View Full Version : Beaver-Post Mortem

06-02-2006, 06:38 AM
Heading out today to Wampum, PA to ~BEAVERUN~ (https://www.beaverun.com) .

I may see some of you there.

I'm signed on for a two-hour enduro and two 20 lap sprint races.

I've got spare axles, duct tape and plenty of Positive Karma.
I may bring some bailing wire just for good luck. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/jester.gif

See you all around Tuesday.

06-02-2006, 07:02 AM
"Break a Leg" Nial! Say "HI!" to my old homestead.

06-02-2006, 10:37 AM
Me Too............

Howd ya like me ta send ya a box full of good'ol mill hunky air?
You could sniff & reminisce. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

06-02-2006, 04:25 PM
I'll pass, Dave. I left there ON PURPOSE, remember!?

Tho it's times like this I kinda would like to be back... To live a mile from that track would be irresistable...

Wanna start a B&B for the racers??!? I took all the gear outta the garage, so there'd be some refitting of compressor, tool setup and such but I've ~seriously~ considered that. It's only a two bedroom, too. *sigh*

06-04-2006, 03:49 AM
Met Nial at the track....

He said that he was staying 20 miles away.

From the looks of his car after the enduro....He could use a garage & a /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thirsty.gif

(The good news is......I think he won his class on account of his wheel not coming off until near the end of the 2 hours)

06-04-2006, 06:50 AM
could not get up there Sat, to much going on at home. I am still going to try to get there today. Wish I new were he was, I am 20 miles south of Pittsburgh. I have a Garage and most every tool that he could possably need. It would be to late to give him any asstince by the time I get up there. Should have given him my phone number in case of trouble.


06-05-2006, 10:27 PM
Back from The Beaver.
I survived and the car mostly survived.

We met up with Dave (WhatsThatNoise) on Saturday morning and got to see his very fine Elva up close. It’s a beauty!
Lots of other people noticed it too……one even asked me if “I’d seen the ‘Elvis’” (a Honda driver, of course).
I have to note that Dave came in his Elva with no top, despite the foreboding weather. Just a cockpit cover for parking (Dave: I hope it you didn’t get too wet on the ride home….and thanks for flagging for us!)

I ran the 2-hour Enduro…actually, most of it. Well, really, I caused the Enduro to end prematurely.
About 15 minutes or so, before the end, I was entering Turn Two; a nice right-hander. As usual, the car was at redline in third gear, drifting slightly.
Then the left rear wheel came off.
Then I went around.
And around.
And around.
I think I did about six 360s…felt like it anyway.
BeaveRun has really good areas for run-off, so I didn’t hit anything trackside….it’s much better than Lime Rock or Watkins Glen in this regard.
The closest flagger (“BMW Barry”) told me that the Spridget was partly in the air at one point and he thought it might roll. Thankfully, it didn’t
After #11 was pulled back to the pits, it was too late to re-start the event, so it was declared as over. I was leading in the small-bore class, so I won (no big deal since the only other small-bore car in the event was so pathetic, I won’t even tell you what it was).
So I have another five dollar trophy.

The post-mortem revealed that all the wheel studs had sheared and the wheel had huge cracks in it. Not sure which caused which. Kind of a chicken or egg situation.
There was slight body damage under the door (from sliding on the ground) plus the rear shackle for the leaf spring was bent like a pretzel. Brake backing plate was brutally disfigured. And the brake drum departed for points unknown. It may have ended up in Ohio….probably in a zillion pieces.

Honestly, I think it was the studs. I just changed them on both rear hubs last week so that I could add a ¼” spacer (my new Hoosiers were rubbing just slightly). I got replacement studs that were just slightly longer (intended for a Cooper “S” I think). Whereas my old studs said “England” on them, the new ones were unmarked (maybe made in India or China….who knows?)
Anyway, the old UK studs are going back on and I’ll run the skinny Yoko 175 A032Rs for now. The Hoosiers were much stickier, so that probably increased the loading as well. I’d really like to ditch the Spridget rear and use something like a narrowed disk brake rear from an RX7. Winter project.

I didn’t run the planned double sprints (20 laps each) the second day so we headed back to NJ around noon. It poured on the way home, but the Ford towed nicely and we got home in reasonable time (and almost 20 mpg).
Pocono’s next. The car will be repaired by then.

Carl: Thanks for the offer, but even if I had the parts, I wouldn't have fixed it. Once I get some weird failure like this, I want to go home and study it for a while before fixing anything.

WhatsThatNoise Elva


Gridding for the enduro. I beat the red Cobra (mechanical retirement)


Climbing up after the hairpin towards the S/F line. The car was around 5500 in third at this point.


One of the best things about our Enduros is that they are mixed. Not just big or small cars…I get to run with a little of everything. This FF Daytona Replica ran with me. Cool to see him whizzing past me on the back straight at mungo speeds. He eventually retired due to clutch failure. Which means I beat two Cobras in this event. The pink 944 in the background belongs to his wife (she also has a pink driving suit). She ran pretty well in the 944Cup Series race we had both days. They have a tractor-trailer transporter setup that must have cost half a mill. He has a nice Viper too. And a Mooney. And they're nice folks too.
Rich or poor, it’s good to have money.


