Major heresy

if you guys think putting a chevy in a Jag is bad, look at what these guys are doinHesco

I have actually seen E-Types with Chevy V8s

I have too, and if I had a jag sedan with a blown up engine, I'd go that way RATHER THAN SCRAP IT

The worst I have seen was the Prostreet XJS from E-bay a while back, the blower sticking out of the hood was just wrong.

My main question for Hesco is, "If you aren't gonna need that Jag lump, could I have it? I have this 97 Ford Escort that is just begging for a slight performance mod."

MattP

they say it is for sale

<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by Chuck Cougill:
they say it is for sale<hr></blockquote>

I couldn't find the price, I suppose I will have to relocate the rad somewhere amidship, so the engine can hang out the front, unless I can find a way to mount it transversally. Or, we are only two in my home, so no rats for a back seat, I could pull it out and mount it backwards there, and still be front wheel drive. Hmmmm


MattP

Chuck,
What bothers me most about many of these conversions is what happens when you discover that the failed starter motor, water pump or alternator will not come out without removing the engine. I agree that Jaguar gets close to that condition as well in some models, but the quote from the Birmingham shop about making a mock up of the drive train before installation really bothers me in this regard. I hope they do somemaintenance engineering as well.
Best regards,

being in a maintanence position, I can relate to what you say. So many things are engineered to be accomplished at minimum cost with no thought to the fact we will have to live with the results for 20 years. A recent 100 million dollar expansion to the power plant I work at has instruments that require at least annual maintainence located 6 stories in the air with no way to get at them. This said, I have no problem with a well engineered and thought out conversion on MOST but not all LBCs. I say not all because some cars are simply too rare to mess with.

<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr> Chuck Cougill said: This said, I have no problem with a well engineered and thought out conversion on MOST but not all LBCs. I say not all because some cars are simply too rare to mess with.<hr></blockquote>

I agree for the most part, but...

Some very common cars have become almost extinct (as original spec) because too many people over a number of years have slowly messed with them. One of my biggest beefs in this regard at present is how people mess up with old VW's (Beetle, Microbus). Despite how many of them are out there it is now getting hard to find a nice original Beetle or Van because guys lower them, customize them, generally mess with them, and in my opinion ruin them.

[Sorry a little off topic for a Jaguar forum, just an example]

The only thing that bugs me about this is that it's a low milage car. If you're a shop going to do this, use a higher milage vehicle that's engine is worn out or blown.

I would think a 14000 mile car would be something to hold on to.This guy must have money to throw a way. I agree if you have blown the motor the why not question comes to the front.You would think that kind of money could buy a great deal of performance to the Jag motor.
I should talk as I put a 351 W into the alpine.

[ 01-31-2003: Message edited by: thegoodbeamer ]</p>

The whole conversion thing is a tricky judgement. To me, it would be just plain wrong to replace an XKE engine with anything else. I remember Car&Driver magazine put a Pontiac 326 [I think] V8 into an XKE, and even as a kid, I felt that was wrong. A Leyland era XJ sedan with a V8 conversion, however, I like. A sedan is, to me, a daily driver, Jag or not. I like my daily driver to be reliable. I would run that engine quiet, with maybe a very slight, but deep, melodious rumble. I would be happy to cruise to work every day with that.
A conversion I would, very much, love to do, however, is a radical, boy-racer, musclecar Chrysler V8, in a Mercedes 450 SL. I'd make it as cheesy and drag-race fast as possible. This is simply a reaction to the arrogant trendiness that seems, to me, to exemplify too many Mercedes owners, since the 1970s. Don't get me wrong, these are decent cars, but Americans don't seem to understand that in Europe, Mercedes are used as taxi-cabs. Jags, on the other hand, never seem to see any duty as taxis. Not even Leyland era XJ sedans.
P.S. The other impetus behind my Chrysler 450 SL idea, comes from the fact that the Daimler-Chrysler merger was supposed to be an association between equals. In what had been the most innovative American company of the nineties, the only thing you will find on the lunchroom menu, nowadays, is sauerkraut and sausage. Deutschland uber Chrysler. [considering that my very own last name is German, I hope I spelled sauerkraut and Deutschland right. I think I did.]

