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Moss Superchargers
- Thread starter JFC
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tony barnhill
Great Pumpkin - R.I.P
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Didn't the new Classic Motorsports just do an article on them?
Tom Bedenbaugh
Jedi Hopeful
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No but I sure wish I had a customer that wanted me to put one in for them. I bet it would be a hoot to drive.
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<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by tony barnhill:
Didn't the new Classic Motorsports just do an article on them?<hr></blockquote>
It was in the Summer 2003 issue of British Motoring. A Moss Motors publication.
D
Didn't the new Classic Motorsports just do an article on them?<hr></blockquote>
It was in the Summer 2003 issue of British Motoring. A Moss Motors publication.
D
Bret
Yoda
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<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by JFC:
Anyone have an opinion or experience with the new Supercharges from Moss? I'm curious.<hr></blockquote>
Hey JFC,
Great Question! I’ve been drooling over this for months now. But at $3K a pop – it’s not going to happen over night if at all. My big concern is that its not California emissions legal and can’t be installed on my 78B, until it’s exempt from smog testing in 2008. Or I break down and make my move out of this state.
That aside – the kit really seems like a really neat deal. The installation looks simple enough and if Moss’ claims are correct you effectively double “stock 1800cc” engines’ output after a weekend or two in your garage. All of that and it still looks OEM – unlike some other systems I’ve seen. Not a bad deal if you ask me.
Anyway IMHO the real Question is: If performance is all that you really want - would that $3,000 be better spent on something else? Most V6 engine swaps will gain you a lot more HP if that is all you are really looking for and the price is right.
Also - keep in mind that Moss issues a rather ominous disclaimer with their SC kit. In that the kit isn’t a fix all for a tired, old or beat up engine. I take this to mean that if your engine has “any” issues, you could be throwing good money after bad – unless you address them first. So if your engine is sound your OK, but if it needs to be refreshed or rebuild altogether – then the supercharger isn’t or shouldn’t be your first order of business.
Anyone have an opinion or experience with the new Supercharges from Moss? I'm curious.<hr></blockquote>
Hey JFC,
Great Question! I’ve been drooling over this for months now. But at $3K a pop – it’s not going to happen over night if at all. My big concern is that its not California emissions legal and can’t be installed on my 78B, until it’s exempt from smog testing in 2008. Or I break down and make my move out of this state.
That aside – the kit really seems like a really neat deal. The installation looks simple enough and if Moss’ claims are correct you effectively double “stock 1800cc” engines’ output after a weekend or two in your garage. All of that and it still looks OEM – unlike some other systems I’ve seen. Not a bad deal if you ask me.
Anyway IMHO the real Question is: If performance is all that you really want - would that $3,000 be better spent on something else? Most V6 engine swaps will gain you a lot more HP if that is all you are really looking for and the price is right.
Also - keep in mind that Moss issues a rather ominous disclaimer with their SC kit. In that the kit isn’t a fix all for a tired, old or beat up engine. I take this to mean that if your engine has “any” issues, you could be throwing good money after bad – unless you address them first. So if your engine is sound your OK, but if it needs to be refreshed or rebuild altogether – then the supercharger isn’t or shouldn’t be your first order of business.
Tom Bedenbaugh
Jedi Hopeful
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I would never put a SC on anything but a fresh or recently rebuilt engine. The various conversions are an alternative for sure. I don't think however it would be nearly as simple to do. Be sides a stock B suspention will only handle so much HP. You get much above 110 MPH and they aren't stable.
Bret
Yoda
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<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by Tom Bedenbaugh:
I would never put a SC on anything but a fresh or recently rebuilt engine. The various conversions are an alternative for sure. I don't think however it would be nearly as simple to do. Be sides a stock B suspention will only handle so much HP. You get much above 110 MPH and they aren't stable.<hr></blockquote>
Ya got a point Tom,
But there are a number of bolt on (or in) kits available on line for installing a V6 with a minimum of effort. Certainly more work than that of Moss’ SC Kit would involve. However Moss is claiming that their kit doesn’t require that the engine be completely rebuild or even refreshed. Like you this goes against everything I’ve always been led to understand working on or improving engines over the years. But if someone wants the SC kit and are comfortable with the condition of their engine – I say go for it. But I’d remind them of the old adage that the best engine in the world, is only as good as it’s weakest (or oldest) part.
This lends itself to my point about the overall cost for installing the Supercharger. Figure in the cost of the SC kit & completely rebuilding the engine and you are looking at $6,000 give or take depending on how much you do yourself. Again, at that price you could seriously consider other options. The V6 could be a serious cost saver over the SC kit and all it “might” entail to do it right.