Hap Waldrop
06-06-2006, 05:50 AM
I run 7/16 studs all the way around on my racing Spridgets, Winner Circle carries the proper ones, you do have drill the hubs to accept them, also Moroso offers a stud that will work as well and these studs are designed for racing and much longer than stock. Also are you using double bearing rear hubs, if not I highly recommend them, I wouldn't race a Spridget without them. As for a rear disc set up. Winners Circle offers that as well, I've had thier set up on two different cars now and like it very much. The spridget rear end is not a bad design, actually it's nothing more than small Ford 9" floater if you will, there are plenty of aftermarket goodies to make it stand up to rigors of racing, in SCCA with the slicks we run we're pushing over 1g in the corners, so I do alot to insure that the rear end will stand up to this. That one good thing about racing Spridgets vs MGBs and other British cars, there is wide selection of aftermarket racing parts.

06-06-2006, 06:23 AM

More than anything else, I'd like to stop the darn leaking of gear oil past the outer hub seals. I see this on nearly every Spridget that races no matter what hubs they have.

I have home-brew double bearing hubs that I built (I have access to an excellent machine shop with CNC mill and lathe). Once I added the double-bearing setup, I never had an axle problem again....before that I broke one or two a year. I'm just running stock axles, an open rear, and very mild engine (maybe 80 HP tops). But my setup still allows oil to weep onto the brakes. I've seen this with the Winner's Circle hubs too.

I was figuring a swap to a narrowed RX7 rear would cure the oil leak. I don't really need the disk brakes or limited slip diff but they are common in the Mazda axle and would be sort of a "bonus" (plus the 12 mm studs and plenty of wheel choices for that bolt pattern).

No matter what I do, I *have* to start running 7/16" or 12 mm studs pretty soon.

I know that you (Acme Speed) sell the double-bearing hubs. I'm sure they provide good axle support, but are they really a sure-cure for the oil weeping?

Hap Waldrop
06-06-2006, 08:02 AM
I've did this in the past and it helps, and also do this to our current DB hubs. We have four axle to hubs retaining bolts, I use countersunk allen heads fastners. You could make this mod to your hubs axles as well. Other than that, I just do the normal stuff, flush the oil out of the bearing with spray brake clean to make sure it doesn't drip from while assembling, I don't use the paper gasket, just black RTV, I don't think it matters one way or the other with the gasket, most racers I know don't use the gasket. I goop the o-ring with RTV as well, don't know if it helps, it just one of those anal things I do. I let everything cure up with no oil in the hubs or rear end (normally doing this in conjuntion with a gear change). If I get rushed and have to do this at the racetrack and go back out in a hour or so, then it seeems to always leak, but if I allow for the time for the rtv to cure properly, then generallly I stay dry.

06-06-2006, 09:11 AM
Hey Nial - where are the pics of the carnage? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif

06-07-2006, 04:54 PM
Never did make it up to Beaver run. To many things to do. leaving for San Francisco Sat. Anytime you or your friends are at Beaver run and need help I will do anything I can.


06-07-2006, 08:39 PM
Where are you in relation to the track, Carl?

06-08-2006, 03:51 PM
I'm about 30 to 40 miles south. I am about 20 miles south of downtown Pittsburgh. Its about 1 hr traveltime maybe less. Because of Pittsburgh's wonderful highway system, time depends on time of day and so forth.


06-09-2006, 08:26 AM
Understand. I was raised with an "RD2, Wampum, PA" address. I've yet to get back there to see the BeaveRun facility. You could just about toss a rock from my back porch and hit the track with it.

06-09-2006, 09:20 AM
Had a Beaver PA and a Rolling Hills PA address till the 3rd grade.

06-12-2006, 03:15 PM
I was raised with an "RD2, Wampum, PA"

[/ QUOTE ]
I had RD #1 Volant.........

That was like saying "Somewhere east of Volant".

Took in about a dozen Amish households & about 1/2 that number of "colored" people.

(The Amish called us colored people because we wore clothing w/ patterns)

06-12-2006, 03:25 PM
Maternal relatives still reside in Enon. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

06-17-2006, 03:12 AM
Hey Nial - where are the pics of the carnage? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

I fixed the mechanical stuff on the car pretty quickly, and didn't take any pictures of the carnage at the wreck site. I won't fix the body work (under the door) until Winter.
We are now really pretty sure that the studs failed, causing the wheel to crack as it separated from the car.

Here's the wheel just as we found it. Notice the cracks in the spoked area. Every "spoke" was deeply cracked. There was no cracking or damage around the lug-nut holes. Weird.

Here's the Hoosier tire. It had about 4 hours of use on it. Too bad.

Here's a link to the rear shackle that was twisted:

Here's the backing plate. It got all twisted from sliding along the ground with no wheel or brake drum (I never found the drum):

Michael Oritt
06-17-2006, 05:58 AM

06-17-2006, 07:03 AM
That's pretty nasty! Looks like the "ridges" from the Rostyle stamping process became stress risers... ugh.

06-18-2006, 08:08 AM
Not being a racer anymore I sure to enjoy this fourm just for old times sake if nothing else.

Now, where do you guys keep the standings. Gesh, win, loose, or draw?

06-18-2006, 03:00 PM
That's quite the failure on the wheel! You're making me want to go to 7/16" studs on my car. Getting the studs on the axle flange and redrilling the drums doesn't scare me, but I wonder what would be involved in redrilling the minilite (generic lookalike) wheels....would I just redrill the center hole or do I need to get the flared nut surface redrilled/machined as well?

06-18-2006, 04:46 PM
Rob, are you running the Minotaur wheels? If so, thet won't require redrilling at all.

06-20-2006, 03:37 PM
Yea, Miniator. Pretty sure the PO bought them from VB.

Now I need to pull them and check this out, I hope you're right!