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RickB
08-11-2011, 02:51 PM
I found an lbc that was imported a long time ago but never licensed in the USA.
If I bought it how difficult would it be to get it licensed?
I have no idea what the first step would be.

JBee
08-11-2011, 03:00 PM
the problem is....when you go to the DMV in WA how do they know U havent stolen it?
U might contact the DMV and tell your tale....to a supervisor...but without any supporting docs you will have a problem.

but look here........WA might be liberal........


Replacing Your Lost Title

If you suddenly realize your vehicle's title is missing, you'll need to replace this document. It's important, especially if you're in the process of selling your vehicle.


Here's what you do:
Complete and notarize an Affidavit of Loss form.
Pay a $9 fee.

Do this in person by visiting any vehicle licensing office. Or, if you prefer to submit by mail, send it to:
Department of Licensing
P.O. Box 9909
Olympia, Washington 98507-8500

Be patient. It takes up to ten weeks for your duplicate title to arrive in the mail.

RickB
08-11-2011, 03:12 PM
So, given there's no record of the car here in the USA they would do some kind of search most likely but it wouldn't turn up - then they just issue a title?
Sounds strange, but I wouldn't be surprised.
We also have an inspection system, I know I've had to take a car in to have it inspected by the State Patrol before getting a license.

smaceng
08-11-2011, 03:46 PM
Make sure you get a bill of sale from the seller, just to make sure to protect yourself if someone says you stole it.

Try this https://www.dol.wa.gov/vehicleregistration/transferprivate.html
Scott in CA

Silverghost
08-11-2011, 04:42 PM
Can you get the documents used to import it? Those along with the bill of sale provide a chain of ownership. You should be good to go.

AngliaGT
08-11-2011, 06:51 PM
Rick,

What kind of car is it?

- Doug

RickB
08-11-2011, 07:45 PM
Morris Minor Woody Wagon (Traveller)

My kid saw it while driving up the coast Highway and took a picture.
Not of anything useful like the for sale sign, of course.
So she thought she remembered where it was so I looked up that town on Google.
Then I used street view till I found the building in the background of her picture.
Got the business name, then phone number then called.
Talked right to the current owner.
He got the car when he bought the business. Package deal.

RickB
08-11-2011, 07:46 PM
Wonder what they will do to me for taxes?

RichBall
08-12-2011, 12:54 AM
Rick

It isn't just a state DOL thing when deeling with imported cars, there are major federal regulations for importing a car not sold in the US. I would start here to see what your up against.

https://www.nhtsa.gov/cars/rules/import/

RickB
08-12-2011, 09:33 AM
oh boy, looks like a lot of fun -

Small wonder he hasn't sold the thing yet.

Bayless
08-12-2011, 11:01 AM
It sounds like the WA application for lost title might depend on existing records for that title which would not exist. As far as importation problems though, the Morris should be old enough to not cause a problem. Besides, they were actually sold in this country when new. I can't speak for WA but in OK, it is still possible to get a new title issued although it does take a little help form some official now.

JPSmit
08-12-2011, 11:37 AM
I know nothing about this process but, two thoughts.

1. I suspect the reason it hasn't been registered yet was due to lack of documentation or some such hassle in the first place - can't imagine it was imported as a lawn ornament.

2. That being said it might be MUCH easier to play dumb and simply try to get it registered as a car without an ownership. Typically this can be done with a sworn affidavit of some sort. You don't know for sure(nudge nudge wink wink) that this wasn't officially imported, all you know is that it currently has no ownership.

RichBall
08-12-2011, 11:43 AM
Not all cars from a manufacturer are equipped and/or legal in all markets. A Home market (England) Spridget would not be able to register in the US without the proper importation paperwork. Rick says the car was imported and was never legally papered thus his problem. Not that he couldn't get it done with some leg work, just that it will have to be done.

Another possible route would be to customize it with a new drive train and have it licensed as a custom car. In Washington if you change a major component of the car you can license it as a custom car and have the Washington State Patrol issue it a VIN. The new 2011 law is here.
https://apps.leg.wa.gov/billinfo/summary.aspx?bill=5585&year=2011#documents

Rick knows all about swapping out drive trains, don't you Rick?

AngliaGT
08-12-2011, 12:18 PM
What is it with Minors all of a sudden?A friend of mine just
bought one (a Traveler),& then I saw another one (Traveler),and then
there's a nice convertible that I saw driving around.It's on craigslist
right now - last seller claimed that it was owned by Woopie Goldberg -
(like that makes it worth a lot of money!).

