How Hard Is Racing On A Car?

I'm considering taking the new MGC GTS out on the track, but my concern is that I don't really want to beat it up. I'm not talking purely cosmetics. It's a nearly pristine car but paint can be repaired. I am however concerned with the beating the suspension, chassis, engine, gearbox, brakes, etc will take.

I don't want to end up with a rattly bucket of bolts or something that is no longer nice to drive on trips. Should I stick to the street with this one and build a track car later?

The car in question: https://www.mgnuts.com/mg/mgcgts

Thoughts?

Steve, racing is HARD on a vehicle. Even a spirited track day can take its toll. A couple of years ago, my boss brought his Vette to one of our open track days, and by the end of the day he needed a full set of tires, rotors,and brake pads. I've seen a lot of nice cars driven to a track day event only to go home on a rollback due to a failure of some component. Not to mention the ones that go home in the back of a dump truck. One 328 comes to mind. Or a brand new RX8, or the Z06 with 35 miles on it.
Save that "C", and build something that you can afford to walk away from with no regrets.
Just one mans opinion, you understand.
Jeff

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:]build something that you can afford to walk away from with no regrets[/QUOTE]
A high mileage Yugo? /bcforum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/wink.gif

That's a self propelled wheelbarrow, right?

I absolutely agree with Jeff on this one. It is best to have a car that you can "write off" with no regrets.
When I first did track days with my Spridget, it wasn't just tires and brakes that took a beating. Unibody welds popped, alignment went crazy (due to chassis flex, I think), a steel road wheel cracked, snapped 12+ axles, leaf springs cracked, etc.

If you want to stay with Brit-cars, there are plenty of ratty Spridgets, Spitfires and MGBs that would be cheap and suitable for track-only (assuming no excess rust). And overall, it's even cheaper to just buy a ready made race car.

If you just want track time, there is even a bigger field of track only cars that are non-Brit. I've seen plenty of nice, track-only RX-7s, Hondas and Golfs in the $2000 to $5000 range.

I am building an Escort GT for our local, EMRA club racing series because they are cheap (I got three free ones in the last year), unloved and surprisingly fast. Once the Escort is finished, I'll reserve the Spridget for vintage-only.

Did you say, self-propelled wheelbarrow? How about a "grassroots" version? /bcforum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/jester.gif

You can still Auto-X the thing without worrying too much.

And maybe a track day....MAYBE!

Otherwise find something disposable like this.

I have to also agree with above statements, the last thing in the world you want to do with a really nice street car is take to the track. I recently met a guy who wants to go vintage racing, this gentleman has owned nice British street cars most of his life, I don't think he had any idea of what he's getting into, and sometimes I bumm people out with the reality of track use or racing, these were the comments I said to him to shook him up. In 20+ years of road racing and well over 100 events, I can only remember one race where I didn't fix something, it was kinda scary we thought it was a omen for big time failure. My prep level is more intense than most, I used to literally spend two+ months just to prep my car for the SCCA runoffs. Almost everytime you go to the track you gonna to break something and you're going to have to fix it, that's what racing is.

Having said that, even at a track day you have to willing to come away with a broken part or sanblasting of the nose of the car at minumum, I use to paint my front air dam atleast twice a season. Steve there in no way I'm going to take my 67 GT to a track day event. If you're dying to get some track time in, go to a pro school and use their cars to trash, and keep yours safely in garage.

Some friends of mine have a test for people wanting to get into vintage racing. Here it is. If your willing to pull a $100 bill out of your wallet and without hesitation, burn that $100 bill in front of them, then your ready to go racing. In a way, it mirrors what others have said about being able to walk away from your race car if it is written off. Then again, if your willing to burn a $100 bill then you might also be able to not flinch and rebuild a write off.

Nial, wanna sell that wheelbarrow? I could walk away from that without TOO many regrets. /bcforum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif

Ask yourself if you are OK with this?.



This was a car that ran a track day event the day before we were at Summit Point.

Nial deserves credit for this pic.

Nial - We should submit that to pimp my ride hehehe

I agree with all above, must be able to write it off.

Patrick

Yeah, Patrick.....maybe we could pimp it into a Nissan Speedster convertible /bcforum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/jester.gif

I hate to see things like that. My son-in-law is bringing his new Mustang to our first '07 TT and I think I'll send him that picture as a reminder (one of the reasons I'm building the race-Escort is so I can share it with him and get him away from using his street car at the track).

Last year we had a guy run a new Ford GT into the wall *hard* at Pocono. What do you think that cost to repair?

I saw a replica Ford GT get destroyed at the '06 Pittsburgh Vintage and even that was hard to watch.

The year before, we lost an A4 and a WRX (also at Pocono). I was following the WRX through a turn (in my Miata) when he lost it and rolled. It was raining at the time. It was a 300 HP WRX/STi. The driver looked about 19 and it was supposedly leased. The kid wasn't hurt but he couldn't stop crying.
We had a WRX so I know that a Subaru can run away from a Miata in the rain. I guess he just goofed.
That can happen to any of us....better if it happens in a $500 Escort. /bcforum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/rolleyes.gif

Here's my horror story, brand new car.

OOOUUUCCCCHHHHH!!!!! /bcforum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/frown.gif

Okay, after rolling my street MGA back in 69 coming down the hill at Lime Rock..
I said I would never put a street car on the track again.

Not even autocross..

So for the past 35 years I have been very happy driving my G-Production Spitfire wtih SCCA. Means a tow vehicle a trailer and more.. but certainly beats what happened to that nissan in an earlier post.

Also, another issue.. only race with "mad money"... If you start using your credit card, you'll be is so much debt so quickly, that an inflating mortgage rate will look easy.

Also, for a foot note, I was head instructor at a High Performance Track day where streeet cars were allowed on course..

Not again, to me, way too dangerous, much rather be with a bunch of racers andy day of the week... way too many wanna-be racers who left their brains at the registration desk that morning. the red mist was way to prevelant.

If you must run your street car.. just remember, how much can I afford to loose in both time and cash..
enjoy

Most people, and most mechanics have literally no clue about what sort of stress racing puts on a car.

When I started racing my MGA over 30 years ago, there was no real guide nor locally available expertise except a bit of transferable MGB knowledge.

I raced until it broke (usually measured in minutes of track time) and fixed it and raced it again.

After a season and a half I was getting to be a pretty decent race mechanic (I do all my own work) and the car was winning and not breaking.

If you take a car built by someone who is NOT a race mechanic out on the track, that is what you are in for. And WHEN (not if) it breaks, it can always be in a way that is destructive to the car itself. I narrowly missed trashing my car when a small lockwasher inside a rear caliper cracked, which allowed a screw to back out and fall behind a brake piston, which stayed on after I rleased the brakes and spun me backward into the Armco. It doesn't take much to cause serious damage (luckily I only lost a door and a good slice of equanimity on that one).

Steve....don't let you scare you that much by the others.

Racing is good fun, sometimes a spiritual thing, a group thing you share with other racers off the track.

Okay...you spare part bills will rise....new brake pads, tires, some engine parts, maybe a whole engine if something went wrong badly.

Accidents can happen....everywhere and anytime...not only on tracks.

How much fun you will have is dependable from the group you want to race with. If you like to save the car than a more vintage biased group is the right for you. If you like to race with the knife on the edge then there are for sure other groups in USA that will serve you more.

I do race since 2004 and started with a standard daily driver and developed the car more and more. I had only one little crash where I hit a rear fender on a tire wall. My own fault but I maintain my car very well and I still use it as a daily driver but now with 60 hp more ;-)

I know there are risks to damage the car but the fun I have with racing is worth that risk and on the other hand...how long we'll might be able to drive those cars? 10 years? 20 years? Better to retire them on the track with some victories....

Cheers
Chris

Bill your comments made me think of one time when my wife was hanging out with me in shop as I prepped my F-production Sprite for a national race. We got to talking about modified and uprated components and parts. She asked me if there was anything on the car that was just a stock part, all I could come up with was two engine motor mounts /bcforum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif

To add to my comment:
This is an example of racing I won't like to be in.....too hard driving. As a prof. racer told me....racing takes place between the two white lines.....the part outside the lines is reserved for the gardening tractor....

https://www.trackdaymedia.com/cruises/runoffs%2005%20eprod%20erik%20m.wmv

Well, it <u>was</u> the runoffs, for the National Championship, after all.
Jeff