Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 51

Thread: Domestic Automakers stopping making cars.

The Pub is: Forum to generally shoot the breeze. It is NOT: a debate forum (NO Politics, religion, or controversial topics.) Keep it clean, fun and lite!

  1. #1
    Great Pumpkin JPSmit's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Location
    Toronto, ON
    Posts
    18,825
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    0
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    64
    Thanked in
    61 Posts

    Domestic Automakers stopping making cars.

    I know we have discussed this before but, very interesting stats here:

    Whole article

    https://www.hagerty.com/articles-vid...hursday_Dec_19

    relevant bits:

    For example, if you’re wondering why Ford is largely abandoning the car business, consider that, for the first six months of 2019, the combined sales of seven Ford models of passenger cars—in current production or as existing inventory being sold down—did not add up to even half of what the Ford F-series pickup alone sold in the same period. During that stretch, Ford sold five trucks for every car it moved. Excluding sales of the Mustang, all of Ford and Lincoln’s current car line together—Fiesta, Fusion, Taurus, MKZ, Continental (Focus production ended in May 2018)—was handily outsold by the Honda Civic. At Ford, the car business is not a business, it’s an expensive hobby.

    In July, BMW CEO Harald Krüger resigned after four years in the job, a relatively short tenure for chief executives at the Munich maker. Among the problems, BMW’s small-car offshoot, Mini, has been in free fall. Increasingly irate dealers—a former chairman of the dealer council is suing BMW of North America for failing to invest in Mini—managed to move only 17,583 cars. Yes, the entire Mini marque, seven distinct models, is being outsold by the Mitsubishi Outlander Sport. At least this isn’t as dire as Fiat: With 5103 sales racked up in six months, the Italian brand is being beaten in the States by the Nissan Leaf electric. Alfa isn’t doing much better, at just over 9000 cars sold.

    fascinating - I would also personally comment on how quickly we forget gas at $100+ a barrel.
    John-Peter Smit
    1976 MG Midget
    1969 Vauxhall Viva GT
    1958 Fiat Multipla (Barn art)

  2. #2
    Great Pumpkin NutmegCT's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Location
    Connecticut USA
    Posts
    11,465
    Blog Entries
    1
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    78
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    115
    Thanked in
    107 Posts

    Re: Domestic Automakers stopping making cars.

    Trucks do have their uses for carrying stuff, but I've always preferred a sedan for traveling. Times change for sure, but I sometimes wonder if it's the "big and tough factor" in trucks that leads to sales. I may be biased, as most of the trucks I see around here are either (1) brand new, covered in chrome, full of fancy options, polished and shiny 24/7 and used for carrying family groceries, or (2) "mudders" used for mud racing.)

    OK - back to my cave.
    Tom M.
    PS - really enjoy the Christmas theme!
    Mac & Phyllis Take a Trip: http://nutmegflyer.com/trip-details-daily-updates/
    History: 1976 MGB, 1959 Triumph TR3A, 1960 Mercedes-Benz 190b, 1958 Rambler American.
    Current: 1953 MG TD27318.

  3. #3
    Administrator Basil's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2000
    Location
    Turn left at Albuquerque
    Posts
    24,425
    Blog Entries
    7
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    62
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    112
    Thanked in
    109 Posts

    Re: Domestic Automakers stopping making cars.

    Not sure why this was posted in New Members, but I'm moving to Pub.
    “The smallest act of kindness is worth more than the grandest intention.” - Oscar Wilde

  4. #4
    Great Pumpkin JPSmit's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Location
    Toronto, ON
    Posts
    18,825
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    0
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    64
    Thanked in
    61 Posts

    Re: Domestic Automakers stopping making cars.

    Quote Originally Posted by Basil View Post
    Not sure why this was posted in New Members, but I'm moving to Pub.
    cause I'm an idiot. that's why doh!
    John-Peter Smit
    1976 MG Midget
    1969 Vauxhall Viva GT
    1958 Fiat Multipla (Barn art)

  5. #5
    Luke Skywalker vette's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2002
    Location
    Pa.
    Posts
    1,852
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    1
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    18
    Thanked in
    16 Posts

    Re: Domestic Automakers stopping making cars.

    I think its a no brainer. People just want SUVs and Trucks. The only people buying sedans are the people that can't afford the SUVs and Trucks. (you can't hardly find a stripped down truck). Yes you can sell sporty GTs and the like but that's not the large market. Big companies can't survive on the size of the sport GT and sport sedan market. You got to hit the masses and that's SUvs and Trucks.
    About TV Shows-
    "...you really can't restore a car in 10 days. I don't want to watch a race where people have to restore it in a week. It's not going to drive, and those cars never work. In real life, it takes years to get it right. " Jay Leno.

