Welders

need some advice i'm looking to do some light welding on my bj8 ,never welded before ,looking at some inexpensive units since i'm not making a career of it are the harbor freight units ok

Re: welders

rjc157 said:

need some advice i'm looking to do some light welding on my bj8 ,never welded before ,looking at some inexpensive units since i'm not making a career of it are the harbor freight units ok

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I have the HF <$100 110v unit - it's useless. Messy welds which break apart on even thin stock.

This looks good - no HF models shown, though:
https://www.popularmechanics.com/ho...eed-welder-face-off-we-test-the-top-6#slide-1

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I second that on Harbor Freight. Not too useful. I do have a Hobart 187 that works well. But I like my friends Miller 200 better. Since it takes practice, it would be cheaper to hire someone that buy a welder unless you plan on welding a lot. Jerry

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I agree, It takes time to learn how to do this correctly. I've welded on most of my projects over the years but still don't do it enough to be really proficient at it. If all you have is a small project or two the only reason to do it yourself is if you don't care about the cost and really just want to weld, but you'll want some "throwaway" stuff to learn on before tackling the car.
BTW, I use a smaller unit from Eastwood, cost about $400 at the time I got it about 15 years ago.

Re: welders

rjc157 said:

need some advice i'm looking to do some light welding on my bj8 ,never welded before ,looking at some inexpensive units since i'm not making a career of it are the harbor freight units ok

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In this case I suggest that you find a shop with a large Miller gas MIG unit and alot of experience . I think you will ome ot ahead--Fwiw-Keoke

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I have been welding for almost 50 years. I have learned that you need a 200 amp welder if you don't want to waste you time or money. Do not buy one of these cheap 110 portable welders. Their duty cycle is about 3 minutes out of every 60 minutes that means the machine is only capable of welding for 3 minutes out of every hour. I recommend the Miller welders because of the wire feed drive wheels are both driven and good quality build making an excellent machine. they cost about $2200.-$2800. IfI you are not a good welder you need a good welding machine to help you. I am a good welder and was not successful with a 110 machine.
Marty

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I did all of the restoration welding on my BN-2. I had previous oxy-acetylene experience and some tig welding experience. I bought a small Lincoln mig welder that can weld up to .25 in thick steel if not running continuously. I didn't have much trouble teaching my self to use it. Had I not had experience it would have been a fairly lenghty and shallow learning curve. If you want to do the welding yourself I would suggest you either find someone who can show you the ropes or actually take an adult ed course if something is available near you. It really isn't hard to do once you learn a handful of lessons. A beginner definately needs to practice a bunch before you burn metal on your Healey. Get a good helmet with an auto darkening filter (those are game changers compared to the old days). A clean surface (really really clean, like sand blasted clean) is key. I would not recommend a wire "flux" welder, where the flux cored wire takes the place of the gas shield used in mig welding. They are more difficult to obtain sound welds with unless you have some experience. I would look for a welding machine that has an infinately adjustble wire feed speed and infinately adjustable voltage adjustment if you can afford one (rather than the stepped "click" type of adjustment witches). Being able to set exactly the wire feed and heat (voltage)you want is a help although not absolutely necessary. Another really important welding tip is getting a very close fit of the parts to be welded before you even think about striking an arc. Trying to "fill a gap" with weld bead usually doesn't work for beginners and is bad form for experienced folks. Obviously if you can afford to have someone do your welding it wll happen faster but welding is pretty satisfying to do and if you have anything else that you can use the welder for after you are done with the Healey it easily pays for itself. One reason to buy from a welding shop is also that you can go in there and tell them what you want and that you are a beginner and I have seen store owners take someone into the back to either try out a machine or to show them how to improve their technique. Your mileage may vary but if nothing else you can ask them questions until they close the shop for the day.

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Well, Keoke's suggestion is the most logical, but what's the fun in that!?

