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Adjustable clutch rods, anyone using?
- Thread starter Brosky
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BritBox
Jedi Hopeful
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Hi Paul,
I almost bought one last year when I was having some clutch problems. Turns out that my rebuilt (by me) clutch master cylinder was not quite up to par, and I ended up replacing the entire unit.
I think the consensus from this forum and other sources was that the TR250/TR6 system is self-adjusting by design, and that if you needed to use the adjustable rod it was probably a band-aid for another problem like puny hydraulics or a broken fork pin.
Best regards,
I almost bought one last year when I was having some clutch problems. Turns out that my rebuilt (by me) clutch master cylinder was not quite up to par, and I ended up replacing the entire unit.
I think the consensus from this forum and other sources was that the TR250/TR6 system is self-adjusting by design, and that if you needed to use the adjustable rod it was probably a band-aid for another problem like puny hydraulics or a broken fork pin.
Best regards,
R
RonMacPherson
Guest
Guest
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Early Honda, civic and Accord, early being all through 70's and 80's they used adjustable rod with clevis. Put them in my TR6, any wrecking yard should have them
OP
Brosky
Great Pumpkin
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I'm not trying to "fix" any issue with the linkage, per say. Mine works perfectly as it should.
I'm putting it in to try to alleviate any potential issues with the T/O bearing riding against the PP intermittently. My clutch mechanicals, linkage and hydraulics are completely new, including hose and line. I had read that Kaster recommends doing this and after all the time and money spent to finally get mine right, I wanted to complete the job with this addition.
I just need the instructions that TRF did not send and I'll just have to wait for them to call me back if no one here has them. I know that there is an adjustment of .100" at the end, but I want to see the rest of Kastner's detail about the setup.
I'm putting it in to try to alleviate any potential issues with the T/O bearing riding against the PP intermittently. My clutch mechanicals, linkage and hydraulics are completely new, including hose and line. I had read that Kaster recommends doing this and after all the time and money spent to finally get mine right, I wanted to complete the job with this addition.
I just need the instructions that TRF did not send and I'll just have to wait for them to call me back if no one here has them. I know that there is an adjustment of .100" at the end, but I want to see the rest of Kastner's detail about the setup.
OP
Brosky
Great Pumpkin
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Doc,
Supposed to be page 84 of Book #2. I just talked to TRF again and I'm not getting very far. I just checked my home email and it's not there yet.
Here's the link to their info and the part:
https://www.zeni.net/trf/TR6-250GC/71.php
Thanks for your help....
Supposed to be page 84 of Book #2. I just talked to TRF again and I'm not getting very far. I just checked my home email and it's not there yet.
Here's the link to their info and the part:
https://www.zeni.net/trf/TR6-250GC/71.php
Thanks for your help....
swift6
Yoda
Offline
The clutch slave on a TR6 is wholly different than a TR2-4 (which use both an adjustable push rod and a spring). It is a hydrostatic system that self adjusts (similar to the way that your brake caliper piston does). The only way an adjustable push rod will hold a usable adjustment on a TR6 is when it bottoms the piston out in the slave cylinder. If your going that route, you might as well install a TR4 slave cylinder since its designed to work like that in the first place.
On the other hand... Kas is still a business man and he very well could have a little financial interest in that part. I don't know for sure though. It won't hurt anything and if it provides you with 'peace of mind' then it could be worth it. But as a fix for a potential problem... its not.
On the other hand... Kas is still a business man and he very well could have a little financial interest in that part. I don't know for sure though. It won't hurt anything and if it provides you with 'peace of mind' then it could be worth it. But as a fix for a potential problem... its not.
Tosh
Jedi Trainee
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Hard to argue with Shawn. A (the) point of the hydraulics is that the system adjusts fluid requirements on demand as mechanical wear occurs.
Plus the fluid tends to dampen NVH as opposed to a cable or other non-hydraulic system.
If memory serves you have installed the 'Magic Clutch'. Mine has held up so far (3 years) but I still am not sure which is the preferred hole on the clutch release shaft arm. (where the slave cylinder rod clevis enters)
I have used both bottom and middle holes. Clutch action is about the same either location (hard).
Cheers.
Plus the fluid tends to dampen NVH as opposed to a cable or other non-hydraulic system.
If memory serves you have installed the 'Magic Clutch'. Mine has held up so far (3 years) but I still am not sure which is the preferred hole on the clutch release shaft arm. (where the slave cylinder rod clevis enters)
I have used both bottom and middle holes. Clutch action is about the same either location (hard).
Cheers.
Twosheds
Darth Vader
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Sorry Paul, had to go out and get some meds.
Page 84 doesn't give any instructions, just a couple of photos of the part, a recommendation for the part, and Walt Hollowell's contact information. Walt is the one who makes and sells the rod. I guess he sells them to TRF as well.
I don't have a TR6, but I would assume that the adjustment procedure is the same as for the TR3 adjustable rod, whick has just been discussed in this Forum. That's just an assumption; I have no idea.
I do have a friend with a TR6, I admit it, that bought the rod from Walt and put it in. I could pick his brain.