  6. #6
    Yoda Gliderman8's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    PA
    Posts
    8,537
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    11
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    38
    Thanked in
    38 Posts

    Re: Domestic Automakers stopping making cars.

    I bought a sedan 9 months ago... I could have bought an SUV but I didn't see the need for it since my wife has one. Why have two in a family?
    I would never consider getting a truck. I have a small (8ft.) trailer that I use occasionally.
    My 2019 sedan suits me just fine. It gets good mileage and is quite comfortable.
    Elliot
    Central PA
    1973 TR6 Damson Plum / Biscuit interior, HVDA 5-speed, Good Parts Hubs
    1976 TR6 White/Biscuit interior SOLD
    Nostalgia isn't what it used to be.

  7. #7
    Luke Skywalker vette's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2002
    Location
    Pa.
    Posts
    1,852
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    1
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    18
    Thanked in
    16 Posts

    Re: Domestic Automakers stopping making cars.

    A 2 SUV family is perfect for us. Albeit hers is smaller than mine. Mine tows 7000 lbs. Hers tows the grandkids. With the snow & ice here in Pa ( you obviously have the same) she has informed me that she will never go back to even a front wheel drive vehicle.
    Could I ask, What model sedan did you buy?
    About TV Shows-
    "...you really can't restore a car in 10 days. I don't want to watch a race where people have to restore it in a week. It's not going to drive, and those cars never work. In real life, it takes years to get it right. " Jay Leno.

  8. #8
    Yoda Gliderman8's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    PA
    Posts
    8,537
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    11
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    38
    Thanked in
    38 Posts

    Re: Domestic Automakers stopping making cars.

    I bought an AWD 2019 Mazda3... the only thing I wish I could have gotten was the 6-speed manual. The manual is only offered overseas for the sedan.
    Elliot
    Central PA
    1973 TR6 Damson Plum / Biscuit interior, HVDA 5-speed, Good Parts Hubs
    1976 TR6 White/Biscuit interior SOLD
    Nostalgia isn't what it used to be.

  9. #9
    Yoda PAUL161's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    Locust Grove, Oklahoma
    Posts
    9,496
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    1
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    46
    Thanked in
    43 Posts

    Re: Domestic Automakers stopping making cars.

    Me, one fancy Silverado 4 door truck that does everything but drive it's self, the wife has a new car, which she loves, and of course the TF. I pull a couple trailers with the truck moving tractors around, so it is a necessity as well as a mode of transportation. but, the wifes new car gets such great gas mileage, it makes the truck look like a gas hog! It is!

    Remember, Never Forget
    We Live In The Land of The Free
    Because of The Brave

    How good it feels, the hand of an old friend! Longfellow

  10. #10
    Yoda PAUL161's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    Locust Grove, Oklahoma
    Posts
    9,496
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    1
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    46
    Thanked in
    43 Posts

    Re: Domestic Automakers stopping making cars.

    Two of my grandsons came over yesterday on a Christmas run in the oldest grandsons new Tesla AWD duel motor with a performance package, whatever that entails. He's single makes tons of money, even bought another airplane a couple weeks ago! He had a few girlfriends and I asked him once why he isn't married, he said all girls want is your money! Smart kid! The car, quite impressive and makes zero noise. He said the battery package, which is under the floor, is supposed to last over 100k miles and $2,000 to replace. He didn't say how much it cost, but I know it's slightly more than I would pay!

    Tesla-Model-3.jpg

    Remember, Never Forget
    We Live In The Land of The Free
    Because of The Brave

    How good it feels, the hand of an old friend! Longfellow

  11. #11
    Great Pumpkin DrEntropy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    Elsinore, DK
    Posts
    33,198
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    36
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    73
    Thanked in
    72 Posts

    Re: Domestic Automakers stopping making cars.

    Seems to me the younger folks are not into automobiles at all. Only as conveyances. I see mostly SUV's and trucks, a smattering of Prius' and even fewer Teslas. The newer domestic sedans are usually driven by seniors (I say that with respect now), and those are usually Lincoln and Caddy models. The rest seem to ALL be Civics or Camrys. From new ones, to decades-old ones plugging away. Very few domestic makers' new examples (Mustang, Camaro, Charger and Corvette excluded, I'd consider they're niche products). And I'm given to understand a lot of those are re-badged ones of Asian origin.

    Sad, really. Something that has so radically influenced and changed this country's way of living is being outsourced. The "family sedan" is becoming extinct. And what was the last "station wagon" domestically made? I've no clue.
    '64 MGB, '67 Lotus Elan S-3 DHC,'69 Lotus Elan +2
    '78 Alfa Romeo Spider-undergoing surgery: O=\*/=O
    '84 300D Turbo-"Diesela"-Now my Daily: Oo|≣|oO
    '02 Toyota Camry- SWMBO's 'new-to-her' Daily. <sigh>
    Chaos & Mayhem PTY, LTD..C.I.O. & Floor Sweepervisor

  12. #12
    Luke Skywalker vette's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2002
    Location
    Pa.
    Posts
    1,852
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    1
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    18
    Thanked in
    16 Posts

    Re: Domestic Automakers stopping making cars.

