PDA

View Full Version : Spitfire Spitfire help



Rut
02-07-2008, 03:42 AM
Just a little introduction...I had the TR3, 4A and 6 and loved them all (in the 60s and 70s) and would like to take a look at a Spitfire. Any suggestions on years, what to look for, avoid, etc. would be great! I want something I can drive and restore, but mainly drive. I'm looking at MGBs, Bugeyes, Spridgets, etc. so I'm open to anything. I live in Alabama and yes, I do have a trailor! Thanks for you advice and your opinions! Rut

02-07-2008, 05:28 AM
I live in Alabama and yes, I do have a trailor!


I guess if you were to say that you lived in Louisiana and had a trailer, it would be a FEMA trailer!

That aside, cannot recommend which Spit to look for as I own a TR6 but am sure that the forum Spit-nuts will chime in soon.

Rut
02-07-2008, 08:27 AM
Looks like I need to clarify again...a car hauler. I wish FEMA would supply those! Thanks, Rut

DrEntropy
02-07-2008, 08:29 AM
/bcforum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/devilgrin.gif

If you want a *MGB* good reliable British *MGB* sportscar, something stout *MGB* enuff to trust out on *MGB* the highway and easily *MGB* fixed on the rare *MGB* occasion that it stops *MGB* running, ferget the Spit and *MGB* hunt up a well *MGB* maintained MGB.

/bcforum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/devilgrin.gif

DrEntropy
02-07-2008, 08:30 AM
Not so subtle, huh guys?

I'll suit up in th' Nomex now. /bcforum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/jester.gif

vagt6
02-07-2008, 08:31 AM
Hello Rut and welcome to the fray! Please don't listen to those MG guys, they are woefully biased and their Triumph advice tends to be somewhat, umm, flawed (with the <u>possible</u> exception of Doc, above /bcforum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/crazyeyes.gif).

The answer to your question essentially depends on two key points: 1) your budget; 2) your mechanical skill/ability.

Number 1, BUDGET: Unless you're a professional auto body technician, purchase a car that has little or no rust. Rust is our enemy because it's relatively difficult and expensive to restore.

And, purchase a car with decent paint job. A car with good paint is a real money-saver.

Number 2, mechanical skill: These cars are surprising easy to maintain and restore, with lots of aftermarket support. However, if you don't posess the skill to work work on the car you'll probably have to pay someone else to do it. This can get expensive and cause you to be "upside down", financially, with the car (i.e., your cost to restore exceeds the retail value of the car). Not an optimal position.

Finally, the essence of my rhetorical outburst: be extremely patient in your search, then purchase the best possible example of the car that your budget will allow.

In some cases, it may be prudent to stretch your budget if necessary, for a really good example. The general idea is to purchase a car in which some other poor soul has "invested" way too much and is forced to sell at a loss (sad, but true /bcforum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/cryin.gif). Such cars are out there and waiting for the patient, informed buyer.

Restoring these cars is a wonderful experience, but I think driving them is better! If you can buy a driveable example, you'll be able to restore AND drive, the best of both worlds.

Please let us know how it goes, and good luck!!! /bcforum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/thumbsup.gif

71MKIV
02-07-2008, 09:06 AM
I have owned my Spitfire for 25 years. It's in my shop for it's second paint job and proper weld repair of the rusty stuff.

There are very few cars that are as mechanically simple and easy to work on. Even the oil can be changed without getting under the car.

These cars are somewhat fussy but they'll run all day if you pay attention to them a little bit. Make sure all the electrical connections are clean, I grease mine. If it doesn't have the aftermarket electronic ignition watch for wear in the distributor. Watch for rust in the front lower sills. There's precious little strength holding the doors and windshield up and any rust in the area of the front frame/body mounts and inside and outside lower sills cause the doors and windshield to sag. Rust anywhere else is not as critical. Watch that the floor pans aren't rusting from the inside out. Upholstery, especially the seats, will consume inordinate amounts of your restoration budget. The floor pans are so narrow and oddly shaped that there is an extremely limited selection of anything else that will fit. Watch for degraded seat foams, can you feel the seat frame in your back?

