• The Roadster Factory Recovery Fund - Friends, as you may have heard, The Roadster Factory, a respected British Car Parts business in PA, suffered a total loss in a fire on Christmas Day. Read about it, discuss or ask questions >> HERE. The Triumph Register of America is sponsoring a fund raiser to help TRF get back on their feet. If you can help, vist >> their GoFundMe page.
  • Hey there Guest!
    If you enjoy BCF and find our forum a useful resource, if you appreciate not having ads pop up all over the place and you want to ensure we can stay online - Please consider supporting with an "optional" low-cost annual subscription.
    **Upgrade Now**
    (PS: Subscribers don't see this UGLY banner)
Tips
Tips

TR2/3/3A Starter catches 50% of the time

Country flag
Offline
Late TR3 motor with the exposed end on the starter. About 1/2 the time the starter will spin free without engaging the flywheel, the rest of this time it grabs and does a fine job of cranking and starting the car. I had the starter on the bench during the recent re-build and seems to operate as it should, the ring gears are all fine, no missing teeth.

The only remedy I have tried is to lubricate the end that is visible with some spray lithium grease. Not sure what to try as it is not 100% failure.

All suggestions appreciated.

Bill B
TS75131E
 

TR3driver

Great Pumpkin - R.I.P
Offline
IIRC, the book warns against lubricating the Bendix. It has to be dry to work right.
I would also clean the battery posts and clamps, plus the connection where the ground strap meets the firewall. Any corrosion or paint can limit current just enough to make the Bendix not work.

You might also verify that the engine doesn't move at all. If it moves a half turn and then the starter spins free, that's a different problem.
 
Last edited:
OP
B
Country flag
Offline
IIRC, the book wants against lubricating the Bendix. It has to be dry to work right.
I would also clean the battery posts and clamps, plus the connection where the ground strap meets the firewall. Any corrosion or paint can limit current just enough to make the Bendix not work.

You might also verify that the engine doesn't move at all. If it moves a half turn and then the starter spins free, that's a different problem.

OK, I’ll go back and clean the bendix real good. Don’t think the motor moves at all, but will re-check.

Cables are all new, clean, and tight, all new restoration.
Thx
 

Gliderman8

Great Pumpkin
Country flag
Offline
It’s also possible that your ring gear has moved.
 

CJD

Yoda
Country flag
Offline
I think the Bendix drive gets ample lubrication from the spinning flywheel and extraneous lube from the engine, pilot bearing and throw out bearings. More than likely problem is old oil and dirt restricting movement of the Bendix gear. Your thorough cleaning should take care of it. Douse with ample brake cleaner/carb cleaner and dry off. I have always used a small amount of lubrication...but don't know if it is necessary from what Randall says. He's usually up on those things.

The Bendix relies on inertia to throw the gear into the flywheel, so anything that restricts movement of the gear or slows the initial rotation of the starter can affect engagement.
 

sp53

Yoda
Country flag
Offline
I had a similar problem once and it turned out to be the cotton wrapping on the field coils was old and rotting. I rewrapped them myself for like 5 bucks. I bought a roll of the cotton tape from general electrical motor repair shop. It took some time, but was easy to accomplish.
 

TR3driver

Great Pumpkin - R.I.P
Offline
This was a frame off restoration, all connections are clean and tight. Once it catches, it Crank’s till it starts.
I've seen it more than once : The ground strap gets bolted to the firewall, which was painted during the restoration. No matter how clean and tight that joint is, it has to be bare metal to bare metal or it doesn't conduct.

Starter stall current (which is when it spins hard enough to extend the Bendix) is given as roughly 450 amps at only 7 volts; while normal cranking current is only 250 amps at 9 volts. So a tiny amount of resistance can interfere with the jerk that engages the Bendix, but still let it crank the engine.

Here's the note about not lubing the Bendix:

D7vOcne.jpg
 

TR3driver

Great Pumpkin - R.I.P
Offline
It’s also possible that your ring gear has moved.
Shouldn't be an issue here (as it is for later TR6). On a later TR3 through TR4A, the ring gear is bolted to the flywheel.

And before that, the starter tried to drive the gear further onto the flywheel, against a shoulder (that it should already be up against).

The problem with the ring gear moving didn't start until they went to a pre-engaged starter design, around 68 or 69. No doubt someone saved a few dollars by not changing the flywheel & ring gear to match the change in starter motion.
 

Gliderman8

Great Pumpkin
Country flag
Offline
Shouldn't be an issue here (as it is for later TR6). On a later TR3 through TR4A, the ring gear is bolted to the flywheel.

And before that, the starter tried to drive the gear further onto the flywheel, against a shoulder (that it should already be up against).

The problem with the ring gear moving didn't start until they went to a pre-engaged starter design, around 68 or 69. No doubt someone saved a few dollars by not changing the flywheel & ring gear to match the change in starter motion.
Thanks Randall... I didn't know the ring gear was bolted in place.
I was speaking from experience when I suggested the flywheel might have moved. The same symptoms plagued my car.... starter gear would not engage all the time but it would just spin.
Here's a pic of my flywheel with the ring gear as it was when I removed it. The ring gear should be against the shoulder at the top of the pic. The ring gear moved almost 2 inches away from the shoulder making it impossible for the starter to engage unless the flywheel was 180 degrees opposite.
A $30 ring gear but a PITA to install it. All is good now!

