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TR6 75 TR6 Questions

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irishcasey

Freshman Member
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Hi All,

I've been driving my TR for about three weeks since having it worked on and running after sitting for a very looooong time.

Two most recent issues I'm hoping you might shed some light on:

FIRST - Gas and Temp gauges are not working. I grounded the temp wire that attaches to the temperature sensor sender (transmitter) and turned the key to ON and the temp gauge moved fully up. So I assumed it was the voltage stabilizer. Replaced the voltage stabilizer Friday night and disappointedly watched as nothing happened with either gauge when I started the car. Incidentily, the old voltage stabilizer had a hardened, yellow blob that had oozed out of the housing. But now I'm looking to change the temperature sensor and I'm wondering if there is anything to note about replacing it. Last week I replaced the oil pressure switch and I'm hoping it's something along that order.

SECOND - I got stranded Friday night after driving about 7 miles. Rolled into a fire station and walked home. Car stalled as if not getting any gas. Was able to restart several times, give lots of gas pedal and limp to the fire station. Bought a gas filter (the one on it is only four weeks old) on the way to the car Saturday morning. Thought about changing the gas filter but low clearance, on a hill, etc. decided not to. Started the car and it seemed to be running fairly well. Got in and drove it home without pushing it. Let it run in the garage and it eventually died and then would keep dying. Long story short, I've been measuring the fuel with a wooden doll and it feels like the tip is in sand at the bottom of the tank. So I'm thinking that before trouble shooting more fuel filters, fuel pump, etc. I should get the tank cleaned. My neighbors friend owns a radiator shop and quoted me $195 to clean it with muratic acid and seal the tank. I'm no mechanic and my question is how difficult is it to remove the tank? Would you have the inside of the tank sealed or just cleaned? What else related to this would you recommend?

Sorry for the long post. Thanks for all input and comments !!
 
There shouldn't be any resistance in the tank. Removing the tank isn't a big deal but the vent lines and bolts can be a bit fiddly. What did the fuel filter look like?
 
irishcasey said:
I grounded the temp wire that attaches to the temperature sensor sender (transmitter) and turned the key to ON and the temp gauge moved fully up. So I assumed it was the voltage stabilizer.
Click to expand...
Actually, that would prove that it is not the VS.

Changing the sensor usually isn't too hard, but I would suggest using a 6-point socket or flare-nut wrench if you have one. Sometimes they can be a bit tight, and the brass rounds easily. A little PTFE paste on the threads will help ensure it comes out easily next time.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:] Incidentily, the old voltage stabilizer had a hardened, yellow blob that had oozed out of the housing. [/QUOTE]
Under that blob is a factory adjustment. The yellow blob locks it in place.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:] I'm no mechanic and my question is how difficult is it to remove the tank? Would you have the inside of the tank sealed or just cleaned? What else related to this would you recommend?[/QUOTE]
As I recall, the tank comes out fairly easily. Personally I would probably just clean it myself and save the $200, but I do tend towards being "penny wise and pound foolish". Be sure to ask your friend of a friend what guarantee he offers against ethanol attacking the sealer. Likely its fine, but some of the sealers sold not too many years ago would not stand up to ethanol and resulted in a huge mess.

One of the little Facet fuel pumps makes a decent transfer pump (to remove the fuel in the tank) and can also be handy as a spare (in case the mechanical pump quits at an inopportune moment).

You might want to have a look at your fuel pump as well, since I believe that even in 75, the original diaphragms would not stand up to ethanol.
 
tdskip - Thanks. The fuel filter looked like a dark amber and had some black specs moving in it. Also it had bubbles coming from the line out to the fuel pump. Can you explain more regarding your comments on the vent lines.
 
Thank you Randall. I guess that time behind the dash was a "learning experience." I learned quite a bit from your post. PTFE? Is there a brand name and where to buy this? Sounds like this is a paste/liquid not like a teflon thread tape.

When you mention Facet fuel pump, you mean to transfer gas out of the tank but also be available to mount in the engine if the mechanical fuel pump stops working? Do you recommend moving to an electrical one if a replacement is needed in the future?

Also, can the diaphragm in the fuel pump be changed/updated?

Would you recommend changing the fuel sending unit given the age and the fact that the fuel gauge isn't working. Thanks !!
 
PTFE is generic for teflon, you should be able to pick up the paste at any hardware store, plumbing supply or "big box" (Lowes, Menards, Home Depot, etc). Although it's messier, I prefer the paste over the tape because there is no way for 'strings' to break off inside the engine.