It's amazing just how much of the parts for this car are available. and once people know you have one, more parts will mysteriously appear in your driveway, sometimes whole cars.

Having said all that, there are situations, sunny cool spring or fall afternoon, the right road, the right passenger,........

Steve

1971 Spitfire MKIV "Jehu"

Where are all the flashbacks they promised me?

Mickey Richaud
02-07-2008, 09:12 AM
/bcforum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/devilgrin.gif

If you want a *MGB* good reliable British *MGB* sportscar, something stout *MGB* enuff to trust out on *MGB* the highway and easily *MGB* fixed on the rare *MGB* occasion that it stops *MGB* running, ferget the Spit and *MGB* hunt up a well *MGB* maintained MGB.

/bcforum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/devilgrin.gif

Don't hold back, Bro - tell us how you REALLY feel! /bcforum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/wink.gif

Rut
02-07-2008, 09:16 AM
Thanks everyone...any years that are problematic above the usual stuff? The more I investigate LBCs, the more I find certain ones are more prone to rust. My skills are in the 101 catagory with bodywork being below that and I want something that I can drive while I do the restoration work. I've always heard about handling 'issues' of early spits...any truth to that? Thanks, Rut

Basil
02-07-2008, 09:17 AM
/bcforum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/devilgrin.gif

If you want a *MGB* good reliable British *MGB* sportscar, something stout *MGB* enuff to trust out on *MGB* the highway and easily *MGB* fixed on the rare *MGB* occasion that it stops *MGB* running, ferget the Spit and *MGB* hunt up a well *MGB* maintained MGB.

/bcforum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/devilgrin.gif

Go to your room.

Basil
02-07-2008, 09:22 AM
Thanks everyone...any years that are problematic above the usual stuff? The more I investigate LBCs, the more I find certain ones are more prone to rust. My skills are in the 101 catagory with bodywork being below that and I want something that I can drive while I do the restoration work. I've always heard about handling 'issues' of early spits...any truth to that? Thanks, Rut

I have a 78 and I love it. I'm currently going through the motor due to a persistent oil leak (I think the main bearings may be shot). Mine has the optional overdrive which make highway driving much nicer, so getting one with a functional O/D would be a consideration if you do much highway driving. There are lots of things I like about the later models, but the large rubber bumper over-riders is one thing I donít care for.

Andrew Mace
02-07-2008, 09:40 AM
Thanks everyone...any years that are problematic above the usual stuff? The more I investigate LBCs, the more I find certain ones are more prone to rust.
Bodily, all Spitfires are basically the same, and all years seemed to rust about the same way. As noted, the sills (rockers) are critical as they are very much structural. (The car does have a separate 'backbone' chassis, but the body is considered by some a 'semi-monocoque' design.) The "Federal" cars from 1974 on have rear chassis extensions that themselves are prone to rusting and also causing rust in the main chassis rails forward of the extensions.

Beyond that, no one year or model is necessarily "best"; rather, it's what you prefer. Many true devotees feel that the early Mk3 is the best, as it was arguably the quickest and most powerful. Later cars had -- to some -- smoother and better looks and better interior appointments...and handling. The earliest cars have a wonderfully appealing basic charm in their simplicity and starkness. So the choice is up to you (depending on what's available, of course).

I've always heard about handling 'issues' of early spits...any truth to that?Yes...and no. Under certain conditions, the swing axles can cause a very sudden oversteer condition. It's something that 98% of Spitfire drivers will never encounter, and the other 2% might see it on rare occasions. (Boy, talk about putting on the Nomex: I'm sure I'll hear back on this one!) But it's easily addressable in any number of ways. The "problem" was largely solved on the 1971 and later cars by the factory.

As suggested above, buy the best car you can afford, whether or not you're mechanically inclined. And whether you are or not, buy a workshop manual or two so you can be familiar with the car, even if you don't know a rack and pinion from a rack of lamb. /bcforum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/wink.gif

eejay56
02-07-2008, 09:53 AM
I've had my 78 for a little over a year and put 14000 miles on it. I love it. The big bumpers are ugly but pre 79 they can be improved. The 1500 is a nice, torquey, street engine but not well suited for racing. It was the longest produced model Triumph made and there are lots of them out there so a good one can be had pretty cheap. I've heard that the earlier ones are a little squirrelly but as Andy said it's addressable. The 78 corners like it's on rails. They aren't real high value (monetarily) but that could change. Parts are readily available, and you can get a lot of expert advice here.

