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Brake Servo Installation

Stuka

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Does anyone have pics of an after-market installation to get me pretty definitive positioning of the brake servo? Maybe an OEM install on a later model could help? This is the heart of a (to me) massive upgrade starting on my recently acquired BN4 SN 73771. Need it very safe for some planned long trips. Already drove it 1,761 miles from place of purchase to my home.

Looks like air piping to heater core from front and its blower assembly location will be a challenge

Thanks
 

DerekJ

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Does your car have front discs? If not I wouldn't bother with a servo. Leading shoe drum brakes are designed so that they have a servo like effect built into their operation. Servos don't improve braking they just require less pressure. You will also need to change your master cylinder if you install one.
 
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Stuka

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Have front disc brakes. I think the servo will help for emergency stops, since about everyone else in traffic will have at least power brakes and often ABS. Increased reaction time is an age factor working against me, so I feel any help in the safety arena is good. Just got the wire wheels re-done and new tires put on, rear drums balanced. Yet to be installed also have all new hubs, brake pads, rear brake cylinder kits, wheel bearings, radiator, oil cooler kit and set of shoulder harnesses. Figure it'll take me a couple of months, but I want a sound driver for some long trips. Did 1,760 miles from point of purchase in May, had real hot for 2 days and VERY wet for 2 more, but we loved it. Owned a red '59 100-6 2-seater when we were engaged ~ '65... That's my story

So I'm looking for guidance on the Servo install. The rest is not a problem, just a good bit of time. Car is on jack stands and I have kaboodles of space
 
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Stuka

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Thanks, Steve, this Photo Gallery is an unbelievable treasure trove of information for me, just spent 20 minutes looking and printing a stack of B&W pics, will get color at home as I need. Have not found the servo pics, will look more tomorrow

There is only one other Healey in my town of about 40,000, maybe one more in the County. Talked to owner this weekend, think he needs a servo, will get him link to this site or will contact you for him if he wishes

Otto
 
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Stuka

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As a quick aside, I expect to get a look at the other Healey this week, will cancel this request if my answer is there

Otto
 
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Stuka

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Got a look at the local Healey on 8/26, it's about a '63 or so, not running. I can re-visit it if needed. Got some pics, but need to jack it up for a real look as I get closer to that phase of my upgrade/parts replacement project. If there are any detail shots for a 100-6 available, I would certainly appreciate those, but I think I'm largely on the right track. Probably an illusion, I know

Otto
 

Jerry

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Since the servo is mounted on the footwell wall on the passenger side, there is an angle, there is also an angle in the mounting bracket, and an optimum angle for the servo. IE: not more than x degrees, no less than y degrees. I found you have to bend the bracket to meet these requirements. But I sold that car so I don't have pictures anymore of an aftermarket install.
Jerry
 
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Stuka

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Thanks, Jerry. I checked the directions that came with the Servo (real men don't read directions, right?) and it does specify that. I'm just intimidated by the size of the available space, I guess. I can think in 3 dimensions flying, but am not good at it under a car. So here I am. Groveling is not pretty, but it usually works

Otto
 

steveg

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Comprehensive Delphi instructions for mounting the Lockheed servo:
https://gentry.zxq.net/Remote_Servo_Installation.pdf

Moss evidently no longer lists their installation pdf on their site. If you want a copy, send me a PM.

Both documents show the required angles.

Rich Berman has several pictures of the servo as mounted on what look to be homemade brackets -- though it looks like the end of the servo is too tight against the fender well for good pipe clearance:
https://plus.google.com/photos/11008...13397849858337
Scroll down to picture 635 to start.
 
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Stuka

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Hi Steve, hate that you had to walk me up to the blackboard and push my nose on the answer you gave me, but I appreciate your persistence. I somehow missed it in the other two passes I made at the site. Sorted it out late last night, also got some help with the front disc hubs I'm assembling, that is a bit of a wicket. When I had the 100-6 in the '60s I had a great body guy, a great mech and a wire wheel guy right in the Arcata area. Also had none other than Lou Brero (his father was a well-known racer, died in a flaming crash in the then Sandwich Islands - a really bad story) with unending used parts sources, so I did very little work myself. Just tore it up a lot on Highways 101, 299 there and on Highway 199 further North. Redwood Country

So again thank you very much for bearing with me! Have a great weekend!

Otto
 

BoyRacer

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Stuka,

I hate to rain on your parade but a servo is not going to help you in emergency stops. In an emergency you will stomp on the brake pedal and you'll lock up your wheels. That is maximum braking! A servo won't do it any faster. A servo will only lessen the pedal pressure to achieve whatever your braking system is capable of. A servo is just one more thing that can go wrong in your 65 year old Healey. A servo will not make your car safer unless you do not have the leg strength to push hard on your brake pedal.

I would think that a "massive upgrade" (your words) would be a dual master cylinder setup. Or, going with BJ8 brakes with the larger caliper, thicker rotor, and larger area pads. Or, switching to disc brakes on the rear. At the very least, I would insure that your calipers, master cylinder and wheel cylinders are in tip top working order. That will keep you safe!
 

WHT

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Hi Stuka (hope you are still here!),

I understand this is a VERY old thread, But I would not be dissuaded from installing a servo if it has a moderate ratio and is properly matched to your master cylinder bore and other braking components. It could very well help you in an emergency stop situation.

Feeling confident you can apply your brakes quickly without locking them (modulation and sensitivity) can allow you to stop in shorter distances with practice (muscle memory). At 74, I still ride my Ducati up to 140 mph on occasions, and knowing how to brake is important to me. You do not want to worry that you have to stomp on the brakes in an emergency.

IMO, a brake servo paired with a correctly matched master cylinder could improve both braking and safety. A matched combination can reduce braking effort and also still preserve braking feel (knowing when your brakes are about to lock) and your response (fine motor skills). This is more effective when you can apply low to moderate force when braking; and less effective when your brakes require a high force near lockup.

Once again, the last thing you want to do is lock the wheels in an emergency stop. That is NOT maximum braking in an emergency situation.

Below are a few easily found comments from people who understand how to brake quickly and with confidence:

"Brake modulation is the ability to precisely and accurately control the amount of clamping force on a disc with a given amount of pedal input. In other words, it means you can scrub off as much or as little speed as you want without tire lockup. Peak braking power comes just prior to lockup and it’s the ability to flirt with that limit that makes modulation so important.

A vehicles braking power is always limited by the amount of tire traction available. Most OE pads and all aftermarket brake pads can lock up a tire or two. However, a tire that isn’t rotating is also usually a tire that isn’t contributing any meaningful amount of control. Brake lockup is exactly what you do not want. No modulation is basically no braking vs. tire lockup. Having low modulation will mean it’s hard to feather the brakes and you can only really lock up the pads.

Proper modulation gives you access to the whole range of braking power desired and allows you to apply it evenly at will, giving you precise control over feathering the brakes, stopping firmly, or locking the tire(s). Many top level professional race car drivers will tell you that being able to modulate and trail brake into a corner is essential to producing the fastest possible lap times."
 
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