Help - can't get my bugeye started

[ichthos]

Hello,

I have a recently restored bugeye which I finished last summer. Everything is like new for the most part. It has started up fine until a week ago. Now, when I pull out the starter switch, the dash lights dim, the instruments go dead, and I get nothing from the starter. When I ran a wire directly form the battery to the starter, it did the same thing. Doesn't this indicate a bad starter? I did pull it and bench tested it a few months ago.It seemed to work fine then. It is NOS, but I still think this is my problem. The battery is fully charged, and I have checked grounds which are extremely clean. I admit I am very frustrated at this point. Any ideas would greatly be appreciated.

I am trying to keep things stock, but I have heard this is typical behavior for a bugeye starter. If this is true, can some point me to one that is reliable and a source? Thanks for your time.

Kevin

 

[JPSmit]

Might be a bad ground.

 

[Sarastro]

Well could be a bad starter. Also could be a bad battery. You might want to get the battery load tested. A battery can seem good with light loads but go belly up with heavier ones like the starter.

JP could be right. A bad ground connection for the grounded terminal of the battery could do this. And, you were asking about that recently...

 

[Pythias]

The easy check for the strength of the battery is to honk the horn. If it honks loud and clear, your battery is fine.. if not, it's a weak battery and you need to track down the leakage. You say the battery IS fully charged, but don't mention how you know. IF the battery indeed IS, then the problem is in the starter. Try tapping it with a hammer to unstick the solenoid. It could be jammed, causing it to draw so much current that everything else goes dim. Don't test it too long or you'll burn up the wiring.

 

[JPSmit]

And you should be able to ground the starter quite easily to test.

 

[ichthos]

I checked the horn as suggested, and it works. What do you mean I can ground the starter to test it, JP? I did hit the starter with a hammer with no change. Still the same symptoms - tun the key and the dash lights go dim. Still sound like a starter problem?
Kevin

 

[JPSmit]

The starter Grounds through the engine. Attach a wire from the starter to the body. Just not a painted part.

 

[Pythias]

One last try to unstick (If it is indeed stuck that is). Try putting the car in gear and rocking it, or put a wrench on the crank bolt to turn the engine. A smidgen should be all it takes, IF, and that's a big IF the gears of the starter are jammed against the ring gear itself. .. If, after you try that and then hit the starter and again nothing happens, it's probably time to pull the starter off to bench check it.

 

[ichthos]

I will try your suggestions tomorrow. I have one of those batter testers that light up showing the particular voltage. I have a starter I will try too to see if that does anything - it is able to start cars with a totally dead battery.
Thanks for the help.
Kevin

 

[Jim_Gruber]

One thing to check is the Bendix Drive stuck? There is a little 1/4" nut on the end of the Starter that sticks out. I've had it happen several time where the Bendix did not retract and the starter cannot engage as the starter needs to wind itself up and give the starter the opportunity to start turning before the Bendix engages. Take a 1/4 wrench, the smallest one in the toolbox and try turning in the nut on the end of the starter. I'll bet this is your problem. I carry a super short adjustable box wrench in Bugsy for this very event that I know will happen again at the least opportune moment. When stuck the end of the Bendix sticks out 1/2" - 5/8". Wind the Bendix back in, it only takes 1-2 turns to retract and you'll be good to go.

 

[ichthos]

Does it matter what direction I turn it?
Kevin

 

[MichiganTed]

Doesn't matter which direction you turn the nut on the back of the starter. Your just checking to see if the starter is free to turn or seized and at the same time rotating the armature (similar to cracking it with a hammer - only better). The hammer trick tries to get the starter brushes to contact the next area on the commentator - turning the nut ensures it.

Do you hear the solenoid click?

 

[Billm]

Ted- it is a Bugeye, with a manual solenoid
BillM

 

[RichBall]

Kevin,

Does the starter make any noise? If it is a bound up starter it would hum as it was trying to spin. If the starter drive was bad it should spin but not engage the flywheel. It might not make any noise if the power lug was broken in the starter for some reason, but otherwise you problem is most likely upstream from the starter.

Try these things.

Pull the battery and have it load tested at an auto parts store. A battery can and may show full voltage and not have the amps to power the starter. You can't be sure with just a voltage test. It may seam like a waste of time, but then you can fully eliminate the battery as a potential problem.

Are you getting voltage to the starter when you pull the switch? Connect you meter to the power lug on the starter and watch it as you pull the switch. If you don't see voltage you need to look upstream. Possibly the cable or the solenoid. Cables can look perfect on the outside and be completely corroded and broken down under the insulation.

As JP said check you engine ground. The cable off the battery grounds the car to the battery, but there will be another ground strap that grounds the car to the engine. It is usually a braded cable that runs from the body to somewhere on the engine or transmission. On mine I made up an additional cable that grounds the battery directly to one of the starter mounting bolts in addition to the standard ground strap. Makes for a nice short path for the high amp draw for the starter.

 

[ichthos]

Sorry it took so long to try out all of the suggestions. But good news- it started! I ran a wire from the starer bolt to the negative side of the batter and hooked up my portable starter from Costco, and it started right up. (I had run the battery down by leaving the ignition key turned on all night). In hindsight I should have done one thing at a time to isolate the problem. When I removed the grounding strap and charger it still starts right up now. So now I am not sure what the actual problem is. Either way, I a will run a grounding strap from the starter bolt to the negative side of the battery as you suggested, Rich. I don't suppose you could show me a picture of your cable, tell me the thickness, and length? I will take in my battery this week to get checked out just to make sure that was not a problem.Thanks again everyone for your help.
Kevin

 

[rkep01]

If you have a Harbor Freight near you or can wait a few days for shipping this is a great tool for checking battery condition and the price is right. I have one and can say that it works great.

 

[MichiganTed]

Right! I haven't rebuilt one of those since Jr High School,

 

[ichthos]

Thanks for the tip on the battery load tester. I actually have a HF not too far from me.
Kevin