    I think the SUVs & Trucks are the new family sedan. The market speaks its what the majority want. Having said that I think the demise of the sedan as we remember it is because the domestic OEMs stopped putting development into them.
    They saw more profit in the SUV & Trk segment. So yeh the market speaks but the manufactures hold sway. In reality the government holds sway. One reason the OEMs would push the market towards the SUVs & Trks is because they have the profit margin to absorb all the mandated regulations. You wonder why the trucks are so big... safety standards have forced bigger wheels & tires, bigger chassis & more electronics to keep YOU safe. The governments knows better than you what you need.
    About TV Shows-
    "...you really can't restore a car in 10 days. I don't want to watch a race where people have to restore it in a week. It's not going to drive, and those cars never work. In real life, it takes years to get it right. " Jay Leno.

  13. #13
    Yoda John Turney's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2002
    Location
    Concord, CA
    Posts
    3,821
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    56
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    35
    Thanked in
    34 Posts

    Re: Domestic Automakers stopping making cars.

    With no more sedans, how will they meet the CAFE standards with big trucks and SUVs?
    John, BN4

  14. #14
    Administrator Basil's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2000
    Location
    Turn left at Albuquerque
    Posts
    24,425
    Blog Entries
    7
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    62
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    112
    Thanked in
    109 Posts

    Re: Domestic Automakers stopping making cars.

    Quote Originally Posted by vette View Post
    I think its a no brainer. People just want SUVs and Trucks. The only people buying sedans are the people that can't afford the SUVs and Trucks. (<snip>)
    I love my Santa Fe. It drives as nice as a sedan but is more utilitarian. Lots of storage which comes in handy on long trips and with the tow kit I added I can tow small trailers when needed.
    “The smallest act of kindness is worth more than the grandest intention.” - Oscar Wilde

  15. #15
    Yoda AngliaGT's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    Roanoke,Virginia
    Posts
    8,887
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    6
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    14
    Thanked in
    14 Posts

    Re: Domestic Automakers stopping making cars.

    Ever notice how some companies advertise just trucks & suv's?

    In Eureka,we had neighbors who had three pickups - a Dodge -
    1 ton Megacab 4WD that the mother used for grocery shopping & hauling
    grandkids to/from school,a new Chevy crew cab 4WD that the father used
    for the same thing,and an older single cab Dodge 1/2 ton 4WD that they
    would use when the actually hauled something.
    We had another neighbor (housewife) that had a newer (bought new)
    Ford F250 crewcab diesel 4WD that she used for hauling kids & groceries.

    Rather than those,I'd prefer a small car for driving around town.
    Just Remember.......
    NOBODY ever says "COOL PRIUS!"

  16. #16
    Great Pumpkin JPSmit's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Location
    Toronto, ON
    Posts
    18,825
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    0
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    64
    Thanked in
    61 Posts

    Re: Domestic Automakers stopping making cars.

    Quote Originally Posted by AngliaGT View Post
    Ever notice how some companies advertise just trucks & suv's?

    In Eureka,we had neighbors who had three pickups - a Dodge -
    1 ton Megacab 4WD that the mother used for grocery shopping & hauling
    grandkids to/from school,a new Chevy crew cab 4WD that the father used
    for the same thing,and an older single cab Dodge 1/2 ton 4WD that they
    would use when the actually hauled something.
    We had another neighbor (housewife) that had a newer (bought new)
    Ford F250 crewcab diesel 4WD that she used for hauling kids & groceries.

    Rather than those,I'd prefer a small car for driving around town.
    I've heard that comment that part of the issue may be that the big three don't advertize cars. (and frankly the other companies barely do)
    John-Peter Smit
    1976 MG Midget
    1969 Vauxhall Viva GT
    1958 Fiat Multipla (Barn art)

  17. #17
    Luke Skywalker LarryK's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Millstadt, IL
    Posts
    1,971
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    0
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    16
    Thanked in
    16 Posts

    Re: Domestic Automakers stopping making cars.

    End of the sedans brings more SUVs and Trucks and the demise of the manual transmission. We seem to be the only country that can't shift or do roundabouts. Firetrucks, ambulances and public transportation are now automatics. Trucking industry heading to autos. With the new engineered engines emmisions are down.
    Larry K
    58 Jag 3.4 MK 1 auto under restoration, 57 Jag 3.4 MK1 manual ,
    03 Cooper S, 2011 Cooper S Countryman, 2011 Land Rover LR4 HSE LUX, 1964 Valiant V200
    Also had , 68 Cortina 1600E, 64 Spit 4 & 80 1500, 73 GT6 3, 71 XJ6, 79 XJ6, 86 XJS V-12, 53 XK120 OTS.