[ 02-01-2003: Message edited by: MarkB ]</p>

Quoted by Mark B:
Jags, on the other hand, never seem to see any duty as taxis. Not even Leyland era XJ sedans.

Mark B;
Back when the "Baby Jags (what we in the US call the MK i's and II's) were introduced, the UK (at least London) used them as Police cars.. shame hard service as a taxi, but with the speed and top-end to chased down "fleeing felons" in the Mini-Coopers.
I believe the Police Chiefs were accorded the MK X thru XJ Saloons for their use..
Someone from the UK should really step-in on this subjects, as my info is "hearsay"

That police car thing is true. I just bought a copy of Nigel Thorley's "Jaguar XJ: the complete companion." Has several photos of British XJ "Police Specification" Series IIs. Very stripped-down interiors, rubber rather than Wilton carpet, plastic vs. veneer.

The book was published in '91; said more than 20 UK police agencies drove XJs, and several were switching from Series IIIs to XJ40s.

Speaking of Jag books, does anyone have a recommendation for a repair manual, other than the $180 one from Jag? I have a Haynes, but it's mostly for Series I and II. I'm waiting for my first Jag to arrive; it's an '86 Vanden Plas I bought on eBay for $950.

Mike Billips

MarkB:

The Car and Driver E-type had a Pontiac overhead cam six (250 cu. inch, I think), complete wih 4 barrel carb and Hurst-shifter four speed. Apparently, it was a pretty successful transplant, retaining the feel and balnace of the inline six but with a nicer trans. I think it was back done by C&D around 1970.

Sherlock:

I agree about the old VWs....where are they? They're used to be zillions of them....rust, dune buggies and kit cars did them in, I guess (I chopped up several when I was building FVs, so I guess I'm guilty too).

As for putting a V-8 in a classic sedan (such as a Jag)...I guess, to each his own. If it keeps them out of the junkyard, I guess it's a good thing. Mostly, to me, it seems like the actual execution of the job is real important.....I've seen some dreadful engine swaps, and I've seen some nice ones...usually, the "Devil" is in the details. I did a Ford 289 in a Volvo (P1800) years ago..overall, I think the car was better with it's original four.

One engine that I think would be great for a swap in a classic would be the new GM Vortec inline six....24 valve, twin cam hemi. All aluminum and 275 HP. GM puts them in SUVs, so they're already set up for rear wheel drive. There's a new five cylinder version of this motor too.

<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by mbillips:
That police car thing is true. I just bought a copy of Nigel Thorley's "Jaguar XJ: the complete companion." Has several photos of British XJ "Police Specification" Series IIs. Very stripped-down interiors, rubber rather than Wilton carpet, plastic vs. veneer.

<hr></blockquote>

This site has pictures of some old police Jaguars. https://www.classiccopcars.co.uk/

The UK police have used an amazing variety of cars over the years.

<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by sunbeammadd:


This site has pictures of some old police Jaguars. https://www.classiccopcars.co.uk/

The UK police have used an amazing variety of cars over the years.<hr></blockquote>

Nifty! That is a complete departure from the big honking boats the US police use. That MGB-GT was really neat.

MattP

On the topic of police cars...

A friend of mine up here purchased a black 1962 Ford Consul in excellent condition last year (the LHD export version) and has been converting it into a replica of a U.K. police car. At car shows he wears his British police outfit complete with the distinctive tall hat and a "bobby", he is always a popular attraction, especially with the kids and "kids" of all ages.

Incidentally, he is a police officer up here in Canada, but is originally from the U.K. somewhere (but he was never a police officer in the U.K. from what I understand).

Sorry... missed this one...