- Doug

https://humboldt.craigslist.org/cto/2543054855.html

Gerard
08-12-2011, 12:28 PM
I think you may be over-thinking/overcomplicating the issue. I have been able to get titles for cars without titles with a Bill of Sale and an affidavit from the seller when necessary. If it's not "on the books" anymore, they don't know if it's ever been registered or not. Morris Minors were legally imported into the US until 1967 so none of whatever legislation you are reading should matter. Traveller's are very collectable and would be worth pursuing in my opinion unless it's very rusted or the wood is rotted. If your DMV is like CA DMV, their biggest concern is that it has a VIN number that they can verify it's not stolen. One thing I have done in the past when a title is missing, is to get a BMIHT certificate. It will state manufacture date and chassis and engine numbers. That will verify the year and VIN for them and sometimes will also tell you the car's export location.

For those that don't know, I have considerable expertise in Morris Minors (as much as in Spridgets). I own two Morris Minors currently and have worked on numerous Travellers. I have a lot of regulars with them here in town and can give you some guidance for VIN locations and things to check, should you decide to dig deeper.

RickB
08-12-2011, 12:39 PM
I have seen a couple convertibles that I thought were really sweet.

Here's the RCW about what constitutes a "major component":

https://apps.leg.wa.gov/rcw/default.aspx?cite=46.80.010

""Major component part" includes at least each of the following vehicle parts: (a) Engines and short blocks; (b) frame; (c) transmission and/or transfer case; (d) cab; (e) door; (f) front or rear differential; (g) front or rear clip; (h) quarter panel; (i) truck bed or box; (j) seat; (k) hood; (l) bumper; (m) fender; and (n) airbag. The director may supplement this list by rule."

RickB
08-12-2011, 12:47 PM
Thanks Gerard, I think that would definitely be my first route.
Keep it simple - that's the best course.

nomad
08-12-2011, 01:10 PM
Rick, I'm not avocating doing something like this but I know of at least one Shelby mustang running aroumd that is titled with the title and has had the serial numbers changed to one that was actually rolled up in a ball in a collision. Think the buyer had to pay a pretty hefty price for the serial plates and title though. If all else failed I'm betting that Minor will end up the same way some day.

Kurt.

HealeyRick
08-12-2011, 03:31 PM
Rick, I'm not avocating doing something like this but I know of at least one Shelby mustang running aroumd that is titled with the title and has had the serial numbers changed to one that was actually rolled up in a ball in a collision. Think the buyer had to pay a pretty hefty price for the serial plates and title though. If all else failed I'm betting that Minor will end up the same way some day.

Kurt.

No offense, but that's just a terrible idea. It's fraud and can lead to the car being seized not to mention a trip to the gray bar hotel. I think Gerard is right, it shouldn't be too much of a problem with a bill of sale to get it titled. Worse case scenario is you can apply for a bonded title in Washington: https://apps.leg.wa.gov/RCW/default.aspx?cite=46.12.151

KSIS
08-12-2011, 08:44 PM
Rick,
Give the DMV in Oak Harbor a call. They are very helpful and understanding. No lines as only three people work there. I'm tending to agree with Gerard.

Gerard
08-12-2011, 09:16 PM
Rick,
Give the DMV in Oak Harbor a call. They are very helpful and understanding. No lines as only three people work there. I'm tending to agree with Gerard.

Avoid TMI, you'll only paint yourself into a corner... keep it simple... "what documentation do I need to get a duplicate/replacement title?"

Gerard
08-12-2011, 09:20 PM
Thanks Gerard, I think that would definitely be my first route.
Keep it simple - that's the best course.

Rick, if you can get me the chassis number, I can probably tell you the year. A Traveller should start with the letters "FLA" The chassis plate is on the RH firewall near the fuse block and voltage regulator.

nomad
08-13-2011, 12:36 AM
HealeyRick, I did'nt say it was right just that those things happen. I do not advocate that but it does happen and usually because someone is trying to avoid a lot of red tape and not for the fraud that the Mustang represents. In that case it is a clear case of deceipt and has probably been passed off as a truly valuable car more than once since it was done and I became aware of it in the 60's. In this case it would be a case of replacing all of a rusted out car with "parts" from the found Minor. Where does one cross the fine line that makes it unethical. It would'nt be the kind of deceipt as the Mustang in my opinion unless the car has a shady history. If you had a bill of sale that would seem to pass that liability to the seller. However I don't pretend to be a lawyer.
Having said all that I agree with Gerard. The best idea is to seek out the authoritys and try to title it as they suggest.

Kurt.

HealeyRick
08-13-2011, 06:06 AM
HealeyRick, I did'nt say it was right just that those things happen. I do not advocate that but it does happen and usually because someone is trying to avoid a lot of red tape and not for the fraud that the Mustang represents. In that case it is a clear case of deceipt and has probably been passed off as a truly valuable car more than once since it was done and I became aware of it in the 60's. In this case it would be a case of replacing all of a rusted out car with "parts" from the found Minor. Where does one cross the fine line that makes it unethical. It would'nt be the kind of deceipt as the Mustang in my opinion unless the car has a shady history. If you had a bill of sale that would seem to pass that liability to the seller. However I don't pretend to be a lawyer.
Having said all that I agree with Gerard. The best idea is to seek out the authoritys and try to title it as they suggest.

Kurt.

I hope I didn't suggest you were advocating it, you clearly stated you weren't. I was trying to point out that folks get tempted to take shortcuts with paperwork that can have some bad consequences. In my view the first step in any resto should be getting the title squared away before spending money on a car you can't register.

bthompson
08-13-2011, 08:57 PM
Sorta like the story of the man selling Abe Lincoln's axe. "The head's been replaced three times and the handle twice, but <span style="font-style: italic">it's the same axe!</span>"

All of the damaged, crumpled Mustang parts were simply replaced. Including but not limited to the serial plate. :jester: How can that be illegal...?

Healeysince59
08-13-2011, 09:37 PM
I think the real issue here is not the state registration but how the car was imported (or not). If there is a federal data base that might at some time in the future show that this VIN was never officially imported and the appropriate duties never paid, the US "owner" could be in a world of hurt. IMHO, this is a candidate for a parts car and nothing else. Even that has unethical (maybe illegal) connotations. Let your conscience be your guide.

Marv J

JPSmit
08-13-2011, 09:40 PM
Sorta like the story of the man selling Abe Lincoln's axe. "The head's been replaced three times and the handle twice, but <span style="font-style: italic">it's the same axe!</span>"

All of the damaged, crumpled Mustang parts were simply replaced. Including but not limited to the serial plate. :jester: How can that be illegal...?

Interesting timing
Is this a real Maserati? (https://www.sportscardigest.com/maserati-birdcage-at-mecum-monterey-controversy/)

(sorry to hijack)

jlaird
08-13-2011, 10:27 PM
Not only that but all cars now days have 17 digets in their number. Guess how many are not in old cars. They can not even be put in the number data base.

Fact.

smaceng
08-13-2011, 10:52 PM
I have not seen what year this is, but gerald said that the cars were imported up until 1967. The 17 character VIN started in 1969-1970. The FMVSS, or Federal motor vehicle safety standards was enacted into law in 1970. Thus for a 1967 or earlier car, there is no way to track the car on a federal basis. I think, as others have said, that the fact the car had never been registered in the USA should not be a factor. To be super careful, have the present owner go to the DMV and say that the title and registration was lost, and he wants to register it. If that is too much trouble, then you can do the same, with a bill of sale from the current owner. If you want to buy the car, give the owner a deposit, with it being conditional that you can register it.

I registered my BE 1 1/2 years ago with only a bill of sale from the PO, no chassis tag from PO (had one made up), and an inspection by a police officer of my "car" which was a tub, 4 wheels, without an driveline or interior, but it did have a speedometer with a visible odometer!
cheers, Scott in CA

TOC
08-13-2011, 11:40 PM
When WA passed "cradle to grave" abouit 15-20 years ago, it toomk away the ability to get around problem titles. You need to write three certified letters to the last registered owner....but if it was never registered, then what?
If it was imported, WA will probably find out for you from the Feds, whether you want them to or not.

Just try and see. Get the VIN and go ask, don't purchase the car first.
I know my Jag was imported in 82, but I do not have that paperwork, but I do have the ship's bill of lading, so I know the exact date. Been licensed Sate of WA every year since, but you should have seen the consternation on their faces with a six-digit VIN with nno letters at all.
Fortunately, I had the Factory Manual in the car showing VIN series.

If the VIN does not show up stolen or liened, you can proceed wth some modicum of safety.

If it was imported, somewhere it was licensed, I would bet. Folks don't usually do one without the other. Chances are the plates are missing is all. You might find one under a seat.

RickB
08-14-2011, 01:18 AM
Still has British plates on it.

jlaird
08-14-2011, 03:21 PM
Well then, was imported obviously cause it is here. Was never registered.

You have it, ie you are the owner.

Not reported stolen as not in that data base.

New title please. I bet there is a way. I just bet.