Also - you are correct about upgrading the suspension. Moreover I would seriously consider up rated brakes as well.
I would never put a SC on anything but a fresh or recently rebuilt engine. The various conversions are an alternative for sure. I don't think however it would be nearly as simple to do. Be sides a stock B suspention will only handle so much HP. You get much above 110 MPH and they aren't stable.<hr></blockquote>
Ya got a point Tom,
But there are a number of bolt on (or in) kits available on line for installing a V6 with a minimum of effort. Certainly more work than that of Moss’ SC Kit would involve. However Moss is claiming that their kit doesn’t require that the engine be completely rebuild or even refreshed. Like you this goes against everything I’ve always been led to understand working on or improving engines over the years. But if someone wants the SC kit and are comfortable with the condition of their engine – I say go for it. But I’d remind them of the old adage that the best engine in the world, is only as good as it’s weakest (or oldest) part.
This lends itself to my point about the overall cost for installing the Supercharger. Figure in the cost of the SC kit & completely rebuilding the engine and you are looking at $6,000 give or take depending on how much you do yourself. Again, at that price you could seriously consider other options. The V6 could be a serious cost saver over the SC kit and all it “might” entail to do it right.
Also - you are correct about upgrading the suspension. Moreover I would seriously consider up rated brakes as well.
tony barnhill
Great Pumpkin - R.I.P
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Before I do any mods to the engine, the suspension & grakes have to be upgraded first....that's why I'm so far behind on my V8 project...all that suspension work!
Bret
Yoda
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<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by tony barnhill:
Before I do any mods to the engine, the suspension & grakes have to be upgraded first....that's why I'm so far behind on my V8 project...all that suspension work!<hr></blockquote>
Hey Tony,
Me too. As I’m still for the most part un-decided as to what I want to do with my 78B to improve on the smog equipment laden 1800cc’s lackluster ponies. I went ahead and upgraded my suspension front & rear. Lowered the front 2” with uprated springs, polyurethane bushings. Likewise 1.5” in the rear with a Moss lowering kit as well as poly-bushings too. As for the Breaks I have already up graded to the Hawk pads.
Other Suspension plans: Replace the lowering kit & old rear leaf springs with uprated 1” lower springs. I also plan on a complete performance break upgrade to the slotted & vented disks.
For now the old gal really handles 100% better than it did at the old ride height and warn out bushings. Tight cornering & breaking, but not suffering at the expense of ride comfort.
Before I do any mods to the engine, the suspension & grakes have to be upgraded first....that's why I'm so far behind on my V8 project...all that suspension work!<hr></blockquote>
Hey Tony,
Me too. As I’m still for the most part un-decided as to what I want to do with my 78B to improve on the smog equipment laden 1800cc’s lackluster ponies. I went ahead and upgraded my suspension front & rear. Lowered the front 2” with uprated springs, polyurethane bushings. Likewise 1.5” in the rear with a Moss lowering kit as well as poly-bushings too. As for the Breaks I have already up graded to the Hawk pads.
Other Suspension plans: Replace the lowering kit & old rear leaf springs with uprated 1” lower springs. I also plan on a complete performance break upgrade to the slotted & vented disks.
For now the old gal really handles 100% better than it did at the old ride height and warn out bushings. Tight cornering & breaking, but not suffering at the expense of ride comfort.
Tom Bedenbaugh
Jedi Hopeful
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Boy I can see the post now.( You know I sure thought I could take that 45MPH curve at 110.)All that work and it's gone in 60sec.
The intriguing part to me is the simplicity of installation and keeping the car essentially original. Their claims are great, but I would like to see more tests. Like 0-60 mph before installation and then after. Or 1/4 mile before and after. Those kind of comparisons I can relate to.
I don't think I would drive the car a whole lot faster than normal, but it would be fun to get to cruising speed faster or power out of curves.
I don't think I would drive the car a whole lot faster than normal, but it would be fun to get to cruising speed faster or power out of curves.
Joe Reed
Jedi Warrior
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I find the SC option much more viable for the average Joe than an engine swap. It's way easier (and quicker!!) to accomplish - especially for those of us with limited time, tools and skill (especially skill). Having the carb pretty much sorted out by Moss is a big deal, IMHO.
Personally, I still lust after one of those DCOE throttle-body EFI setups. If the ricers can use them on a Toyota, they oughta work great on an MGB. Imagine tuning up your fuel delivery system with your laptop!!
