TR6 New member intro and TR6 gearbox leak question

[SpannerMan]

Dear all, I have been lurking for a while, and have just signed up. I have owned my 71 TR6 for about 10 years, and have done a lot of mechanical work to it during that time. It doesn't have a rust problem- the frame has been patched on the rear trailing arm members before my ownership though. Probably the low point was when I sheared the right front wheel studs on a hard low speed left turn- lost the wheel and creased the fender- luckily I stopped about a foot short of the kerb though and avoided impact that way. Anyway that's another story... five years back now... The car is the Sienna brown, with New Tan interior, also I have Dayton painted wheels and the Vredestein 185R15 tires. Oh, and it has SU H6's off I think a TR3- the floatbowls are angled over and the hood clearance is marginal (actually it rubs a little on the front dashpot top- I have a rubber pad wrapped around the top of the carb), but it does run well on them (I never could get the Strombergs tuned- too worn I think).

I do have the A-type overdrive which has been worked fine since I put it in (1998). This summer I switched to the Redline MT90 manual trans. lube, after having read about it here and elsewhere. It's leaking more now, as I had thought it might but hoped it wouldn't. One of the leaks is out of the output shaft seal- which leads me to my question(s).... Has anyone here replaced that seal with the gearbox/OD in the car? I imagine it is the same job with or without the OD. Basically I've got to drop the propshaft, remove the output flange, and try to get the seal out. I've struggled with those before- sometimes they rust in and are really hard to get out.

Eager to hear any advice, and I'll chime in on other things if I think I have anything to add.

Thanks a lot! Pete

 

[jerrybny]

Welcome Pete. I am curious about the answer to you seal question. My 73 TR6 leaks a little and was wondering the same thing.

 

[Rick O.]

Welcome Pete. Our O/D gearboxes don't go well with synthetic lubricants, so you should swap the Redline out. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/nonono.gif And you should know that the manufacturer of the A-type O/D (Laycock) specified non-detergent 30W motor oil as the lubricant. Go with that and ignore Triumph's recommendaton to use gear oil. If you need further convincing (I know it's hard to resist the temptation to put synthetic lubricants in), visit John Esposito's website at QuantumMechanics and read the tech article.

I have not disassembled my A O/D, so I can't give you an experienced-based answer on the seal. But I would guess a gearbox R&R would be necessary. But I'd swap the Redline out first and see if the leak lessens.

Good luck.

 

[Cain]

I successfully replaced the rear seal on my non-OD '71 TR6 gearbox last year. I did it with the tranny attached, but you do have to remove the gearbox cover and driveshaft and get them out of the way. The only problem was the huge nut within the end of the output shaft on the tranny. I believe it's a 1-1/4" nut. You have to go at it with a socket because you can't get a wrench around it since it is countersunk within the flange.

IIRC, I had to get a neighbor to hold the flange with a pipe wrench while I went after the large nut with the longest ratchet I could find. (Originally, I thought I could put the tranny in gear to hold the flange still, but this didn't work for me for some reason.) The nut finally came loose after a few minutes of pounding the ratchet with a mallet and jumping up and down on it.

Once you get the nut out, the rest of the job is easy.

 

[SpannerMan]

Thanks for the replies...

Rick. O. - Thanks for the link to Quantum Mechanics. I think it was right around June this year that I made the swap - same time that article is dated. I read quite a few articles before deciding to try the redline, including the following, plus a thread on this forum that was very positive about the improved shifting (which I too found). From what I have seen, the main 'con' is the increased likelihood of leakage, still seems to be the case based on the QM article.

https://www.myaustinhealey.com/austin_healey_technical_articles.html

The Redline is really runny, and from what I recall the MT90 was the heaviest one available.

Where does one get the 30W nondetergent oil? I'd appreciate info on that. That's probably what I'll end up doing. How is your shifting in the morning when it's chilly (say 30-40F)? The biggest problem for me with the old stuff (GL4 gear oil) was the synchronizer action - especially 1st-2nd - in the warmup. With the redline I can shift to second with two fingers straight away.

Cain - Thanks for your information. I wasn't thinking I would need to remove the gearbox cover, hoping to go in from underneath. Perhaps doable if you've got a lift, otherwise too hard to get the car up high enough to get a long enough breaker bar. And then the issue with the motor turning over when you turn the nut. How did the pipe wrench grip onto the flange - is there a flat or something? I guess one could alternatively bolt a piece of angle iron or something to the flange and get that to jam against the ground. Good to hear the seal extraction itself wasn't tough.



Thanks guys. Pete

 

[Rick O.]

[ QUOTE ]
Thanks for the replies...

[/ QUOTE ]
UR Welcome!
[ QUOTE ]

Where does one get the 30W nondetergent oil? I'd appreciate info on that. That's probably what I'll end up doing. How is your shifting in the morning when it's chilly (say 30-40F)? The biggest problem for me with the old stuff (GL4 gear oil) was the synchronizer action - especially 1st-2nd - in the warmup. With the redline I can shift to second with two fingers straight away.


[/ QUOTE ]I can get Valvoline ND 30W in western PA at Advance Auto. Check your local franchises and if you don't spot it, have them order a case for you. I've never run synthetic anything or gear oil in my A O/D, so I don't have a shift comparison. I will say that although it might not be an easy 2-finger drop into 2nd, it surely isn't unpleasant with the 30W dino in there. No doubt, if I could use syn in there, I would (I use syn in the rest of my fleet for extended drain intervals). Plus I feel better knowing I'm doing what Laycock intended. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

 

[Cain]

Pete,

Actually, you may be able to go underneath if - as you say - you can get the car up high enough. Now that I think about it, I was in the process of putting the car back together, and the cover was already off. So, it may not be necessary to remove it.

 

[SpannerMan]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Thanks for the replies...

[/ QUOTE ]
UR Welcome!
[ QUOTE ]

Where does one get the 30W nondetergent oil? I'd appreciate info on that. That's probably what I'll end up doing. How is your shifting in the morning when it's chilly (say 30-40F)? The biggest problem for me with the old stuff (GL4 gear oil) was the synchronizer action - especially 1st-2nd - in the warmup. With the redline I can shift to second with two fingers straight away.


[/ QUOTE ]I can get Valvoline ND 30W in western PA at Advance Auto. Check your local franchises and if you don't spot it, have them order a case for you. I've never run synthetic anything or gear oil in my A O/D, so I don't have a shift comparison. I will say that although it might not be an easy 2-finger drop into 2nd, it surely isn't unpleasant with the 30W dino in there. No doubt, if I could use syn in there, I would (I use syn in the rest of my fleet for extended drain intervals). Plus I feel better knowing I'm doing what Laycock intended. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

Thanks - I'll take a look to see if I can find the 30W ND somewhere. Pete

 

[SpannerMan]

[ QUOTE ]
Pete,

Actually, you may be able to go underneath if - as you say - you can get the car up high enough. Now that I think about it, I was in the process of putting the car back together, and the cover was already off. So, it may not be necessary to remove it.

[/ QUOTE ]

That's good to know- I don't fancy pulling out the interior again.

 

[SpannerMan]

A quick followup. I found Shell ND30 at Advance here in Maryland. Interesting warnings on the bottle sort of to the effect of 'don't put this in your motor unless you actually want it to throw a rod...' As often seems to happen, even though it seemed like a pretty substantial leak it was only down a little bit, just a little bit below the fill plug. Having looked more, I really think it would be hard to change that rear seal lying on your back underneath the car- don't see how I could get it high enough on jack stands. Better to go in from above if you were going to do it. I think I'll wait until I have another reason to be in there. Pete