My first MIG (now on my 4th) was an Italian Silver Beauty; eighty (80) amps of metal-warming thunder__downhill! I actually did ALL the floor/rocker/sill work on my Healey with that unit, along with teaching myself to weld (this was 1986). I'd give anything to have my first welder/welding project NOT be my car, but all this time later, everything is still holding up just fine.

As far as a welder is concerned, a decent__name brand__will retain a fair anount of its original value, assuming it's been kept relatively clean and not abused. Miller makes a very good quality 110V unit, and it would handle just about anything you could hope to weld on an automobile (a 1/2" thick trailer hitch would be beyond its capabilities though).

Buy a decent welder, use it for what you need, and if you don't think you'll use it again, sell it on for a minimal loss.

Whatever brand of MIG you decide to go with, I strongly recommend you get one that is set up for use with a shielding gas. The flux-core type wire (no shielding gas required) produces some bad-ugly welds__even if they do hold, you wouldn't be very proud to show them off.

I've made some pretty good buys on new equipment through the "stores" on ebay...

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I have one of those cheap Harbor Freight welders, if I had to do it again I would certainly have upgraded a bit, have had to fiddle with the feed mechanism quite a bit, I have also tripped the circuit breaker because of overload over overheating or whatever it is that exceeds the duty cycle, it might in fact only go for about three minutes, but I seldom weld for three minutes straight anyway. It doesn't take an hour to cool down and be useable again, maybe about 5 minutes. I would not use it for welding on a suspension mount or high stress frame member, but it has worked for extensive sheet metal repairs. I will readily admit the Yugo of the welding world, but for sheet metal and light fabrication work it will get there, if not in total reliability and style. And to me at least there is a satisfaction in doing it yourself. In fact although in my mind I know my welder has its limits, it feels quite empowering to be able to fuse metal, makes you feel like you can fabricate and fix most anything if you have the time to futz with it.

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I don't have experience with them, but the Eastwood company--yeah, the bodywork shop--has been selling both TIG and MIG units that look pretty decent from the specs and reviews.

Likely you'll do more sheetmetal welding than anything else; keep in mind--unless you're a real guru--that you can't run a bead on sheetmetal (it simply preheats too fast). Tack/skipwelding is the order of the day (tack every couple inches, then go back and fill in the gaps, repeat).

Re: welders

Thanks all what I need to do is there is a rip to the front crossmember of the frame and also concidering putting in gussits on the front to strengthen the frame ,I would bring it to a shop but don't know anyone local that has worked on a healey ,and just don't want to leave it sitting in a shop and wait for someone to get to it thanks for the advice

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A reasonable option for chassis welding is a dirty arc welder. Modern inverter arc welders run beautifully compared to the growling old transformer types. The original Healey chassis is arc welded and the body is spot and gas welded.

I got a TIG welder which can be used for arc welding as well. TIG is brilliant for light metal and the arc leaves a nicer looking weld than MIG (IMO at least). MIG is much faster than either if you are in a hurry or need to make money off welding. Regardless of what type you get, many hours of practice on a quality machine is the only way to get good at welding. Andy.

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A good 110V (Miller or equivalent) MIG with gas is the ticket IMO or the garage hobbiest. Does the job, cost reasonable.

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Wish I had my $80 back I spent on the Harbor Freight welder ! Thank goodness I got it on sale and with a coupon. Have managed to weld up some rebar for a project for my wife ( a bottle tree - don't ask !) and did okay with that heavy stuff. Not pretty but holding up. However never been able to get a decent weld on lighter gauge sheet metal and have become a pro at burn through. Wish I had paid more and got one using shielding gas as recommended !
Regards,
Mike

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I'm scratching my head with this post.

Frameman said:

I have learned that you need a 200 amp welder if you don't want to waste you time or money.

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There hasn't been anything on my Healey that my 140amp, 120v MIG couldn't handle. Including welding 3/8" stainless flanges onto my exhaust system.

Frameman said:

do not buy one of these cheap 110 portable welders. Their duty cycle is about 3 minutes out of every 60 minutes that means the machine is only capable of welding for 3 minutes out of every hour.

