Why carry spares?

[tahoe healey]

Nice day so we went to the wine country in the Healey. Bought a dozen bottles of wine. On the way home the fuel pump stops (that will sober you up fast). OK, no problem, I carry a spare. Unload the wine from the boot and all the other junk I carry there. Pull out the spare fuel pump from under the battery. Bolt it on and fuel spills from the top AND and bottom gaskets. Remove wheel again, remove fuel pump again and take points from new pump and install on the original pump. So, if I hadn't had the spare, I wouldn't have had parts.
While we were on the side of the road, nice people in a 50's Rolls Royce stopped. No help there and they didn't even have any Grey Poupon. A couple in a Sprite came by and waited till we got going and followed us home, some 70 miles. Fortunately they live 3 miles away at Lake Tahoe. Small world or what?
So now I know I have to repair the previously, professionally rebuilt pump before out trek to Bent OR.

 

[Jerry]

Good job on the repair! I had the same problem once, now I have two pumps installed and can switch between the two if needed. I hate crawling under the car.

Jerry
BJ8

 

[Keoke]

JUst get rid of the points and you will be good to go.-Keoke :friendly_wink:

Man that is a nice picture.

 

[RAC68]

Great Picture.

Back in 1989, I and 4 other BC owners started the Positive Earth Drivers Club. When considering names, the name I supported was “Bonnets Up” … the typical view many had of BCs at that time. One early member was overly insecure when on the road in his BT7 and carried every conceivable spare in his boot. On one 3-day run to Conclave, his cache of spares rescued no less than 4 disabled Healeys before a rear spring collapsed under the stress of weight and a very rough road. With no spare for that condition, a flatbed was required to get back to the show where another Healey owner did have a spare spring.

I am always amazed by the things carried or installed on BCs for that “Just in Case” moment. I have carried the points-setup for the last 25 years just in case my CD ignition fails. When the original Alison did fail, it was easier to flatbed then remember how and convert the ignition back to points. Although I do carry a replacement head unit for my fuel pump, it was not long ago when testing a new experimental optical trigger for my SU pump that my points-based trigger failed on the road. It took about 15 minutes to remove the wheel and exchange head units but over an hour explaining the new optical unit to those that stopped to assist.

I agree that carrying spares is appropriate for our cars but how many and what is reasonable to carry?

Good luck,
Ray (64BJ8P1)

 

[Healey Nut]

Install the electronic version of the SU fuel pump .looks identical still has the tick and saves space in the boot as you wont need to carry spares .

 

[AUSMHLY]

JUst get rid of the points and you will be good to go.-Keoke :friendly_wink:

Man that is a nice picture.

+1
Also nice to see owners (Rich) that work on their own cars.

 

[Keoke]

+1
Also nice to see owners (Rich) that work on their own cars.

HE did not have a choice.


Install the electronic version of the SU fuel pump .looks identical still has the tick and saves space in the boot as you wont need to carry spares .

Healy Nut that what I been tri en to tell { Rich } for the longest times.-Keoke-layful:

 

[tahoe healey]

Where is the fun it that? I am considering installing the spare in line with the first pump. I'm just investigating the "how?".
I spent the day rebuilding both pumps so I'm good for now.

 

[Ed_K]

I put in one of those double ended electronic SU pumps with dual switches and indicator lights into the center console. You won't have to cut up your original hard fuel lines if you do that and still have a backup available without getting out of your car..... and yes, I had a failure of one of those single sided SU electronic pumps so that is why I installed the dual ended SU. You will have to fabricate the bracket base to replace the standard fuel pump bracket. Ed

 

[RAC68]

Although the electronic SU will eliminate the need for periodic point dressing or replacing, a point trigger failure is something you can address on the road and get home but an electronic failure results in a call for a flatbed (unless you carry a replacement). I appreciate the extended reliability expected of the electronic unit but I have heard of too many failures to forget about the possibility or have Keoke’s positive attitude or opinion on the subject.

Although the SU pump runs on 12 – 15 volts, it is not uncommon for these units to induce several hundred volts into the circuits as a result of the involvement of an active coil (similar to the relation between ignition points and the coil). That induced voltage is controlled by the circuitry included within the triggering mechanism of the electronic pump but there are many cases where this has failed and a high voltage spike has killed the electronics of the pump. Given even a low potential for failure, when it fails it is dead and can not be revived. This is a case of either having a spare (separate or already plumbed in) or call a flatbed.

Put in perspective, my original points-based SU pump ran 25 years without an issue and was replaced as part of a restoration in 1989. Since installing a Transient-Voltage Suppression (TVS) which grounds excessive voltage, the present pump should last longer then I do but I do carry a spare for just that time it doesn’t.

Ray (64BJ8P1)

 

[Healey Nut]

Ten years and counting on my electronic SU pump and still ticking fine .....how many times have you pulled the points apart in ten yrs or broken out the crescent hammer and given it a good whack in the last ten yrs ?

 

[Bob_Spidell]

Side note: Bought some new pump points the other day, installed them then had the pump converted to electronic by Dave DuBois (who does rebuilds and conversions to electronic as a 'hobby'). The new points had burned after only a few hundred miles. Dave confirmed sub-par points are being sold--they look to be made of silver or some other glossy metal instead of tungsten. Buyer beware.

 

[Keoke]

I do carry a spare ELECTRONIC for just that time it doesn’t.

--I thought you was gonna say you went back to POINTS !!--kEOKE.:wink-new:

However, it is extremely unlikely that type problem will occur.

A more significant source of that type of voltage transient occurs in the overdrive solenoid .