IMG_2087.jpg
 
Last edited:
Country flag
Offline
Just had a TR4 do me that way. Starter bendix not engaging flywheel but once in about ten tries. I removed starter, installed a thin starter spacer and works everytime now.
Marv
 

Jim_Stevens

Jedi Warrior
Gold
Country flag
Offline
Similar issue... new paint job, partial success on starting. I know I need to scrape off more paint from under the ground to body strap. It does work 100% of the time when I rock the car in reverse first... I’m not sure what that means?

Jim
TS 44743L “O”
 

RandyInUtah

Member
Country flag
Offline
I one had 56 Ford that the starter would fail to start cranking the engine at certain times. Rocking the car in reverse would fee up the starter bendix drive. Turn out to be a bad spot on the flywheel with damaged teeth. The engine likes to stop sometimes in the same spot with the bad teeth.
 

DavidApp

Yoda
Country flag
Offline
If the engine tends to stop in the same spot every time that spot will get the most wear. So rocking in reverse will move it away from that spot. Do you have a starting handle? Use that to move the engine a bit.

David
 

Jim_Stevens

Jedi Warrior
Gold
Country flag
Offline
It’s definitely the engine ground. I ran a jumper cable from the battery to the block and the starter was fine. I recall that prior to the restoration, the grounding strap went from the battery to the block, where the heater line support and the coil bolt to the block, and bypassed the body entirely.
Looks like on a TR6, they solved the problem (if I’m interpreting a picture of the ground strap correctly) by having it go from the battery, body, AND engine.
 
Similar threads
Thread starter Title Forum Replies Date
J Starter works fine but car catches after you let off on the starter Austin Healey 14
R TR6 Starter Solenoid Conection Triumph 11
R TR6 Lucas Starter 2M100 - Extra Part? Triumph 2
G TR2/3/3A TS37903F Is my engine a TR3A engine because my starter says no. Triumph 3
Frameman 1949 Engine Misfiring & Starter Cranks Slowly When Hot Austin Healey 8
G TR2/3/3A TR3 starter disassembly rebuild early M428G bomb Triumph 6
N TR5/TR250 Starter Box Assembly Leak Triumph 14
P TR2/3/3A British High Torque starter Triumph 6
W General Tech 2500S starter motor and fuse box questions Triumph 3
EWD For Sale ‘74 TR6 original starter Triumph Classifieds 0
M High-Torque Starter Austin Healey 10
W Generator and Starter Long Bolts Spridgets 0
H Lucas Starter Model for 3000 Mark II, BT7 Austin Healey 3
R Bugeye Starter Switch Spridgets 7
B General MG Remote Starter Switch MG 6
S MGB MGB Starter Woes MG 13
M TR6 Starter Relay on a 73 TR6?? Triumph 22
edkap2002 TR6 starter motor advice Triumph 12
algot1901 1950 Prefect starter Other British Cars 1
Martinld123 High-Torque Starter Austin Healey 4
R TR6 Starter wiring question Triumph 6
S TR2/3/3A Rebuilding the early tr3 starter Triumph 5
RichB4493 TR2/3/3A TR3 not starting - Slow/Weak Starter Triumph 33
B TR4/4A High Torque Starter Wiring Triumph 9
algot1901 1950 Prefect Starter Other British Cars 10
S Starter Solenoid Nut Size for BJ8 Austin Healey 1
B High-Torque Starter Rattling Noise Austin Healey 3
EWD TR6 ‘74 TR6 Starter & Trans Cover Triumph 13
Jim_Stevens TR2/3/3A Starter/ring gear engagement Triumph 11
J TR6 72 TR6 starter problem Triumph 10
A TR2/3/3A Early TR3 starter (bomb style) bushings sizes Triumph 7
C MGA Change a pull starter to a push button system MG 6
Michael Oritt Starter Button Austin Healey 19
D WOSP Starter Austin Healey 9
DrEntropy MGB Replacement starter MG 7
steveg TR6 '74 - Where is the Starter Relay located? Triumph 1
AUSMHLY Crankshaft Starter Nut Austin Healey 10
K For Sale Triumph TR3 Bullnose Starter Triumph Classifieds 0
B TR4/4A Starter dog bolt Triumph 15
D Starter Austin Healey 26
red57 What starter is this? Austin Healey 6
S TR2/3/3A Correct Starter Triumph 4
Jim_Stevens TR2/3/3A No Ignition light and no starter Triumph 11
R TR6 Is this a starter issue? Triumph 6
Got_All_4 TR2/3/3A Gear reduction starter problems Triumph 5
John_Mc TR6 Starter not engaging consistently Triumph 9
R TR2/3/3A Starter rear plate 54 TR-2 Triumph 12
M TR6 Starter lagging issue Triumph 2
Gliderman8 Starter keeps running TVR 20
K For Sale Starter Hand Crank Triumph Classifieds 0

Similar threads

Top