TR2/3/3A TR3 Steering Rally Hard

[mountainman]

Thank you to the form members on their response about what fluids
to use in my steering gear box. Now my question is what would make
my steering really hard to turn each way and on the return? All of the
fittings have been greased and the steering box filled. I am waiting on
a compression sleeve before I can install the stator tube. Could that
have an effect on the hard steering? I blocked the gland nut off with
a piece of plastic to hold the fliud in. Also the steering box has been
sitting dry for a time before I filled it. I filled the steering box through
the filler on top on it, then noticed the "filler hole" located about 12" up
the shaft. Should the fluid be filled up to that point? As you probably can tell by
all my question I am a amateur and can use all the help this form provides
It has been a God send to me.
Thanks
Greg

 

[TR3driver]

Now my question is what would make
my steering really hard to turn each way and on the return?

There are lots of possible reasons, but they all amount to binding at some point. Just have to start disconnecting linkages and see where the binding is. But depending on the history, I might start by loosening the cover bolts on the steering box (which of course will let that fresh oil leak out) and see if that makes a difference. If so, the box is not properly adjusted.

Hmm, any chance someone left out the shims when installing the front cover? They are important.

Also, if you jack the front end up and try moving the wheels directly, you may be able to see where the binding is. For me, it turned out to be the idler arm, but it could be anywhere. Herman found a bunch of bent vertical links that would bind.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:]I am waiting on
a compression sleeve before I can install the stator tube. Could that
have an effect on the hard steering?[/QUOTE]I don't see how it could.<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:]Also the steering box has been sitting dry for a time before I filled it.[/QUOTE]Have you looked inside for rust or FOD?<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:] I filled the steering box through
the filler on top on it, then noticed the "filler hole" located about 12" up
the shaft. Should the fluid be filled up to that point?[/QUOTE]Yes, but the lower level shouldn't cause hard steering.<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:]As you probably can tell by
all my question I am a amateur[/QUOTE]Then perhaps I should point out that the TR3 steering is always rather hard compared to newer cars, especially if you are only grabbing the steering wheel with one hand. The fast ratio combined with rather high friction in the steering box make it the nature of the beast to some extent.

 

[Twosheds]

Let's go, Mountaineers, Greg.

When my TR3 steering became hard, I used a systematic approach to find the culprit. First I disconnected the tie rods from the vertical links one at a time. The steering was still hard and the wheels could be turned easily by hand, eliminating the trunnions, tie rod ends, and ball joints. Then I disconnected the center tie rod from the idler arm. The steering became easy, thus exposing the idler as the culprit. The old grease had congealed in it and I could barely get it to move by holding it in a vice and striking it with a BFH!

You could try a similar step-by-step method for locating the culprit. I like to say culprit.

Another cause of stiff steering is a misaligned two-piece steering shaft. Disregard this if you have a single-piece shaft. There are alignment adjustments on the top shaft mount and on the steering unit-to-frame mount. Fiddle with these until the two shafts are perfectly aligned. If they are not perfectly aligned, you will have stiff steering. I have experimented with this!

If you have a single-piece shaft, a bent shaft will cause stiff steering. I have experimented with this also.

 

[TR4]

May I ask if your steering is hard when the car is sitting or is your problem when driving. When parked or stopped, turning the steering wheel will be very hard.

 

[go_inbroke]

I had to replace the 'silent bushings' on my TR3 when the rubber inside of the driver side bushing broke (disintegrated) while looking for hard steering issues. After their replacement, the steering was easier to manage. TR4 is correct. while sitting or moving slowly, as when parking, the steering wheel is hard to turn. In the old days we called it 'arm strong' steering. That goes with 52 and 54 style air conditioning also. The good old days, when the only "power" you had was the driver.

To replace these bushings the steering link has to come out so they can be pressed out and then new ones pressed back in.

 

[newmexTR3]

Hmm, any chance someone left out the shims when installing the front cover? They are important.

Is it possible to replace these shims without pulling the apron off?

Cheers,
Gavin

 

[NickMorgan]

Greg,
Is the steering heavy when the front wheels are off the ground?
Even the best TR3 steering will be hard compared to rack and pinion and especially if you are used to power steering.
They were designed to use crossply tyres to modern radials make the steering much harder. I recently bought new radials and the steering was much lighter than it had been on the old radials.
If you have wider tyres than 165s the steering will be harder than normal.
Other than that you could have bent vertical links, or any of the joints could be faulty or misaligned.
Most people recommend oil in the trunions rather than grease. Have you pumped new grease through all of the joints? If they are old it may be worth taking them apart, checking for wear and cleaning all of the old grease out.
Nick

 

[MGTF1250Dave]

Aloha Gavin,

You can get access to the front cover plate of the steering box with out removing the apron. So you should be able to add or remove shims.

 

[TR3driver]

So you should be able to add or remove shims.

The hard part is knowing how many shims to put in. But if the steering gets lighter with those 4 bolts loosened a bit, there aren't enough shims.

BTW, a 59 TR3 should have the "split" steering column, which makes it possible to remove the entire steering box from the car without pulling the front apron. BTDT

 

[TR3driver]

Even the best TR3 steering will be hard compared to rack and pinion

I wish you could have tried mine, Nick. My late TR3A actually steered easier than the Sports 6 (Vitesse) w/R&P. Not sure why, exactly, as I did too many things at the same time, but I credit most of it to replacing the bushing and peg, then adjusting the box carefully (with a dial indicator). I thought I was doing a good job of adjusting "by feel"; but the DI said I was off by .004", which is quite a bit.

The book talks about a tight spot in the center when the peg is properly adjusted, but I had two tight spots slightly off to the sides. Which I attribute to wear in the cam (that I chose not to replace).

 

[mountainman]

Thanks fellows, I will start trying your suggestions today and let you what the culprit was. I like that word too, TwoSheds. I have the front apron off so it should not be hard to get to.
Thanks
Greg

 

[TR3driver]

I have experimented with this also.

Good for you! We need more people willing to take the path less traveled, and install bent parts

 

[Twosheds]

I have experimented with this also.

Good for you! We need more people willing to take the path less traveled, and install bent parts

Here at the well-known and highly regarded High Speed Triumph Research Laboratory, we, the Boffins, work tirelessly to add our mite to the vast storehouse of Triumph knowledge. Sometimes this means deliberately sacrificing parts.

We are not solely a theoretical institute. Nay, we often put theories to test to get empirical data, such as building up a steering unit with a bent shaft to prove that a bent shaft does indeed cause stiff steering.

Or proving that an engine will indeed not start if the anti-foreign object plugs are left in the carb intakes. You see, we leave nothing to chance.

We seek no awards for this self-sacrificing research, but will accept praise such as yours as we toil in the Lab.