I prefer the original mechanical pump, but there are arguments both ways. The electric is a lot easier to press into service on the side of the road and can also be handy if you need to lend or borrow a gallon during a caravan. Be sure to get one with the right pressure rating (2.5 psi IIRC).
https://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/eppages/facetpumps.php

Yes, the diaphragm can be replaced, for example TRF sells a rebuild kit under P/N RFK1401. I haven't done a TR6 pump, but the TR3 pump is similar and isn't too hard.

On the gauge, I would want to confirm that the problem is the sender before spending money on a new sender. Same test as you did for the temp gauge, remove the wire from the sender and temporarily short it to ground. If the gauge starts climbing for full, the sender is the problem (or else the tank is empty :smile: )
 
the tank should pretty much drain it self if you take the gas line loose before the fuel pump and add a piece of hose and stick it in a gas can, the tank is higher than the fuel pump. the only difficult part getting the tank out is the vent nipple in the tank filler neck, once you get it loose I found to put a piece of rubber fuel line on the nipple and use it as a flexible extension and then you can unscrew the nipple pretty easy, its hard to get your fingers to the nipple, there is also a rubber neck that connects the gas lid to the tank, you have to get that vent nipple off before you can get the gas cap off, I believe

Hondo
 
The other alternative is to buy a new tank from e-bay for about $60 more then getting yours cleaned and repaired. I don't know about the quality of the tanks that this guy is offering. I bought a new tank for my TR3 from another seller on e-bay that I'm very happy with. For me, the extra cost for a new tank wasn't enough for me to go ahead and clean and repair the old one.
 
To add one more item to check on the fuel tank sender...
As Randall says, it is best to check things out before buying a new sender. Another thing to check is the plastic float on the sender arm. Over time and with exposure to ethanol, sometimes the float will leak and fill with fuel; this causes it not to float and will give an "Empty" reading on the fuel gauge.
Floats can be replaced if needed.
 
Thank you all for your help !!

Update - Replaced the temperature sender tonight and added PTFE paste to the threads. Came off easy and went on easy. Ran engine until warm and temp gauge works and registered just under half way. :banana:

Regarding the fuel gauge. Accessed the sender unit and grounded the green wire and fuel gauge raises to full. Grounded the black (ground) wire and gauge doesn't respond. From what I understand that means problem with the sending unit.

I think I've gotten up enough confidence to remove the tank this weekend. Seems as though I will need a new sender unit. Wondering if I should replace all the rubber hoses in the fuel lines? Moss seems to offer two sizes, do you know what size fits where? Also is there any need to clean the metal section of lines and if so, how is that done?

Randall, you mentioned a Facet electric pump to unload the gas tank. Sorry for the dumb question but can you describe how to power that unit for that purpose. Thx.
 
irishcasey said:
Wondering if I should replace all the rubber hoses in the fuel lines?
Click to expand...

I recommend getting fuel hose at your local auto parts store. The hose I have ordered online has not lasted more than a couple years before getting soft and leaking.

Just last week I had the lines on both sides of my fuel filter leak a puddle. Replaced them with Gates fuel hose.
 
My fuel sender wasn’t working either, with the same symptoms as yours.

I figured I couldn’t make it any worse by pulling it and seeing if I determine why it failed. After carefully undoing the screws and maneuvering the sender and its shaft/float out the hole, I found that just the sender body and the resistance wire were both coated with something that looked like hard-water calcium deposit or sand (a really fine granular white material that had stuck to everything on the sender). No similar deposits on the inside of the tank that I could see thru the little hole. A few minutes with some CRC Contact Cleaner and Corrosion-X on the wire and its wiper and it works fine now.

Interestingly enough, I had the same issue with the sender out of my boat last year. As the boat and TR6 are both recent purchases, I have no idea how they had been treated but it seems possible that the fuel itself could be a contributor?

Ron
 
irishcasey said:
Randall, you mentioned a Facet electric pump to unload the gas tank. Sorry for the dumb question but can you describe how to power that unit for that purpose. Thx.
Click to expand...
Either the car battery, or an ordinary battery charger will work fine. Just observe the polarity (positive to the red wire on the pump).

I keep a few of these https://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2062661 in my on-board kit.
 
dogdad said:
Interestingly enough, I had the same issue with the sender out of my boat last year. As the boat and TR6 are both recent purchases, I have no idea how they had been treated but it seems possible that the fuel itself could be a contributor?
Click to expand...
Makes sense to me. At least the stuff they sell here in CA seems to dry to a hard, white deposit that does not dissolve in carb cleaner, acetone or fresh fuel. I've had several cases now where I had to chip it away with a dental pick or similar.
 
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