<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr> Aeronca65T said: I agree about the old VWs....where are they? They're used to be zillions of them....rust, dune buggies and kit cars did them in, I guess (I chopped up several when I was building FVs, so I guess I'm guilty too).<hr></blockquote>

Well, there are some around, but not many... A friend of mine has a neat restored-to-original German-market Beetle (no chrome on the car anywhere!) A nicely done car that shows well, and is driven lots by the owner too.

<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr> Aeronca65T also said: As for putting a V-8 in a classic sedan (such as a Jag)...I guess, to each his own. If it keeps them out of the junkyard, I guess it's a good thing. Mostly, to me, it seems like the actual execution of the job is real important.....I've seen some dreadful engine swaps, and I've seen some nice ones...usually, the "Devil" is in the details. I did a Ford 289 in a Volvo (P1800) years ago..overall, I think the car was better with it's original four.

One engine that I think would be great for a swap in a classic would be the new GM Vortec inline six....24 valve, twin cam hemi. All aluminum and 275 HP. GM puts them in SUVs, so they're already set up for rear wheel drive. There's a new five cylinder version of this motor too.<hr></blockquote>

The concept of re-engining classics is always controversial. Yet if you look at many British and European cars of the 1950’s, the original engine is small and too underpowered for modern traffic (if you want to actually drive it much)

A friend of mine, who is a true blue British car enthusiast and owner, feels that putting a newer engine in a classic isn’t wrong if… it doesn’t significantly alter the bodywork. He has put a Datsun 510 engine in a Morris Minor and tells me that it makes it much more driveable and enjoyable on the road, and it drops in fine without altering the body. He has several 1950’s British sedans, all with the original engines, and reckons that by dropping in something as simple as a Chev Chevette engine it makes a big difference. The Chevette engine isn’t very powerful, but is geared for modern traffic flow as compared to a 1950’s British sedan. And he thinks that doing this may ultimately save cars like Austin Devons, Hillman Minx’s, Morris Oxford’s, etc…

And about a certain Triumph Mayflower… One guy wants a little more power out of his Mayflower (feable in stock form), so he has dropped in the engine from a TR2 or TR3A, slots in well and makes the car something you can actually drive now and he dares anyone looking at the engine to know if it is the original one as it is a period conversion using old components.

<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr> Sherlock (myself) said: The concept of re-engining classics is always controversial. Yet if you look at many British and European cars of the 1950’s, the original engine is small and too underpowered for modern traffic (if you want to actually drive it much)

A friend of mine, who is a true blue British car enthusiast and owner, feels that putting a newer engine in a classic isn’t wrong if… it doesn’t significantly alter the bodywork. He has put a Datsun 510 engine in a Morris Minor and tells me that it makes it much more driveable and enjoyable on the road, and it drops in fine without altering the body. He has several 1950’s British sedans, all with the original engines, and reckons that by dropping in something as simple as a Chev Chevette engine it makes a big difference. The Chevette engine isn’t very powerful, but is geared for modern traffic flow as compared to a 1950’s British sedan. And he thinks that doing this may ultimately save cars like Austin Devons, Hillman Minx’s, Morris Oxford’s, etc…<hr></blockquote>

The following was written by a guy I know, from Michigan, related to the above topic:

"I realize that I'm about to raise cries of heresy, but since I drive my [1958] Morris Oxford Traveller a lot, I have chosen to install an early MGB engine, trans, and diff. How many times have you heard "it's easy, it bolts right in"? I suppose that it is easy compared to say, replacing the roof or a section of the frame, but there were tons of details that needed attention. One of which was changing from the column shift linkage to a floor shift. This was easy enough, but the shift lever from the MGB is so short that changing gears is about like scratching your ankle for convenience. I am speculating the floor shift lever from a Farina bodied Austin, Morris, etc. should fit this transmission. If anyone knows otherwise, or can provide one of these levers, I would be happy to buy it.

Oh, and as far as being a heretic, all modifications were done by modifying the components, not the car, and the original parts were preserved, so that this could all be reversed."