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ekamm
09-28-2009, 08:20 PM
Well I was taking the tr3 out for a spin, wanted to see if wheel balancing had fixed my shimmy problem and no luck. Ran the car for a while all is good. I stopped the car to pick up my daughter. Then turn it over and it cranks but won't start. First engine problem that I have had since I got her going in Aug.
No spark, everything else seems well. The only thing I have changed recently is turning the timing advance a little to try to see if I can get a little better acceleration. Where would you start?

poolboy
09-28-2009, 08:33 PM
How did you check for spark ?

DougF
09-28-2009, 08:59 PM
The first thing I would check is electrical connections. Both the coil wire and the jumper wire from the coil to the back of the distributor. Also check the jumper for any breaks or cracks.
Next, I would check the rotor to make sure it is secure and in good condition. Newer rotors have had problems with the rivet connection.
If you have a Pertronix set up, the jumper wire will have been removed.

ekamm
09-28-2009, 09:44 PM
I used a electronic, pen type spark indicator. (It tried to fire once and thr pen lit up but that was it.) Wiggled every thing nothing obviously wrong. I have power 12 v to the coil. Looked at the points , all looks normal. new rotor also looks good.

tdskip
09-28-2009, 10:29 PM
So no spark at any spark plugs, or spark but not running. Do you have fuel flow to the carbs?

ekamm
09-29-2009, 07:02 AM
At this point no spark at plugs, smells flooded after cranking and won't fire with starting fluid. Going to work on it later this morning will attempt to set timing. I have another coil but kinda doubt that to be the problem.

poolboy
09-29-2009, 07:11 AM
Similar situation here,Eric. Rather than typing it all again you might find help troubleshooting here.
https://www.6-pack.org/sixpack/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?t=11813&highlight=

angelfj1
09-29-2009, 07:38 AM
Well I was taking the tr3 out for a spin, wanted to see if wheel balancing had fixed my shimmy problem and no luck. Ran the car for a while all is good. I stopped the car to pick up my daughter. Then turn it over and it cranks but won't start. First engine problem that I have had since I got her going in Aug.
No spark, everything else seems well. The only thing I have changed recently is turning the timing advance a little to try to see if I can get a little better acceleration. Where would you start?

Eric: If this is the original ignition set up, underneath the distributor cap are a set of points, a condenser (capacitor) and a rotor. Do you have a simple electrical multimeter or a test light? If you do you can test for voltage at the points when you switch on the ignition. In fact you can simulate the operation of the points by opening and closing them manually. If you have voltage and you open and close the points you should produce high voltage and hopefully a spark. If not you may have a bad condenser. Change out the condenser and try it. if you still get no spark, you may have a bad coil. There are really no other reasons for no spark.

If you have an electronic ignition, follow the manufacturer's directions for troubleshooting.

Here are some guidelines from Lucas.



Good luck.

angelfj1
09-29-2009, 07:39 AM
One more page. . . .

tdskip
09-29-2009, 07:41 AM
That is good info from Poolboy (as usual).

Eric - if she isn't getting spark at the plugs cranking her over isn't going do anything except drain the battery. Let's focus on why no spark and then go from there.

Is there power from the coil to the distributor?

ekamm
09-29-2009, 08:40 AM
Thanks for the info. The car isn't here I will go through every thing and let you know.

Brosky
09-29-2009, 08:41 AM
Nice job on the Lucas manual Frank.

ekamm
09-29-2009, 09:32 AM
I was having a problem reading the text on the manual that was posted. I think I found a pdf copy of a very similar issue. Let me know if anything is different that I need to know of.

https://herald-tips-tricks.wdfiles.com/local--files/start:start0/Lucas%20Fault%20Diagnosis%20Service%20Manual.pdf

angelfj1
09-29-2009, 11:03 AM
Paul, et al: If you would like a complete copy of the manual, send me an email and I'll send the pdf version.

ekamm
09-29-2009, 12:16 PM
Well so far I've worked my way to the condenser and I'm waiting for it to be dropped of at he parts place.

Don Elliott
09-29-2009, 12:26 PM
Eric - PUT BACK IN THE OLD ROTOR !!!

Adrio
09-29-2009, 12:40 PM
one thing that has happened to me is (with a poor quality points) the "plastic" follower on the dizzy cam wore down. The result is the point gap decreases to the point where they don't open any more. No point opening equals no spark. Check to make sur the poionts are opening and closing as the engine is cranked. Easy to do with the dizzy cap removed.

angelfj1
09-29-2009, 01:12 PM
one thing that has happened to me is (with a poor quality points) the "plastic" follower on the dizzy cam wore down. The result is the point gap decreases to the point where they don't open any more. No point opening equals no spark. Check to make sur the poionts are opening and closing as the engine is cranked. Easy to do with the dizzy cap removed.



