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Scotsman
02-20-2014, 05:03 PM
Does anyone have information about "Waterless Coolants". In an episode of Wheeler Dealer January 2013 they restored a TR6 and raved about a "New Revolutionary Waterless Coolant" that never needs to be replaced https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HDCOGIn2ebI. Not an additive but a product that completely replaces traditional water based coolants. They quoted 90GBP (approx $150) as the cost. A lot cheaper and simpler than installing an electric fan, larger radiator, etc etc. I would also like to keep my TR3A as original as possible, but also not overheat while stuck in slow traffic on a hot day.

Jay Leno also discusses Evans Waterless Coolant at https://www.jaylenosgarage.com/extras/car-care/waterless-engine-coolant/

tinman58
02-20-2014, 07:41 PM
I have heard good and bad. A friend with a 57 Morgan swears by it. Others not so much. I have the Evans on my shelf I just haven't had the time to do the change over. (maybe tomorrow)

Andrew Mace
02-20-2014, 09:39 PM
Considering that:

a. I've pretty much never had an overheating problem that wasn't easily fixed by cleaning out the cooling system and/or replacing failed parts as needed, after which "traditional" antifreeze was again used; and
b. If or when a car boils over or a hose splits, I'd much prefer to spend $10-15 to replenish the system rather than upwards of $150

I really don't see the point. :whistle:

CJD
02-20-2014, 10:05 PM
Once your thermostat goes full open, the engine will overheat regardless of what is circulating. It sounds like a paid advertisement to me!?!

charleyf
02-21-2014, 02:57 AM
I also heard the rumor that some of the waterless cooolant is flammable. That does not sound good with a split hose in the engine compartment.
Charley

TR3driver
02-21-2014, 03:34 AM
Part of the problem is the definition of "overheat". The waterless coolant will very likely make the engine run even hotter than it did before, because it is not as good at transferring heat out of the engine. But, it has a very high boiling point, so it is unlikely that the engine will boil over. So, is 300F "overheated" if the coolant does not boil? Personally, I'd say "yes", but I can see the argument either way.

Also, the stock TR3 temperature gauge is rather fragile. In my experience, if the engine gets beyond full scale on the gauge (230F IIRC), the gauge will be ruined.

I did experiment some with waterless coolant (although not the Evans product) many years ago. It performed as advertised; right up until the engine swallowed a valve and blew pretty much all of #3 cylinder out the exhaust pipe. Not really the coolant's fault, but maybe a parable about not finding and fixing the underlying problem instead of just covering it up. At any rate, I have no plans to ever repeat the experiment!

John, that isn't quite true. The amount of heat rejected (removed from the engine and conducted to the air) will continue to increase as the temperature of the radiator continues to increase.

"Flammable" is another thorny topic. Yes, the waterless coolant will burn if you get it hot enough. But oddly enough, the same is true of the conventional water/glycol mixture. The difference is that, with water/glycol, you have to first heat it long enough to boil off the water; and then the remaining glycol will burn. Not as far fetched as it might sound if, for example, you get a pool of coolant laying on top of an exhaust manifold.

But with the waterless coolant, there is no need to run a pressurized system, so it is very unlikely that a coolant hose will split.

TR3driver
02-21-2014, 03:40 AM
a. I've pretty much never had an overheating problem that wasn't easily fixed by cleaning out the cooling system and/or replacing failed parts as needed,
You make it all sound so easy! I guess I could say the same, except that it has literally taken me months or years to identify the "failed" component in need of replacement. Most recently, I took the radiator to the shop 3 times (or was it 4) before they finally realized that it had a problem!

Lbp
02-21-2014, 01:16 PM
Here's a thread on waterless coolant from another forum I''m active on (Porsche 968 - my DD). Some good info:

https://www.968forums.com/topic/13001-waterless-coolant/page__hl__%20waterless%20%20coolant

Bill

CJD
02-21-2014, 01:22 PM
John, that isn't quite true. The amount of heat rejected (removed from the engine and conducted to the air) will continue to increase as the temperature of the radiator continues to increase.
.


True, but then you are counting on the system reaching some steady point where the overheating cycle stabilizes at an elevated temperature. I am just of the opinion that the radiator on these cars is the weakest link, so what is circulating is secondary to where the heat is going...

Hot Wings
02-21-2014, 03:05 PM
Waterless coolant has been around for a long time and seems to follow a cyclic popularity curve. It's not much more than propylene glycol (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antifreeze) with some inhibitors. Sierra antifreeze (https://images.peakauto.com/Sierra%20Concentrate%20Antifreeze%20&%20Coolant%20Rev%20052013.pdf) is essentially the same thing chemically and a whole lot less expensive if you want to experiment.

tinman58
02-21-2014, 04:46 PM
Well I just changed out my "coolant" for the "Evans" We are doing a drive up to Mt. Hamilton tomorrow. 4300' to the top up a winding road. We have done this drive many times. I will bring along 2 gallons of water and the old pressure cap "justin case" . I will post my findings later....

Andrew Mace
02-21-2014, 07:48 PM
You make it all sound so easy! I guess I could say the same, except that it has literally taken me months or years to identify the "failed" component in need of replacement. Most recently, I took the radiator to the shop 3 times (or was it 4) before they finally realized that it had a problem!I readily admit that I've had much less experience with the wet-liner engine, and all of that was back around 1972-75, when I'll admit they were newer. Still, my 3A had 98,700 miles on it when I parked it (for various other reasons, none having to do with the cooling system)! :wink-new:

tinman58
03-04-2014, 09:53 PM
I used the waterless coolant on a drive up to MT. Hamilton. Everything was the same as on previous drives up the MT. Until we got down to about 20 miles from Livermore. The TR3 just died. No spark at the plugs. Had to be the coil. Drove 20 miles to town (in a MG) buy a coil then back 20 miles, Installed the new coil..... no spark. No cell phone coverage out in the sticks. So back into town (20 miles, in a MG(: ). Called a friend and met us in town, (25 miles from home) rented a trailer to haul the TR3 home. Back up the mountain 20 miles. Load the tr on the trailer. But there is nowhere to turn around so farther up the mountian to the junction of mines road and Del Puerto Canyon about 8 more miles farther up. We got back in to Brentwood at about 7:00 that night. Called Moss Motors and ordered new flame thrower electronics. I installed the new parts today and the TR fired right up. So if you use the Evans waterless coolant it can fry your petronics. LOL.......
3205232053

Geo Hahn
03-05-2014, 01:01 AM
That is an interesting point -- even on a stock points ignition there are parts that heat can kill that may suffer more if a coolant operates at a higher temp.

Well, I'll never know -- I buy coolant each year at Pep Boys Black Friday sale for a buck or two per gallon. Not much incentive to experiment with other formulation so long at the usual stuff works.

CJD
03-05-2014, 04:55 AM
Bummer! I've had a few road trips like yours...

FordFiesta
03-05-2014, 11:21 AM
And (unlike ethylene glycol) propylene glycol in not toxic to pets and wildlife - so for that reason alone it's all I run in my three TRs (mixed with water in a normal freeze-protection proportion, not 100%).