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All the welders I've seen advertise duty cycle as a percentage of ten minutes, not an hour. The lowest MIG Harbor Freight advertises has a 20% duty cycle (at full power). Your figures come out to a 5% duty cycle.

Frameman said:

I recommend the Miller welders because of the wire feed drive wheels are both driven and good quality build making an excellent machine. they cost about $2200.-$2800.

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That price seems way high. The Millermatic 211 goes for about $1100. Tank, face shield, cart, gloves and jacket won't run an additional $1100-$1700[/QUOTE]

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I use a Miller 200 ( 110v) and love it. It has much better heat and speed control vs. the cheaper units and uses shielding gas which produces a cleaner , stronger weld. I think it was under $500 complete.
The underlying issue for you since you aren't an experienced welder , is that you won't be making good welds since your technique won't allow you to weld with enough heat. A good welder could use a cheap mig since he'll be able to control the heat better with his technique.
Buy up the scale and practice on some scrap , you 'll have a blast!
Of course you'll now need to buy equipment to cut welds apart!
OH , and buy a quality auto dimming welding helmet with a wide view .
Kevin

Re: welders

rjc157 said:

Thanks all what I need to do is there is a rip to the front crossmember of the frame and also concidering putting in gussits on the front to strengthen the frame ,I would bring it to a shop but don't know anyone local that has worked on a healey ,and just don't want to leave it sitting in a shop and wait for someone to get to it thanks for the advice

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It sounds like you may be welding on the bottom of the frame looking up. That's the hardest position for welding and requires more practice than other positions (as well as a coat that won't burn).

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I agree the duty cycle is over 10 minutes. I would recommend reading a buyers guide on purchasing a mig welder. I think you will find it will support my comments.
Many welders believe that because their weld looks good they have a good weld. I have seen what people think are good welds that break away.
The price I quoted was from a price I got from our local welding shop just 2 weeks ago of course that was Canadian dollars, if you can buy it cheaper lucky for you. this machine was Miller matic 250 and the price was $2695.00.
This is my opinion from my many years of experience but everyone is welcomed to have their own thoughts. I know that the smaller machines do not give the same penetrated weld that the bigger machine does.
I would recommend you speak to someone who welds for a living in a welding shop.
I agree take a welding course to gain the fundamentals and then practice and then practice some more. And then when you think you are good practice some more.

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(as well as a coat that won't burn).

Yep, my overall and a couple of pairs of socks can attest to that. The auto dimming helmet is very handy, I paid around £50 for mine a few years ago and found it a great help.

My old SIP turbo 150 did me in good stead, but it is breaking down now, possibly the transformer, but I do not know enough about them to check what is going wrong.



Bob

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I have the HF welder too, bought it in 2000 for $200. Then I had to get a bottle for $60 and a regulator for another $20. It is the lowest end of MIG welders with 4 steps in the amperage range and infinite wire speed. I keep it set on the highest amps and 4.5 on the wire speed which seems to work for most light welding. Its good for only sheetmetal. Of course, that is what these Healeys are made of. I installed new outriggers, sills, fender panels, etc. on my BJ8 with it. It hasn't broken down on me so far but if I were to do it again I would definately purchase the small Miller unit. It isn't a quality welder, not even a mediocre one. If you haven't needed a welder up until now, and haven't a need to do a large quantity of welding in the future (like restoring a Healey), are you sure you want to spend so much just to repair the front crossmember? Can't you tow the car to a local welding shop for the repairs? You would be many dollars and stress ahead. Take the night class on welding and get a feel for what you are getting into, then make your decision. The instructor will probably let you tow the car into the class for the repair too.layful:

Oh, and what I did when using a local welder was to clean and grind to fresh metal the area that needs the work, making any bits that need to be attached by the welder, then call the local shop for an appointment to bring it in. He doesn't need specific Healey experience. When you tow it in, you sit and watch or help him do the welding while you are there, then tow it home. Simple as that, and no leaving it in the shop for him to get to. Instant gratification, yes?? :smile-new: