BJ8 Second Gear Needed

[AUSMHLY]

I need to replace my BJ8 2nd gear. Not only is the coating gone, the surface has worn so much that a new steel baulk rings slides up the edge of the gear and spins. It's my understanding that some new steel baulk rings aren't good. I will be replacing 2,3,4 with new ones from DW.

Does the 3000, 3000MkII (Side Shift) 2nd Gear AEC3357 (27 teeth) use the same gear as the BJ8? I found one that appears to be in good condition. (I'll be visiting the mechanic later this week and will count the teeth on the BJ8 gear for comparison).

Anyone know who has one for sale?
I will reach out to BCS and Welch to see what they have.

Welch makes replacement gears. Maybe the reason they don't make the 2nd is because it's made out of unobtainium. I'm finding more and more parts were made of that.

 

[BobHaskell]

You might contact Leo Ruof in Columbus Ohio. He rebuilds Austin-Healey gearboxes and overdrives.

 

[Bob McElwee]

You could also try Healey Surgeons.

 

[John Turney]

Does the 3000, 3000MkII (Side Shift) 2nd Gear AEC3357 (27 teeth) use the same gear as the BJ8? I found one that appears to be in good condition. (I'll be visiting the mechanic later this week and will count the teeth on the BJ8 gear for comparison).

No. The BJ8 part # is 22B 145. The side shift is either AEC3357 (early) or AEC3469 (late). Your 2nd gear has 29 teeth and the earlier ones have 28.

 

[Jerry]

Call Kent Lambert who bought Bill Bolton parts. 541 490 5674. He knows tons about Healeys and I am sure could answer your question about the gear also.

 

[AUSMHLY]

Finding 2nd gears is a challenge. Here are some photos of the one I just received.
Some of coating has been chipped or worn off, is this normal wear? Are the small pointed gears (what's the correct name for those) ok, normal wear?

1st photo is my 2nd gear. There's no coating and the baulk rings spins freely.
Other photos of the used 2nd I received.
Please let me know if I should use it or should I return it.
Thank you for you help.

 

[Bob_Spidell]

Caveat: I'm working from memory here (no photos, unfortunately).

I recall wear similar to your 2nd and 4th photos on my BJ8's 2nd gear (I replaced the 3/4 cluster). Since, as you've found, 2nd gears are difficult to find, and I wasn't having any issues with my 2nd--the gearbox would pop out of 4th--I re-installed it. My 2nd works OK, similar to 2nd on my BN2, which I haven't gotten into (note 2nd gear probably gets shifted into/out of more than the others). I think if your synchro doesn't slip without extreme force you will be OK; however, the wear on your 1st and 3rd photos seems to be worse, almost like they're of different pieces. My 2nd also had some wear--maybe a bit less--on its teeth.

Looking into this online, I found some other 'discrepancies:' The term 'baulk ring' is used differently at different sources. DWM's catalog shows 'baulk rings' as what we call 'synchros' on this side of The Pond, but this explanatory site shows differently:

Baulk Pin Synchromesh | Automotive Terminology Explained

Baulk Pin Synchromesh - Automotive Technical Terms Explained in the Unique Cars Auto Dictionary

www.uniquecarsandparts.com.au

So, is a 'baulk ring' a set of pre-engaging teeth, or a conical 'clutch?'

 

[AUSMHLY]

Hello Bob, I'm calling the "synchro" a baulk ring because I'm buying new 2,3,4 "baulk rings" from DW.

"the wear on your 1st and 3rd photos seems to be worse, almost like they're of different pieces."

Good eye! As I pointed out in my prior email, 1st photo is my bad 2nd gear showing there is no coating left on the hub. 3rd photo is the used 2nd I just got.

History, I had some issues getting into 2nd (didn't grind though) so the synchro was replaced with a new one from Moss. 150 miles later, couldn't get into 2nd at all. It would grind as if I wasn't using the clutch. Opened the tranny to find all the coating was completely gone from 2nd. (I wonder if the new Moss synchro had anything to do with removing all the coating.) Guy who installed the moss synchro didn't mention anything to me about the 2nd gears condition. He also had a hard time getting the OD on and it didn't work when I got the tranny back because he damaged the pumps roller head.

So now I have this used 2nd and asking if I should use it or try to find a better used one.

Thanks for replying Bob

 

[red57]

I see two problems with the replacement you received.
First, the built-up synchro surface is very rough and looks like some of the material has chipped/worn away. I think this would cause excessive wear on the new synchro rings. And, if any more of the built-up material flakes off, you could have metal bits floating around in your box.
Second, the engagement teeth on your original are still quite sharp which helps with smooth easy engagement and the ones on the replacement are quite rounded/worn which will make engagement more difficult.

 

[Bob_Spidell]

Clarifying: I disregarded your 1st photo, since it was of your old 2nd gear. '1st' and '3rd' and '2nd and 4th' refer to your four photos of the 'new' used 2nd you procured. At any rate, you probably have enough material for your 2nd to work OK (again, I'm not a hexpert). I dunno if Randy F does this anymore, but I think he recommended building-up the conical surface with some kind of coating; it might be worth considering.

I recall years ago, there was an issue with poorly-machined synchro/baulk rings causing some issues; presumably this has been corrected. I bought DWM's synchros for my last rebuild, and they work OK; some occasional issues getting into 3rd (have to speed match accurately to avoid slight grinding).

 

[rossco]

Tell me about affixing a magnet to the inside surface of the oil filler plug. Any comments?

 

[AUSMHLY]

DW sells a tranny magnet drain plug.

 

[AUSMHLY]

Clarifying: I disregarded your 1st photo, since it was of your old 2nd gear. '1st' and '3rd' and '2nd and 4th' refer to your four photos of the 'new' used 2nd you procured. At any rate, you probably have enough material for your 2nd to work OK (again, I'm not a hexpert). I dunno if Randy F does this anymore, but I think he recommended building-up the conical surface with some kind of coating; it might be worth considering.

Bob, "1st photo". Your clarification totally makes sense. As you've pointed out, there are two 1st photos.
Sorry I didn't pick up on that, my bad. Apology. Thank you Bob.

 

[AUSMHLY]

I now have another 2nd gear. The coating looks much better. One gear is chipped. I showed this to the mechanic and he said you might want to file the cut out edge of the chip smooth. Your thoughts?

When looking at one of my other gears he said it looks like the hard coating is coming off, and that it will wear quicker because of that. I'll assume he has trained eyes, for I could not see any coating. Is what he says true? (I'm attaching photos of my newly acquired 2nd gear. It looks original. I don't see any "hard coating").

The welded rebuilt laygears seem to have a dark coating. (photo attached) What is that coating?

Next to that laygear, you'll see the 2nd gear I bought and showing close up photos. Your thoughts about the chip in the tooth? File the edge of that chip or not?

Thanks guys

 

[Editor_Reid]

Good job on the photography.

 

[AUSMHLY]

Thanks Reid.
iPhone 7. It's the angle, getting the light right and patience.
No camera studio, white umbrellas, white cardboard boxes, expensive camera here. I don't have the money for that. I'm spending it on AH parts.

 

[LAW75]

So...Roger, what is the status of your gear fix? Need to get your car on the road, man.