Personally, I still lust after one of those DCOE throttle-body EFI setups. If the ricers can use them on a Toyota, they oughta work great on an MGB. Imagine tuning up your fuel delivery system with your laptop!!
tony barnhill
Great Pumpkin - R.I.P
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JOE! When did you find us? Welcome...good to see your smiling face below your posts!
tony barnhill
Great Pumpkin - R.I.P
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Joe...just look in the top right corner of the forum page & find something like "current topics" or "today's active topics"...click on it
Bret
Yoda
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<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by Joe Reed:
I find the SC option much more viable for the average Joe than an engine swap. It's way easier (and quicker!!) to accomplish - especially for those of us with limited time, tools and skill (especially skill). Having the carb pretty much sorted out by Moss is a big deal, IMHO.
Personally, I still lust after one of those DCOE throttle-body EFI setups. If the ricers can use them on a Toyota, they oughta work great on an MGB. Imagine tuning up your fuel delivery system with your laptop!!<hr></blockquote>
Hi Joe,
Welcome to the forum.
As for the SC Kit being a better option for the average Joe (pardon the use of your name), I’d have to agree. I printed out a copy of Moss’ procedure and it doesn’t look like it’d be all the difficult.
As for EFI on a 1800cc engine. I have heard that this has been done, but the sad truth is I haven’t actually seen a MGB with an EFI conversion. The real reason for this is that (according to every source I’ve read says) this very tricky & difficult to do because of Siamese intake ports on the stock head.
I’m thinking that perhaps this might work better on a cross flow head but regardless I think that this would be far more expensive than any of the other options already discussed. But as always I could be wrong and would love to know if someone has successfully installed an EFI system and how it was done. Anyone??
I find the SC option much more viable for the average Joe than an engine swap. It's way easier (and quicker!!) to accomplish - especially for those of us with limited time, tools and skill (especially skill). Having the carb pretty much sorted out by Moss is a big deal, IMHO.
Personally, I still lust after one of those DCOE throttle-body EFI setups. If the ricers can use them on a Toyota, they oughta work great on an MGB. Imagine tuning up your fuel delivery system with your laptop!!<hr></blockquote>
Hi Joe,
Welcome to the forum.
As for the SC Kit being a better option for the average Joe (pardon the use of your name), I’d have to agree. I printed out a copy of Moss’ procedure and it doesn’t look like it’d be all the difficult.
As for EFI on a 1800cc engine. I have heard that this has been done, but the sad truth is I haven’t actually seen a MGB with an EFI conversion. The real reason for this is that (according to every source I’ve read says) this very tricky & difficult to do because of Siamese intake ports on the stock head.
I’m thinking that perhaps this might work better on a cross flow head but regardless I think that this would be far more expensive than any of the other options already discussed. But as always I could be wrong and would love to know if someone has successfully installed an EFI system and how it was done. Anyone??
Bret
Yoda
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Aside from the cost of SC kit, my only other real concerns are: Is it legal and what is the condition of the engine you are putting it on? Depending on where you live the SC kit might not be emissions legal and what other changes will you need to make to your B to set this up correctly.
PC
Obi Wan
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<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by Bret:
...(according to every source I’ve read says) this very tricky & difficult to do because of Siamese intake ports on the stock head. ...<hr></blockquote>
Siamesed ports should only be a problem for setting up a sequential port EFI system. Doing a “DCOE” style throttle body set-up should be pretty straightforward but if the ports are siamesed there’s no need to use two-barrel “DCOE” bodies. By using single-barrel “SU” style throttle bodies you can use the stock manifold as well.
PC.
...(according to every source I’ve read says) this very tricky & difficult to do because of Siamese intake ports on the stock head. ...<hr></blockquote>
Siamesed ports should only be a problem for setting up a sequential port EFI system. Doing a “DCOE” style throttle body set-up should be pretty straightforward but if the ports are siamesed there’s no need to use two-barrel “DCOE” bodies. By using single-barrel “SU” style throttle bodies you can use the stock manifold as well.
PC.
Bret
Yoda
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Opps? I guess didn’t think it through before commenting.
But do you know of any of the SU single barrel examples out there? If so, please tell – I’d be very curious as to how they did it.
Still – do able or not, it seems that this could be a very costly & involved endeavor. So again the overriding issue still comes down to money.
But do you know of any of the SU single barrel examples out there? If so, please tell – I’d be very curious as to how they did it.
Still – do able or not, it seems that this could be a very costly & involved endeavor. So again the overriding issue still comes down to money.
tony barnhill
Great Pumpkin - R.I.P
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Got a setup on an old Magnette parts car & one on an MG1100 parts car....though on the supercharger you'd probably want to go with an HS-6 at least & possibly an HS-8.