Even there if the solenoid pullin operates correctly the energy in that pulse is just a few Milli Joules which will not damage anything.

 

[RAC68]

Bob, I would prefer Dave’s electronic conversion over a new electronic SU pump. Dave has support our efforts to developing the optical trigger for the pump and, I believe has addressed the power issue within his electronic conversion.

In answer to the question posed by the Healey Nut, I have not serviced the points from 1989, when the pump was first installed, until the installation of a TVS diode 2 years ago.

Tungsten points do oxidize when not in use and are cleaned when a high enough voltage passes. However, if the voltage is too high, as with the hundreds of volts induced by the coil’s involvement in the circuit, the points will foul and burn. With the installation of a Transient-Voltage Suppression (TVS) diode, voltages exceeding the diode-selected limit will be shunted to ground. The diode I have chosen has a limit of 22 volts which is sufficient to keep the pump running with a faulty voltage regulator as well as high enough to clean the tungsten points, but not high enough to burn them. With the TVS diode in place, I don’t expect the points will need any attention for years. However, that is yet to be experienced.

Please don’t misunderstand, I am not negative on the electronic SU, only that they are not invulnerable and when they fail, you will have the choice of a spare pump or flatbed. So, should you carry a spare? Do your carry a spare pump for your every-day car?

Ray (64BJ8P1)

 

[Healey Nut]

I got my first Healey for my 40th (11yrs ago) it was the 64 which I am now restoring . All the time I had it on the road it only let me down once the original owner put an aftermarket el cheapo fuel pump on it and when out for a drive one day the pump started to overheat and lock up . Simply sitting by the roadside and allowing it to cool for a while got me home . I then installed the electronic SU and have never had an issue since . The only other problem I have had were with my newly restored 67 ,these were a bad battery , low voltage from the voltage regulator and fuel vapour lock . All easily fixed with no flat bed needed .
The only spares I carry are dizzy cap rotor arm points and condensor and a fan belt .
Where do you draw the line ...fuel pump , spare distributor , water pump , shock absorber, brake pads , clutch disc , hydraulic lines , battery , voltage regulator etc etc etc... heck why not toss a new tranny in the boot for luck lol ..... Guess it all depends on how much faith you put in your car . I did all the mechanical resoration myself and have faith in it .
I also have CAA flatbed coverage ........Which I have never needed as yet .
What spare parts do you carry in your everyday driver ......windsheild fluid and thats about it I bet ?

 

[Keoke]

I would prefer Dave’s electronic conversion over a new electronic SU pump.

WHY !!:
You are still dealing with points.

We did that back in the late 80's before anyone built a true electronic pump.:friendly_wink:

 

[Bob_Spidell]

Bob, I would prefer Dave’s electronic conversion over a new electronic SU pump. Dave has support our efforts to developing the optical trigger for the pump and, I believe has addressed the power issue within his electronic conversion.

In answer to the question posed by the Healey Nut, I have not serviced the points from 1989, when the pump was first installed, until the installation of a TVS diode 2 years ago.

Tungsten points do oxidize when not in use and are cleaned when a high enough voltage passes. However, if the voltage is too high, as with the hundreds of volts induced by the coil’s involvement in the circuit, the points will foul and burn. With the installation of a Transient-Voltage Suppression (TVS) diode, voltages exceeding the diode-selected limit will be shunted to ground. The diode I have chosen has a limit of 22 volts which is sufficient to keep the pump running with a faulty voltage regulator as well as high enough to clean the tungsten points, but not high enough to burn them. With the TVS diode in place, I don’t expect the points will need any attention for years. However, that is yet to be experienced.

Please don’t misunderstand, I am not negative on the electronic SU, only that they are not invulnerable and when they fail, you will have the choice of a spare pump or flatbed. So, should you carry a spare? Do your carry a spare pump for your every-day car?

Ray (64BJ8P1)

One of Dave's electronic conversions failed on me at about 3K miles. Will be contacting him soon to see what he suggests.

 

[steveg]

If we were all running Facet pumps, doubt this thread would exist.

 

[Keoke]

If we were all running Facet pumps, doubt this thread would exist.

YEP !!
WE would be bemoaning why we ever left the " SU"---:lol:

 

[AUSMHLY]

I got my first Healey for my 40th (11yrs ago) it was the 64 which I am now restoring . All the time I had it on the road it only let me down once the original owner put an aftermarket el cheapo fuel pump on it and when out for a drive one day the pump started to overheat and lock up . Simply sitting by the roadside and allowing it to cool for a while got me home . I then installed the electronic SU and have never had an issue since . The only other problem I have had were with my newly restored 67 ,these were a bad battery , low voltage from the voltage regulator and fuel vapour lock . All easily fixed with no flat bed needed .
The only spares I carry are dizzy cap rotor arm points and condensor and a fan belt .
Where do you draw the line ...fuel pump , spare distributor , water pump , shock absorber, brake pads , clutch disc , hydraulic lines , battery , voltage regulator etc etc etc... heck why not toss a new tranny in the boot for luck lol ..... Guess it all depends on how much faith you put in your car . I did all the mechanical resoration myself and have faith in it .
I also have CAA flatbed coverage ........Which I have never needed as yet .
What spare parts do you carry in your everyday driver ......windsheild fluid and thats about it I bet ?

heck why not toss a new tranny in the boot for luck lol
Now that's funny!

Hey TH, you carry more spare parts than most in the boot, figure out how to shoehorn a tranny in there?
Kidding aside, good you had a spare fuel pump, and I'd feel more comfortable knowing you were in a group ride.