To me it seems the HD8 return springs operating off the lever shown in the upper left of Roger's picture would be the real culprit. Earlier carbs had circular springs concentric around the throttle shafts, which seems better to me.
However, having said that, my wife's original 240Z with license-built SUs has the exact same setup shown in the picture including the springs Roger added and it has never had a problem with leaking butterfly shafts.
AUSMHLY
Yoda
Offline
67BJ8 said:
How's it going Larry?
You're correct, the under dash cable has to make an s-curve. Experiment with cable lenght and path that will give you the least resistance when pulling on the choke knob.
Patrick, could you post a photo(s) of your ball point spring hookup? A better mouse trap is always welcomed.
Good luck Larry,
Roger
Roger,
I'm having trouble getting the dash board out. The choke that I was using is a Moss model. I could never get it to lock when I pulled it out and turned it. I finally pulled on it so hard that the plastic knob broke! Are there better models out there? I can't unscrew the choke locking nut with the dash board in place, so I am removing it. What a job!
Larry
I'm having trouble getting the dash board out. The choke that I was using is a Moss model. I could never get it to lock when I pulled it out and turned it. I finally pulled on it so hard that the plastic knob broke! Are there better models out there? I can't unscrew the choke locking nut with the dash board in place, so I am removing it. What a job!
Larry
tahoe healey
Yoda
Offline
As you take out the dash be careful of the oil pressue guage! Have you tried 90 degree pliers on the nut? Use a mirror to see what is keeping the nut from being removed. I have trouble keeping it tight. It seems to loosen on a yearly basis (I've been meaning to use some lock tight). Maybe the PO did something to yours that is keeping it from coming loose.
Guys,
My Moss motors choke broke. It never did lock in the pulled out position. I just talked to victoria British and they said that none of their chokes lock either. Does anyone make a choke that stays out when you pull it on? I can't imagine a choke that you have to hold out manually until the car warms up.
Larry
My Moss motors choke broke. It never did lock in the pulled out position. I just talked to victoria British and they said that none of their chokes lock either. Does anyone make a choke that stays out when you pull it on? I can't imagine a choke that you have to hold out manually until the car warms up.
Larry
Ed_K
Jedi Knight
Offline
Larry,
I bought one from them in 2005.
It did lock when pulled then twisted (in either direction).
The problem I had was that it only lasted about 10 to 15 pull / twist cycles before it broke. The cable became disconnected from the pull/knob assembly. They made good on it by sending me another one, but after careful examination, the new one appeared to be constructed the same way. I left the original moss outer tube installed, ( didn't want to go through the nut tightening while the dash was installed.)
I went to the local auto parts store and bought a generic choke cable. It was made with a solid wire instead of the twisted cable. I just slid the inner control cable through the existing moss outer sleeve. It has been working without any problems. The down side is that the cable no longer locks when twisted.
If I knew I could buy one somewhere that was constructed correctly and would twist/lock like it was supposed to, I would buy it. Otherwise I'll keep what I have because at least I can pull and hold the choke without worrying that the cable will pull out of the handle again.
Anyone know if a good control cable can be bought somewhere ? I am done trying the ones available from our usual suspects.
Ed
I bought one from them in 2005.
It did lock when pulled then twisted (in either direction).
The problem I had was that it only lasted about 10 to 15 pull / twist cycles before it broke. The cable became disconnected from the pull/knob assembly. They made good on it by sending me another one, but after careful examination, the new one appeared to be constructed the same way. I left the original moss outer tube installed, ( didn't want to go through the nut tightening while the dash was installed.)
I went to the local auto parts store and bought a generic choke cable. It was made with a solid wire instead of the twisted cable. I just slid the inner control cable through the existing moss outer sleeve. It has been working without any problems. The down side is that the cable no longer locks when twisted.
If I knew I could buy one somewhere that was constructed correctly and would twist/lock like it was supposed to, I would buy it. Otherwise I'll keep what I have because at least I can pull and hold the choke without worrying that the cable will pull out of the handle again.
Anyone know if a good control cable can be bought somewhere ? I am done trying the ones available from our usual suspects.
Ed
I got the old choke cable out tonight. It would have been less work to pull the engine! I ordered a new one from AH Spares in England. I'm hoping that it will work OK. I had to take the screws out that hold the dash in and even take out the bolt that holds the stering column up. I could then only move the dash panel out about 1/2" It should be just as much fun putting it back together.
tahoe healey
Yoda
Offline
I remember the MGB pulled and twisted but was "T" shaped. Mine pulls and stays without twisting. It is the one pictured above with the word "choke" and the thin circle around. I didn't know it was supposed to twist.
AUSMHLY
Yoda
Offline
I read that a fix for the cable breaking is to replace the cable with a solid strand. And to keep it (or the stranded cable) from pulling out, it gets soldered in.
I'm unable to offer any fix for the twist lock. A band-aid fix would be to use the tired and true...cloths pin. (print NOS on the wooden cloths pin).
Good luck.
Roger
I'm unable to offer any fix for the twist lock. A band-aid fix would be to use the tired and true...cloths pin. (print NOS on the wooden cloths pin).
Good luck.
Roger
I talked to Healey Surgeons this morning about the choke problem that I have. They said that the BJ8 has typically had a very hard choke to pull and recommend that you put one hand on the dash and pull the choke out with the other one. Also to grease up the block that connects the 3 cables in front of the firewall to help with eliminating some friction.
In case it hasn't been mentioned...
When pulling the choke, press down on the accelerator pedal a bit to relieve some of the tension you must overcome by the chokes opening up the throttle plates. If all of the components in the system are worn, that force contributed by the throttle return springs is multiplied back at the choke pull lever in the cockpit.
Mark
When pulling the choke, press down on the accelerator pedal a bit to relieve some of the tension you must overcome by the chokes opening up the throttle plates. If all of the components in the system are worn, that force contributed by the throttle return springs is multiplied back at the choke pull lever in the cockpit.
Mark