Page 84 doesn't give any instructions, just a couple of photos of the part, a recommendation for the part, and Walt Hollowell's contact information. Walt is the one who makes and sells the rod. I guess he sells them to TRF as well.
I don't have a TR6, but I would assume that the adjustment procedure is the same as for the TR3 adjustable rod, whick has just been discussed in this Forum. That's just an assumption; I have no idea.
I do have a friend with a TR6, I admit it, that bought the rod from Walt and put it in. I could pick his brain.
OP
Brosky
Great Pumpkin
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OK, the way that I understand it, and I do understand the theory behind hydraulic clutches, but never quite understand the nuances of the Triumphs, is that the .100" clearance that will remain after the installation is to insure that the clutch linkage is not putting unnecessary pressure on the T/O bearing, allowing it to ride against the PP.
The rod that is supplied from the factory is just long enough to allow pressure to be applied to the hydraulics, thus causing the arm to move the bearing forward. This will provide, just the minimum of slack to prevent that action from taking place.
At least, that's my understanding of it.
My reason for doing this is that sometimes, not all times, when I stop the car at idle, I can hear the bearing riding against the PP. Not always, but it does happen. I want to try to eliminate that before it becomes and issue. As you all know, I do not want to be pulling this apart again for a long, long time.
Yes, I do have the complete Magic Clutch It from TRF, less the evil Gunst bearing.
Tosh, I've always used the middle hole.
Doc, can you give me the contact info for Walt Hollowell?
Thanks,
The rod that is supplied from the factory is just long enough to allow pressure to be applied to the hydraulics, thus causing the arm to move the bearing forward. This will provide, just the minimum of slack to prevent that action from taking place.
At least, that's my understanding of it.
My reason for doing this is that sometimes, not all times, when I stop the car at idle, I can hear the bearing riding against the PP. Not always, but it does happen. I want to try to eliminate that before it becomes and issue. As you all know, I do not want to be pulling this apart again for a long, long time.
Yes, I do have the complete Magic Clutch It from TRF, less the evil Gunst bearing.
Tosh, I've always used the middle hole.
Doc, can you give me the contact info for Walt Hollowell?
Thanks,
OP
Brosky
Great Pumpkin
Offline
OK, here it is, direct from Mr. Hollowell himself. The reason for the adjustable rod is to eliminate that infernal grind of the T/O bearing against the pressure plate as I described above. According to Walt, this SHOULD clear the issue, particularly if all other parts are new, as mine are.
But with that being said, there is still the fact that every system has it's sloppiness or play, even hydraulic systems. So Shawn, no argument with your statement at all.
Doc, now that you've publicly admitted to having a friend with a TR6, I'd like to hear what he says about his before I actually install this little item.
But with that being said, there is still the fact that every system has it's sloppiness or play, even hydraulic systems. So Shawn, no argument with your statement at all.
Doc, now that you've publicly admitted to having a friend with a TR6, I'd like to hear what he says about his before I actually install this little item.
OP
Brosky
Great Pumpkin
Offline
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:]I'll ask him about the grinding. He calls every day. Probably envious of my TR3. [/QUOTE]
Oh, I'm sure that the TR3 is a big factor, along with your charm and wit.
I'd like to know for sure that he has no grinding after his install and if he has any clearance between the end of the rod and the slave cylinder.
Walt said to remove the old rod and make this one about 1/16 shorter and it should be fine.
Oh, I'm sure that the TR3 is a big factor, along with your charm and wit.
I'd like to know for sure that he has no grinding after his install and if he has any clearance between the end of the rod and the slave cylinder.
Walt said to remove the old rod and make this one about 1/16 shorter and it should be fine.
Twosheds
Darth Vader
Offline
Brosky said:
No grinding before or after installation. Craig's reason for installing the adjustable rod was to prevent the piston from moving out too far and falling on the road. This might fall into the "band-aid for another problem" category, I don't know.
Craig and some other LBCers and I made plans to meet at my house after work. Craig called me before I left work to say that he was at my house but without a working clutch. I left for home and as I turned onto my road, I saw a dark stain and something shiny on the asphalt. I stopped and picked up the shiny thing. It was a slave cylinder piston.
Hence the adjustable rod installation.
OP
Brosky
Great Pumpkin
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Interesting. I do not, nor have I ever had that problem. I will take this one step at at time. I'll get the car to the shop that has the drive on lift. With someone above in the car and it running, I'll closely examine the operation of the clutch linkage and slave cylinder and take some measurements.
I'll probably disconnect the linkage and see if the T/O bearing still seems to ride against the PP, after making sure that nothing moves after I remove the stock rod.
After that, I'll decide what I want to do. I may simply need to have a pull back spring and after three Gunst installs I have plenty of them. Ironically, those were designed to make sure that it did what I'm trying to prevent happening here.
Just a fun project for a Friday afternoon, now that I have the parts.
I'll probably disconnect the linkage and see if the T/O bearing still seems to ride against the PP, after making sure that nothing moves after I remove the stock rod.
After that, I'll decide what I want to do. I may simply need to have a pull back spring and after three Gunst installs I have plenty of them. Ironically, those were designed to make sure that it did what I'm trying to prevent happening here.
Just a fun project for a Friday afternoon, now that I have the parts.