Adrio: That's interesting. But how many miles before the cam follower is shot? A small smear of lithium grease on the cam lobe was always recommended.

ekamm
09-29-2009, 04:22 PM
OK here's the scoop .As I suspected from the start it was a timing issue. I guess since I had never dealt with it before I was apprehensive to change it. No spark, not because of an dizzy issue but not timed = no spark. I looked at a few different timing approaches, none of them seemed to do the trick. So with the help of a buddy did the old you crank it and I'll turn it (the dizzy) and she fires right up. Turn it back and forth a little till it sounds good and tighten it down. She's running great! Thanks for all the help, any knowledge is worth having.

tdskip
09-29-2009, 04:28 PM
Good to hear Eric

TR3driver
10-01-2009, 12:05 PM
But how many miles before the cam follower is shot? A small smear of lithium grease on the cam lobe was always recommended. If the cam is totally dry, the rubbing block can wear enough to spoil the gap/timing in less than 100 miles.

BTDT, a loong time ago. The engine ran (more or less) at speed, but refused to idle and was very hard to start.

angelfj1
10-01-2009, 12:07 PM
[quote=angelfj] If the cam is totally dry, the rubbing block can wear enough to spoil the gap/timing in less than 100 miles.

That's what I guessed.

ekamm
10-01-2009, 01:13 PM
Mine is greased and was when I changed points before firing her the first time. The gap seems to be holding nicely.

TOC
10-01-2009, 06:27 PM
OK here's the scoop .As I suspected from the start it was a timing issue. I guess since I had never dealt with it before I was apprehensive to change it. No spark, not because of an dizzy issue but not timed = no spark. I looked at a few different timing approaches, none of them seemed to do the trick. So with the help of a buddy did the old you crank it and I'll turn it (the dizzy) and she fires right up. Turn it back and forth a little till it sounds good and tighten it down. She's running great! Thanks for all the help, any knowledge is worth having.

No.
Cannot be.
If you REALLY had "no spark", as in, tested at the plugs and nothing, you could turn the distributor 180 degrees and the level of spark would not change one bit.

If, however, you THOUGHT you had no spark, but didn't actually test it, maybe.

Generally, advance or retarded spark won't cause a sudden "no start" UNLESS you are so far off you have fouled the plugs.

If you really had no spark, but moving the distributor gave you spark, three basic things:

Distributor grounding (confirmable with a ground wire from dist. housing to block), a break in the primary feed from the coil (twisting the distributor gives a go, and then no-go condition), or a massive break in the HV secondary wire from coil to cap.

Brosky
10-01-2009, 06:58 PM
Three points well worth checking out to make sure that you don't have a no start when you least need it to happen.

ekamm
10-02-2009, 08:01 AM
I guess that the grounding could be true. The other two seem fine. I was unable to get the static timing right, as I couldn't get the light to go out when I turned the dizzy. This would seem to say that the ground was OK but the points weren't opening, however I watched them move as I turned the fan and checked the gap. That's when I gave up and turned the dizzy while cranking and it started right up.

Chris_W
10-06-2009, 02:22 PM
I'm having a similar problem with my GT6. There was no spark, so I spent a couple weekends replacing the entire ignition system, excepting the distributor itself. Now there is spark (or at least power going to the HT leads for the spark plugs, I couldn't get the plugs themselves to spark, but I think that's a grounding issue, since I replaced them only a couple months ago and they don't look fouled), but no go.

Last weekend I finally decided to take a look at the timing and found that the vacuum advance mechanism had somehow become stuck in its full on position, and that on top of that the timing seems generally mucked up. The car is dead a good hour's bus ride from my house, so I'm going to head up there come Friday hoping that tearing down, lubricating and refitting the distributor will fix it.

I'm unfamiliar with the distributors on the TR3s, and I imagine yours has been rather better maintained than mine (its a new acquisition, and the previous owners seem to have been completely unfamiliar with the concept of lubricants),but as far as I know you should have a vacuum advance, so that might be something to check. I imagine that a faulty advance system in conjunction with advanced timing would cause something like the problems you've got, and if the vacuum advance switches back to its regular position, the timing will be thrown off again.