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Whitephrog

Luke Skywalker
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For a number of reasons I have decided that the Whitephrog needs to find a new home, therefore I will soon be offering her for sale.

The restoration is documented here: https://www.spritespot.com/gallery/Restoration-of-AN5L9382

The resortation is 99% complete. I need to install the heater, the front bumper and de-bug a few electrical issues. My intent in the restoration was to put the car back to as near original as possible. I've been true to that goal with a few exceptions.

I installed a 1275cc engine and ribbed case transmission because I had one handy and ready to install. I have the original engine and transmission. The original transmission was rebuilt several years ago but never re-installed. The engine was re-built by Howard's Machine Shop in Huntsville Alabama in about 1970 or so. At the time they were in the NASCAR engine business. I don't know the extent of that re-build other than + 30 pistons. That rebuild has a couple of thousand miles on it but need "refreshing". I have a new Special Tuning cam, new rings, new valves, etc. to go into that engine.

In that wings I have a 1966 Sprite that I intended to convert to a Bugeye front and rear but with a trunk and roll up windows. I have most all the pieces and parts for that restoration. My intent was to refresh the orignial 948 cc engine and re-install it in the original car then use the 1275cc engine and transmission in the 66 Sprite.

I've only driven the Whitephrog once since taking her to a car show in May. I don't fit in the car very well anymore...too old, too tall and too stiff. When I'm driving I still have flashbacks of the crash I had 2005 in a BE which as tottaled. I also have a BMW Z3 which I refer to as my German built British Roadster. That has become my daily driver and gives me much of the satisfaction that I once got driving the BE.

So here's the question to this learned group....How do I best configure the sale? Do I offer the Whitephrog as is with the current engine and transmission? Do I offer her with that engine and transmission removed and replaced by the original?
If I sell her with the 1275cc engine and transmission I'm much less inclined to restore the 66 Sprite. How to I then despose of that car and the assemblege of new, restored and used parts? Lastly, what would be a fair asking price in each scenario?

Driving the time of this inquiry is the current opportunity to purchase and restore a nice BMW 2002 tii similar to the one I had in the early 1970s.
 
Hi Ray,
If I were in the market to buy a Bugeye I'd want the car with the 1275 AND the original engine on the side. To me that seems like the most practical and valuable package. The Whitephrog looks great and with all your documentation it should fetch a premium.
 
AN5Sprite said:
Hi Ray,
If I were in the market to buy a Bugeye I'd want the car with the 1275 AND the original engine on the side. To me that seems like the most practical and valuable package. The Whitephrog looks great and with all your documentation it should fetch a premium.
Click to expand...

I was thinking the same thing. I would also want it finished as a fettled as reasonably possible given time constraints.
 
I agree with the others. You'll have a much easier time selling a "finished" vehicle. Offer the original parts to go with the vehicle. As a modifier and an originalist I really like having the option to either keep the upgraded unit or return it to original condition with the correct motor/trans.
 
X3

I'll also add, get out of old cars all together.

You've got a BE so why build a later Sprite? You won't have the bigger motor and will have to go through everything you went through w/ the BE which doesn't make sense. Put everyhting else on ebay is the best way to dispose of.

Next, BMW 2002....why? You've got a great no hassle BMW now that IMO is a better car. Why get something else? I understand the nostalgia of it, but you already have the best of both worlds. Why go through the hassle unless it'll mean a lot to you.

That being said, I'm currently beating myself to death building a car I should have owned 25 years ago......only to be wishing I would have put that $$$ into the Midget....or bought a Z3 or E36 convertible.....and I may wind up selling the Jav to do just that.
 
That's tight, great work! All that work and only driving it once is bummer. How much do you suppose it will fetch? I can never get the same amount I put into a car but I do it as a therapeutic exercise. I agree with the others, finish it up and debug the electrical that way you can say 100% complete and market to a broader (non-mechanical) audience. Good luck, nice car!
 
Thanks. All well said. I really appreciate the perspective.

So the plan for the Bugeye is to do the last 1% of the restoration and debug the electrical. I'll offer the orginal engine and transmission as part of the deal. Once that's done what's a fair asking price?

As for the 1966 Sprite...it's a rolling chasis with most of the body work done. It still needs new inner and outer sill replaced. I have those. I have tons of new, restored nd used parts for that car. New or restored gauges, dash, seats (the "horse shoe" type), new top, etc. Do I offer the chasis with the new sills as one lot then list the other pieces and parts separately? I suspect that the market for a rolling chasis is limited. What's a fair asking price for that?

That will leave a bunch of spares such as a new Abarth silencer, new generator, NOS windscreen pillars, two new Minator 13-inch wheels, a set of new 13-inch Fulda tires (never mounted),etc.
 
As for the 66 ... part it out. It is more work, but it will bring significantly more money. I'm not even sure that I'd bother trying to sell the shell.
 
I can appreciate the spot you're in, Ray. Was in a somewhat similar spot last year when I decided to sell the Tunebug. With my car went the original 948 and smoothcase transmission -- I think it's good to keep them together, especially if the engine is the original one (mine was). Helps the value a little, giving the buyer the option to go back to original if desired.

As for the '66, you need to ask yourself what your goal is. If you want to make money, then part that sucker out. If you want it gone, bundle the parts up and sell it all for a reasonable price and be done with it. You'll make less, but it all goes at once.

Fair price on the Bugeye can be a tough one. Again, depends on your wants -- sell it and be done or get top dollar. eBay completed auctions can give you a decent idea of roughly where the market sits these days. You won't get back what you put into that car, but you should get a decent amount for it.

Good luck. It's hard thing to do (I know all too well) but for me at least it was the right decision. And I'm with kellysguy, think carefully before getting into another classic since you have that Z3 right there filling the need.
 
Saw Ray's car at the Townsend show - very nice, indeed!

And Ray is tall - interesting watching him unfold to get out of the car! So I can understand the dilemma. I'd probably let it go as well.
 
I enjoyed the restoration. After giving the matter a bit more thought I've have decided to modify my plan a bit. My original goal was to put the car back to as original as possible. I got 90% there but I have everything to get it to near 100%. Little things like the correct NOS fabric wrapped top radiator hose with the ripples in one end, the correct copper/brass 90 degree spark plug terminals, etc.

So, I've decided to complete my plan. I'm going to complete the refresh of the original engine and reinstall it with the original rebuilt transmission and rebuilt carbs. I'll complete all the other miscellaneous things yet to be done and get the electrical de-bugged. Once complete I'll offer it for sale.

Meanwhile, I'll gather everything not necessary for the final restoration of the BE and all the parts for the 66 Sprite and sell those now, including the 1275cc engine, ribbed case transmission and the HIF 44 carb and manifold.
 
Sounds like a plan, Ray. The '66 will be easier to sell with engine and transmission, and the Bugeye should do well as a completed, original restoration.

Good luck!

(And I understand the tall-guy-in-a-Bugeye problem -- I'm not huge, but at 6'1" certainly tall for a Sprite)
 
Mickey Richaud said:
Saw Ray's car at the Townsend show -

Ray is tall - interesting watching him unfold to get out of the car!
Click to expand...



Interesting idea.

How much you think needs to be cut off and where? :jester:
 
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