Dennis
02-07-2008, 10:14 AM
Have to agree with what everyone else say's, except for Doc that is but he does have his moments. /bcforum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/grin.gif Mine is a 74, I've had it for close to 20 years now. I love the way it handles but it is a bit tight as I"m about 6'3", the GT6 is even tighter but worth it. Very easy to work on and maintain. Some day I'll find a TR-6 with my name on it.
Dennis

IanF
02-07-2008, 11:14 AM
/bcforum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/devilgrin.gif

If you want a *MGB* good reliable British *MGB* sportscar, something stout *MGB* enuff to trust out on *MGB* the highway and easily *MGB* fixed on the rare *MGB* occasion that it stops *MGB* running, ferget the Spit and *MGB* hunt up a well *MGB* maintained MGB.

/bcforum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/devilgrin.gif

Agreed. /bcforum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/devilgrin.gif

I drove a friend's MGB after we got the Spitfire... I wish I would have driven one before... otherwise I would have fought tooth & nail for an MGB... Functionally, it's simply a much better car, IMHO. Although I grant the Spitfire looks better.

eejay56
02-07-2008, 11:29 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:] Although I grant the Spitfire looks better.[/QUOTE] Looks better, runs better, handles better, easier to work on, smells better, prevents tooth decay, leaves prettier oil stains on your driveway.

71MKIV
02-07-2008, 11:56 AM
I have driven a friends MGB. Granted a heavier car, but I hate the driving position, with the steering wheel in my chest.

the proper car to compare the Spitfire to would be the Spridget, not the B. The b would be closer to the TR6.

Steve
71 MKIV

Rotation, plus excitation, combine to produce electricity.

IanF
02-07-2008, 12:00 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:] Although I grant the Spitfire looks better. Looks better, runs better, handles better, easier to work on, smells better, prevents tooth decay, leaves prettier oil stains on your driveway. [/QUOTE]

Oh I don't know about that... Maybe after we rebuild the engine and dump most of the PRI catalog into the car my opinion will change, but right now I drive that car when I have to, not because I want to.

I now know regret and thy name is "Spitfire."

Steve
02-07-2008, 12:08 PM
Not so subtle, huh guys?

I'll suit up in th' Nomex now. /bcforum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/jester.gif

Starting with those subliminal messages, Doc?

I'm not going to comment, no sir!

Jerseygirl
02-07-2008, 12:18 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:]Oh I don't know about that... Maybe after we rebuild the engine and dump most of the PRI catalog into the car my opinion will change, but right now I drive that car when I have to, not because I want to.

I now know regret and thy name is "Spitfire."
[/QUOTE]

Ignore him. He's just whiney and bitter because he suggested we change out the Spitfire's wiring harness last year and he's still not done with it.

I LOVE my Spit. I love the look. I love the sound. I LOVE the handling. I love the smell. The Spit is just far more appealing (to me at least) than an MGB. When I decided to get an older convertible, I was hooked as soon as Ian suggested "Spitfire". Had he said "MGB", I would have said, "nah", and probably would have ended up with an older E30 convertible (and he'd be complaining about that as well, but on a different forum).

To get this back on topic... Rut, when I started looking for my car, I decided to look for a later model, figuring that the performance/reliability "might" be a bit better than an older car. I can't speak for the older cars, as I've never driven one, but the first time I drove my Spit back to back with my new MINI, I got out of the Spit, hopped in the MINI, and thought, "Geez, this thing feels like a truck." I love my MINI and it's my daily driver, but after driving the Spit, the MINI's wonderful steering actually felt a bit vague in comparison.

Did I mention that I love my Spit? /bcforum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/wink.gif

Good luck with your search.

IanF
02-07-2008, 12:28 PM
Ignore him. He's just whiney and bitter because he suggested we change out the Spitfire's wiring harness last year and he's still not done with it.

I'm whiney and bitter because I suggested a Spitfire to you in the first place... so I have no one to blame but mysef... /bcforum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/wall.gif

Gee guys... did you miss us? /bcforum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/jester.gif

Andrew Mace
02-07-2008, 12:37 PM
Funny thing is: the Spitfire was never meant in any way to compete with the MGB. Apples and oranges...period. Now if you want to talk "Spridgets"...at least that's an apples (Macintosh) v. apples (Granny Smith?) comparison.

Probably the best and most honest advice overall (even tho "Rut" specifically asked about Spitfires) is to try them all.

I've never owned any of the BMC products, but I've driven them...and I liked them all, for different reasons (and those reasons yet different from my preferences for various Triumphs)!

In the spirit of fairness.... /bcforum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/grouphug.gif

TR4nut
02-07-2008, 01:12 PM
Welcome to the forum Rut-

As you are a former TR3-4-6 owner, the one thing I'd add for you is to try and drive around in a Spit first before you get serious. I started with Spits (74/78) and loved them - still love the styling. But when I bought a TR6 after my Spitfires I realized the driving style is a lot different. In the Spit, you are low to the ground and you feel low. Fine for a lot of people, and maybe you too but don't be surprised in the difference.

Randy

myspitfire
02-07-2008, 08:02 PM
Now!Now!MG's are(not)withstanding fun to,after all they are a British car.BUT to get right to your question,get a Spitfire.Spitfires are splended start.First they are very easy to work on,& get parts for;Second make sure you TAKE YOUR TIME & make an EDUCATED choice.In my opinion the 1200cc engine is the most reliable & trustworty & will torque&rev all day with satisfaction.The 1500(74 on)are the high end engine but are not as strong.Understand tho that either one is a good choice if maintained properly.If you choose a Spitfire thats lived its life in the south west or Calif,you'll most likely see one with very minimal rust.Once you have chosen one its best to examine it IN PERSON & talk to the seller.Once you buy it your self confidence with your choice will carry you along.From then on its a MONEY PIT,so be very careful with buying stuff,only buy NOS(NewOldStock)parts or OEM(OriginalEquiptmentManufactired)parts to be absolutly safe.
You won't regret your buying a Spitfire for your hobby,their is no other sportscar that offers more driving enjoyment than a Triumph(Spitfire)Not even those high end ones(Miata,etc etc)The character of the car will grab your imagination,And be tantamount to getting remarried.
GOOD LUCK & make sure you tell us about your progress.
Ken(1500 Spit)

Bob Claffie
02-07-2008, 08:23 PM
Over the years I have raced two and had one street Spitfire. Really great to work on. Simple and relatively inexpensive. My personal preference is the '72, it has the late model syling with the terrific 1300 engine. Only thing, I would look for a car without the Stromerg carbs, but that is between them and me. Best of luck,Bob

skucera
02-08-2008, 01:06 AM
Rut, I've owned both a Midget and two Spitfires. If you're out for a good sports car that is particularly British, just about any MG or Triumph will do. My best advice is to test drive them, and see how they fit.

The Spridget cockpit is snug, but if you're average height or smaller you'll fit fine. Some folks don't like the steering wheel quite as close to their chests as MG's have it, but I found the Midget's ergonomics very comfy. I'm 5' 7" and with the seat all the way back I fit perfectly. The short doors make for some real leg folding to get in or out, so be sure to try the car on with the top up to be sure you can fit in and out.

The Spitfire cockpit has narrow seats, but more knee room. The steering wheel is further from the driver because it was designed by an Italian. Since you won't be racing, the best car is probably a 1500, which has more torque and more power. Get an overdrive if you can find one. I liked the overdrive so much that I put one in my Midget 1500 (and it wasn't easy, but it was sure worth it). My first Spitfire was a Mk. 1, which was a delightful car to drive. It would occasionally snap into oversteer in tight bends, and my Spitfire 1500's "swing spring" rear suspension totally solves that problem.

Here's were I should brace for flames: if you're looking for a fun and cheerful sports car and don't care if it is British, get a used Miata or MR2. Both are very reliable and very fun to drive. First gen Miatas and first gen MR2's both handle "British"... the Miata because the Mazda engineers really wanted the holistic British sports car experience, and the MR2 because it was designed by Lotus to be an entry-level Lotus with Toyota mechanicals, but in the end they decided they couldn't handle that sort of volume so Toyota took over the project and sold it as a Toyota. If you've got more money to spend on your sports car fun, look into the BMW Z3. I drove one for a day a few years back, and it was everything a big Healey is plus reliability and all the modern comforts.

I'll also go out on a limb and recommend the TR7, at least after you replace the suspension bushings with new ones. Also, if you want cheap American parts available in any auto parts store from sea to shining sea, look into the Pontiac Fiero. The later ones handle very well indeed. Of course, it's harder to get the wind in your hair with these two cars.

Myself, when I went to look for a thrifty, fun commuter to prepare for this summer's coming $4/gal. gas prices, I looked for a Spitfire 1500. I've been driving it 60 miles round trip every day for two months very reliably. It's been very reliable despite sitting under a pile of pine needles for five years before I bought it.

Scott

DrEntropy
02-08-2008, 08:47 AM
Gee guys... did you miss us?

ABSOLUTELY!

...as for th' Splutfire... OkayOKAY! They're FUN. Great to toss around and easy to fix. Styling is good, compared to the more "stodgy" MG shape. But they're frail in comparison to BMC's offerings, IMO.

I like the accessability of the driveline components, the ability to change a clutch without pulling the engine, etc.

They're just "tinny" to me. I'd be a 'rumphie if I'd not "grown up" in BMC cars or never been exposed to Lotus' offerings. The Elans use many, MANY of the Triumph pieces an' bits, so I guess I may actually HAVE one foot onna boat, one onna dock... /bcforum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/devilgrin.gif

Dennis
02-08-2008, 08:52 AM
See Doc, just a matter of time and eventually you sorta come around... There just might be some hope for you yet.. /bcforum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/banana.gif But he is right, we did miss the two of you..
Dennis

DrEntropy
02-08-2008, 09:06 AM
Don't go thinkin' I'm gettin' all warm-n-fuzzy on th' 'rumphies, Dennis. That was simply a grudging acquiessence to the Italian styling, I'll have you know. /bcforum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smirk.gif

Mickey Richaud
02-08-2008, 09:35 AM
Don't go thinkin' I'm gettin' all warm-n-fuzzy on th' 'rumphies, Dennis. That was simply a grudging acquiessence to the Italian styling, I'll have you know. /bcforum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smirk.gif

Softy! /bcforum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/jester.gif

IanF
02-08-2008, 01:15 PM
I still think the MGB is a better car... Mainly because I like driving our Volvos much more than the Spitfire and the MGB feels a lot more like the Volvo.

And how they were positioned when new doesn't really apply now. Midget, Spitfire, MGB... all are about the same price-wise now.... with maybe the B being a bit more expensive for a nice one...

I suppose my issue with Baldrick right now is despite the amount of time and money we've put into the car, I still don't trust it not to explode 100 feet after leaving the driveway. And until we can afford to get the engine rebuilt and send the tranny and rear to QM, I doubt that feeling will change.

I suppose my advice to the OP is don't even THINK about buying the first car you look at. And even if you do want that particular car, don't plop down the cash until you go drive at least a 1/2 dozen other cars. That was our mistake with Baldrick. And to this day - over 2 years later - I still don't know what a "good" Spitfire is supposed to feel like so I have no idea if I'm making Baldrick better or worse. The last time I drove the car in December it felt worse than ever.

And don't replace the wiring harness just because it sounds like a good idea...

Rut
02-08-2008, 03:52 PM
Thanks to all...I guess availability might be the deciding factor along with 'fit'. I'm 6'01" and 200+, 58 with most muscles, bones, and ligaments screaming at me in the morning. 2 Motrin and I can put up with most anything! I want something that I can fix and work on, no computer to deal with, good enough for a 41/2 hr trip to the beach as well as FUN. My old TRs were FUN, but I didn't weigh but 125 back then at the same height! I guess the top 3 in no particular order are MGB, Spridget, Spitfire...cheap to buy is another consideration. I've got lots of time to look and research, hopefully find one with little rust, maybe run across a TR 3 or 4 which were my favorites, a Bugeye because I've never had one...I'm sure everyone has gone down this path. Thanks again, Rut

myspitfire
02-08-2008, 03:53 PM
Basil said go to your room!..I agree totally,having driven alot of MG's & big T's..thos are all in the same group and your right stoggy is the word.I even owned Sunbeam Tigers,and found over time the sturdy Spitfire is my choice.It even came from the factory race prepped,take the front suspension geometry & road hugging rear swing axel+ the late models(like mine)with alot of safty protection;side door impact inserts,collapsable steering,breakaway mirrors & crumple zones.But because its a small car & seat of the pants driver the real safety device is the driver.,which with the right brain is a comfortable car to drive.Oh!i forgot to mention the way the bonnet hooks up when latched on the hooks at the firewall was designed to stop intrusion into the cockpit.,that was a good safety feature too.
Ken

DrEntropy
02-08-2008, 04:48 PM
/bcforum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/devilgrin.gif

If you want a *MGB* good reliable British *MGB* sportscar, something stout *MGB* enuff to trust out on *MGB* the highway and easily *MGB* fixed on the rare *MGB* occasion that it stops *MGB* running, ferget the Spit and *MGB* hunt up a well *MGB* maintained MGB.

/bcforum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/devilgrin.gif

Go to your room.

&lt;sulk&gt; ohh-kay. &lt;/sulk&gt;

myspitfire
02-08-2008, 04:59 PM
I'm jealous of your Lotus's,what shape are they in?Drivers,racers.I remember my Tiger had trouble with breakaway,it was a handful.,the Panardrod,Salisbury,& traction masters,Pirelli's really had trouble taming the beast.

DrEntropy
02-08-2008, 05:10 PM
Both down now. Frame damage on 'em. S3 has a transverse crack at the diffy control rods, +2 a right front pillar needs repairing. Currently crawling out from under some unforseen medical (eye issues) expenses, so money for a Spyder "space frame" is a bit out-of-the question.

~I~ don't have a problem with accruing a bit more debt (it'd be about the same as *one* IOL surgery) but my "book-keeper" has put her foot down... next time she does that it could come down on some part of my anatomy I don't want to have surgery on...

I can wait.

vagt6
02-08-2008, 05:22 PM
Hope your eyes recover well, Doc.

I'm in a similar situation with an LBC (lack thereof!). We're preparing to build a major addition to our house, which happily includes a 3 car garage!!!

I'm going to purchase another LBC as soon as the contractors leave the yard! That will be about 6 months from now. I've already put out feelers for another car.

I'm about to bust to get another one, it's been too long.

But, I, too, can wait (I hope). /bcforum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/wall.gif

DrEntropy
02-08-2008, 05:49 PM
They're back to useful again. June '05 was cataract surgery, IOL's a month apart, all out of pocket. a year later (nearly to the DAY) I suffered a retinal detachment in the left orb. Laser welding didn't work, so ocular surgery was necessary... again, out of pocket. With eight weeks of nose-down attitude constantly. A propane bubble in the thing, all debilitating... Just happy I can SEE again. The money will be "replaced", it's just gonna take some time.


feh.

We were also in the middle of a major house renovation at the time. "Life is what happens while you're busy planning for something else." --Carlin, IIRC.

myspitfire
02-08-2008, 07:55 PM
Geez!Doc join the catarac club Feb 23 i had cat surgery on the left eye,on the 21st i had trigger finger surgery(bad double action right thumb/index finger)Alls ok now.I went out in garage & checked out my shifter hand,started Whitelightning went up & down the street.Everythings ok.Very sad about the Lotus's,2 years ago it was the right eye,in that i had two eye doctors one on each side fixing a retinal tear,on the other side one replacing the lens,laying flat on your back for 2 hours ain't fun.
I should be rearin to go this spring.