  18. #18
    Luke Skywalker vette's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2002
    Location
    Pa.
    Posts
    1,852
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    1
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    18
    Thanked in
    16 Posts

    Re: Domestic Automakers stopping making cars.

    Quote Originally Posted by John Turney View Post
    With no more sedans, how will they meet the CAFE standards with big trucks and SUVs?
    oh I believe there will be plenty of options. I’m sure electric will be in the mix. I’m sure u know about “displacement on demand “ where they drop half the cylinders when cruising. GM calls there new system “Active Fuel Management” . They also shut the engines off at red lights. This technology is proving seamless but of coarse I don’t like it. Ford & GM are big time into it. Of coarse the Government didn’t ask me when they mandated the CAFE standards. It’s ironic & contradictory what regulations are doing to our vehicles and the industry as a whole. The safety regulators mandate bigger, stronger, defensiveness. The enviro regulators mandate less fuel, less carbon footprint and more from less. There contradictory. The OEMs have to build it big and strong but use less energy to drag it down the road. Actually they are doing pretty good at making that happen. But the last people they are trying to satisfy is us. So they go with the product that has the greatest profit margin. Then spend another fortune to convince us that it is what we want or need.
    About TV Shows-
    "...you really can't restore a car in 10 days. I don't want to watch a race where people have to restore it in a week. It's not going to drive, and those cars never work. In real life, it takes years to get it right. " Jay Leno.

  19. #19
    Luke Skywalker LarryK's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Millstadt, IL
    Posts
    1,971
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    0
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    16
    Thanked in
    16 Posts

    Re: Domestic Automakers stopping making cars.

    It already has driven me to buy older classic models. Cheaper to fix, mileage pretty good, good designs that are familiar to us. Can but 2-3 for the price of anything new now. Only thing, Illinois now double taxes by taxing new and trade-in, the double plate fees. No regard for emissions, as we have only one station in three counties. Electric might be good, but how much can the old plants take to produce the power for the extra charging stations.
    Larry K
    58 Jag 3.4 MK 1 auto under restoration, 57 Jag 3.4 MK1 manual ,
    03 Cooper S, 2011 Cooper S Countryman, 2011 Land Rover LR4 HSE LUX, 1964 Valiant V200
    Also had , 68 Cortina 1600E, 64 Spit 4 & 80 1500, 73 GT6 3, 71 XJ6, 79 XJ6, 86 XJS V-12, 53 XK120 OTS.

  20. #20
    Great Pumpkin NutmegCT's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Location
    Connecticut USA
    Posts
    11,465
    Blog Entries
    1
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    78
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    115
    Thanked in
    107 Posts

    Re: Domestic Automakers stopping making cars.

    Larry - I feel the same about "moving to electric". We just don't have the infrastructure for all those charging stations at present, and beyond that, most of the electric for charging will come from the same plants and grids which can barely support the current we use today. Not even considering the environmental and safety problems all the batteries will bring. Siince WW2, we've eliminated public transport systems and replaced with highways jammed with individual cars.

    Still not sure that trucks are getting bigger due to increased safety regulations. Wouldn't SUVs and sedans be getting bigger too? Trucks with huge cabs, all the bling, big diesels, lower mpg than sedans ... just to carry groceries and take the kids to schools and malls? Manufacturers want to increase profits, so they build bigger vehicles that are more appealing than the lowly family sedans. This is happening in housing too, where few small houses are being built, but large numbers of McMansions are going up all over the country. Friends in their 30s, no children desired, spent two years looking for a 2 BR 2 bath house near their jobs, with no luck. Had to borrow $600K for a "starter" four bedroom, three bath, three car garage for only $650K.

    Anyway, think I'll keep my 2018 4 cylinder Altima for a while; best car I've ever owned. Then if I'm still around in a few years, move to a 1954 Nash or Chevrolet two door.

    1954NashRambler.jpg

    PS - back in college I had a 1961 Valiant V100. Simple, reliable, easy to fix. I remember the floor shift - which was cheaper than three on the tree, the slant-six engine I could easily work on, the Clardy under dash a/c, and the fake continental trunk lid!
    Mac & Phyllis Take a Trip: http://nutmegflyer.com/trip-details-daily-updates/
    History: 1976 MGB, 1959 Triumph TR3A, 1960 Mercedes-Benz 190b, 1958 Rambler American.
    Current: 1953 MG TD27318.

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •