PDA

View Full Version : AngliaGT - calling Doug! calling Doug!



NutmegCT
03-03-2018, 07:43 AM
Doug - when you drove from California to Virginia, what size truck did you rent?

And what was the approximate cost?

I *may* be doing a similar trip in a few months.

Thanks.
Tom M.

JPSmit
03-03-2018, 09:37 AM
Doug - when you drove from California to Virginia, what size truck did you rent?

And what was the approximate cost?

I *may* be doing a similar trip in a few months.

Thanks.
Tom M.

Good on you Tom - sounds like an elaborate April Fools Joke is in the making. Don't worry your secret is safe with us :jester:

NutmegCT
03-03-2018, 09:48 AM
Sure hope it's not an April Fool joke. Might be delivering a couple hundred boxes of books to a digitizing center. USPS is cheapest for shipment, but at $32 per 50 pound box, shipping of 500 boxes is slightly (!) beyond the budget.

Basil
03-03-2018, 10:47 AM
Taking the books from CT to CA? Once the books are digitized, will you have to retrieve them from the digitizing center (thus doubling the cost for transportation)?

Gliderman8
03-03-2018, 10:49 AM
Isn’t there a similar service on the east coast?
Boston? New York?

NutmegCT
03-03-2018, 11:02 AM
Thanks gentlemen. The digitizing idea was approved, and it's up to me to find the least expensive way to get it done. I want to make the books (aircraft maintenance manuals, no longer under copyright) available to the public.

So far, least expensive is a library consortium with a scanning center in Arizona. They're actually free - but I have to get the books to them. Shipping via USPS would be around $15K - out of my budget. But renting a 26 foot box truck one-way would be around $2500, per UHaul.

The Arizona service scans and then shelves/files the books locally, then posts them on their public research website; I no longer have space for them, so returning the books (and the truck) isn't the issue. Flying home is cheaper!

There are several other digitizing services closer to me (Boston, NYC, Phila., Washington DC, etc.). But the cheapest one is $3/book plus 12 cents per page. For the amount of books I've got, that would be around $150,000 - plus shipping. No can do.

DavidApp
03-03-2018, 12:41 PM
I hope they check their work during the process. A company I worked with locally had their parts books scanned then dumped the books. When we came to use the books we found that they had scanned them in the wrong format so we had lost about 1/3 of every page.
Kind of inconvenient but the upper management that made the decision did not have to deal with the problem.

David

NutmegCT
03-03-2018, 12:43 PM
David - PM sent.

Keith_M
03-03-2018, 12:59 PM
Tom,
Why don't you take 5 boxes at a time in an old Mercedes? Think of the fun you'd have!

If you're really planning to do this (in a truck, I mean), I hop you plan to stop in Utah.

Keith

Boink
03-03-2018, 01:11 PM
I once shipped a lot of stuff via Amtrak of all people... on pallets. It was the cheapest way to go, but the start and finish destinations need to have a regular Amtrak station (since you must deliver and pick-up at those locations).

NutmegCT
03-03-2018, 02:18 PM
Kieth - I've heard rumors that you and Liz make some tasty waffles ...

Mark - never even thought about Amtrak. They run between Mass. and Arizona, but probably still too expensive for my ca. 15,000 lbs of books. I'll check it out.

anarchy99
03-03-2018, 03:26 PM
You can probably do a freight type service for cheaper than anything else. Having done the crosscountry Uhaul thing several times, Id look into freighting it.

Keith_M
03-03-2018, 03:41 PM
Kieth - I've heard rumors that you and Liz make some tasty waffles ...



and burgers! :eagerness:

DNK
03-03-2018, 05:12 PM
...but probably still too expensive for my ca. 15,000 lbs of books. I'll check it out.

What's the total tonnage you can carry in one of those trucks?
that's 7.5 tons

That's a $h!t lot of weight

NutmegCT
03-03-2018, 06:04 PM
Yikes - totally forgot to check UHaul truck weight limits. You're right - 7400 lbs limit for a 26 foot truck.

OK - on to Plan B (or K, or W, or whatever)

JPSmit
03-03-2018, 06:17 PM
Might be worth looking into donating them to a museum with the understanding that they be digitized.

Gliderman8
03-03-2018, 06:37 PM
What’s the cost to buy the equipment and do the work in-house?

NutmegCT
03-03-2018, 06:48 PM
"Might be worth looking into donating them to a museum with the understanding that they be digitized."

We're a museum! We don't have space for all the items (they're stuffed into a corner under a B-29 wing now), but still want to share them with the public. Any recipient would still have to commit to a very large - and expensive - scanning project. Might as well organize the project ourselves, especially with the free service down in Arizona. Google Books stopped accepting materials back in August 2013. Internet Archive will do the job, but charges between $3 and $5 per item, plus 12 cents per page. That's around $150K for our materials. And many other museums (aviation related) have similar collections, so they're looking for help too.

"What’s the cost to buy the equipment and do the work in-house?"

Large-table flat bed high res scanner - ca. $7500.
Book cradle scanner with grid mapping correction - ca. $18K.
Figuring 15 minutes minimum per item, only 1250 hours for 5000 items.
We're volunteers at four hours per day. Four hours per day for 1250 hours = 312 days.
Still doesn't include professional software, image storage and hosting.

So - seems getting the books to an imaging service is the way to go.

DNK
03-03-2018, 06:58 PM
Yikes - totally forgot to check UHaul truck weight limits. You're right - 7400 lbs limit for a 26 foot truck.

OK - on to Plan B (or K, or W, or whatever)

3 trucks
Caravan Road trip

Boink
03-03-2018, 07:15 PM
Mark - never even thought about Amtrak. They run between Mass. and Arizona, but probably still too expensive for my ca. 15,000 lbs of books. I'll check it out.

I was mostly shipping boxes of books. The rate was unbelievable (though you have to promptly collect it when it arrives). They even put some sort of shrink-wrap around the pallets. The only restriction is that they don't want anything fragile or breakable... but i did include some framed art and to them that they were bicycle wheels (in a box). :o

NutmegCT
03-03-2018, 07:22 PM
Ballpark figure for Amtrak shipping of 15,000 lbs of books is around $7000.00. Limit is 500 lbs per day, so it would take 30 different shipments.

Actually puzzles me that they didnt' ask for pickup and destination points, so $7000.00 seems to cover 100 miles or 3000 miles or anything in between.

hmmmm

Basil
03-03-2018, 10:16 PM
Ballpark figure for Amtrak shipping of 15,000 lbs of books is around $7000.00. Limit is 500 lbs per day, so it would take 30 different shipments.

Actually puzzles me that they didnt' ask for pickup and destination points, so $7000.00 seems to cover 100 miles or 3000 miles or anything in between.

hmmmm

That was the "per mile" price :rapture:

AngliaGT
03-03-2018, 11:47 PM
Tom,

Sounds like a rental truck won't work in this case.
About 2-1/2 years ago,I rented a Penske truck.It was about
$425 from Grants Pass,Oregon to Richmond Virginia.I thought
that was a great deal.
The only bad thing was that I had to drive 3 hours to
pick it up,as they didn't rent in Eureka.
Also try uship.com.

DavidApp
03-04-2018, 01:04 AM
Have you checked out the Pods service?

David

https://www.pods.com

JPSmit
03-04-2018, 09:01 AM
It it something you could

1. Find funding for a student to do - is there an archives program at a college in the area?

2. Access unused equipment at a college in the summer?

3.Partner with a local company? (Staples - making memories last or some such things)

JPSmit
03-04-2018, 09:02 AM
Crowdsource it in the community - everyone take three books.

NutmegCT
03-04-2018, 09:07 AM
Doug - " ... a Penske truck.It was about $425 from Grants Pass,Oregon to Richmond Virginia"

Wow - that sounds great. Can't believe it would be so much less than the $2500 from UHaul for one 26 foot box truck. I'll also check UShip.

Dave - I've requested a quote from PODS. They seem to be a bit difficult to get info from however. Also, thanks for the PM yesterday.

JP - I've been trying all those suggestions. Haven't given up yet! But this is a big project, and having non-professionals do scanning of old reference documents doesn't usually end well.

Tom M.

JPSmit
03-04-2018, 09:29 AM
and having non-professionals do scanning of old reference documents doesn't usually end well.

Tom M.



Note the earlier post about mis-scanned books. I can guarantee the ones doing the scanning are making minimum wage and were not hired for their extensive scanning experience and PhDs. Besides - you might have no choice.

DavidApp
03-04-2018, 09:41 AM
I did notice that PODS only had dimensions on their site. No mention of maximum weight for each size of pod.

David

NutmegCT
03-04-2018, 09:44 AM
Note the earlier post about mis-scanned books. I can guarantee the ones doing the scanning are making minimum wage and were not hired for their extensive scanning experience and PhDs. Besides - you might have no choice.

JP - somehow I doubt you can guarantee they're getting minimum wage.

Anyway, all options are open. Right now I'm more interested in ways to transport the materials. Let's not get into arguing about scanning services. I'll have to make quality decisions on a company by company basis.

Thanks.
Tom M.

NutmegCT
03-04-2018, 09:45 AM
Dave - PODS doesn't show costs for the containers, or the transport, either. I assume you rent by the day/week/month, and pay transport by the weight and mile.

Details, details.

TRMark
03-04-2018, 10:13 AM
If the boxes are all the same size stack them with an interlocking pattern on a 45" X 48" pallet, wrap with stretch wrap and strap to pallet with strapping material. If not the same size then get some "watermelon" boxes or larger Gaylord boxes and load books in the boxes, stretch and strapping would be good. Ship as the scanning company can take them. Use LTL freight company like Yellow, Old Dominion, etc. Logistical problem would involve use of loading doors, forklift or pallet jack, tailgate lift.

DNK
03-04-2018, 10:14 AM
I checked on a pod from Chucktown to Vancouver BC a couple years ago
1K

NutmegCT
03-04-2018, 10:23 AM
Thanks gents.

Mark, all this time I'd been thinking rental truck, so checking shipping companies will be next week's job. The hundreds of boxes are all the same size: "banker box" 12x10x15. The materials are already in the boxes.

Don - Thanks for the $1000 ballpark. Charlestown to Vancouver BC is quite a trip. Do you recall what size POD was that for? And did the $1000 cover the POD as well as the transport?

TM

DNK
03-04-2018, 10:41 AM
Smallest one they had
Didn't have a lot of stuff to move
Ended up not using it as I thought it was over the top

NutmegCT
03-04-2018, 10:45 AM
Thanks Don. Was the $1000 going to cover the POD as well as the transport?

DNK
03-04-2018, 11:18 AM
I think so
It was so long ago and I thought the cost was to much for the little stuff we had I dismissed it w/o much thought.
All this info is with fuzzy memory

Gliderman8
03-04-2018, 11:53 AM
Tom- An interesting article....
https://www.rr.cs.cmu.edu/mbdl.htm

NutmegCT
03-04-2018, 12:08 PM
Thanks Elliot. Here's one of the procedure outlines we're studying:

https://www.library.unt.edu/digital-libraries/trusted-digital-repository

Tom M.

Boink
03-04-2018, 04:45 PM
Looked it up and it seems that Amtrak only ships in 500 lb. increments.
https://www.amtrak.com/onboard/baggage-policy/amtrak-express-shipping.html
I just remember how much cheaper it was than regular shipping.

NutmegCT
03-04-2018, 08:43 PM
Thanks Mark. I did check that out. You're limited to 500 pounds per day, so 15,000 lbs would take 30 shipments.

Current pricing is $67 for the first 100 lbs; then 57 cents for each pound over that.

So at $295 for each 500 pounds, which is regardless of mileage, it would total $8850 or thereabouts.

Boink
03-04-2018, 09:10 PM
Thanks Mark. I did check that out. You're limited to 500 pounds per day, so 15,000 lbs would take 30 shipments.
Current pricing is $67 for the first 100 lbs; then 57 cents for each pound over that.
So at $295 for each 500 pounds, which is regardless of mileage, it would total $8850 or thereabouts.

Yikes! I think it's changed since I last used them (in 2011).

Gliderman8
03-04-2018, 09:14 PM
I’ve used Greyhound years ago to ship a large box. It was very economical but probably not for the amount of books you have.

NutmegCT
03-04-2018, 09:34 PM
To add some reality to all the words, here's a view of *some* of the boxes. A prize awaits anyone who can guess what aircraft is behind them!

52767

Gliderman8
03-04-2018, 09:46 PM
My guess: B-17

NutmegCT
03-04-2018, 09:52 PM
It is a B! (but not a Fortress)

Gliderman8
03-04-2018, 09:59 PM
It is a B! (but not a Fortress)
Ok then a B-29. Is my decoder ring in the mail?

NutmegCT
03-04-2018, 10:29 PM
Fortress (17) was a tail dragger, so the tail was only up in the air when the plane was flying. Superfortress was tricycle gear - so tail was always off the ground.

And now for your Great Reward!


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iisMlRGigIE

By the way, when the Superfortress was first introduced, there were so many engine problems it was often called the SNAFUperfortress.

Gliderman8
03-04-2018, 10:51 PM
Thanks Tom I am so grateful for the handshake... words escape me :rolleye:

waltesefalcon
03-05-2018, 11:13 AM
Why not call a local shipping company? Most truckers charge per mile and at 15,000 you are far from the weight limit of a semi.

NutmegCT
03-05-2018, 05:50 PM
Thanks Walt. I do have calls in to some local (and regional) companies. They're not easy to get details from, but I'm hangin' in there. One thing for sure, they don't like email but they sure like talking (and talking) on the phone. One guy wanted to tell me the story of how he built the company, in between gulps of the sandwich he was eating, and incoming calls on his other cell. yeesh

Tom M.

Popeye
03-05-2018, 05:51 PM
Tom, if you were looking for a garage, you could (1) buy a shipping container, (2) ship the materials to/from the scanning outfit, and (3) convert the shipping container into an awesome tandem garage!

But seriously, you could buy a container, use it (have a trucking company drive it to/from), and then re-sell - I assume a used container does not depreciate much??

JPSmit
03-05-2018, 06:54 PM
Thanks Walt. I do have calls in to some local (and regional) companies. They're not easy to get details from, but I'm hangin' in there. One thing for sure, they don't like email but they sure like talking (and talking) on the phone. One guy wanted to tell me the story of how he built the company, in between gulps of the sandwich he was eating, and incoming calls on his other cell. yeesh

Tom M.

there has got to be an online bidding website - especially if time is not a big deal and you can catch an empty run back..

there is one for cars - has to be one for freight!

NutmegCT
03-05-2018, 06:56 PM
Hi JP - there's at least one. I tried it for about twenty minutes last night. Never got it working - kept saying "invalid entry", but never told which field was invalid.

https://www.uship.com/ltl-freight/

JPSmit
03-05-2018, 11:21 PM
OK, here is another thought - who are your corporate sponsors? and, more to the point is there a local mover or cartage company who would be willing to drive it out for a plaque on the wall? It is amazing to me how generous people can be - but you need to ask well (not just a phone call but a letter from the chair of the board or ???)

Or, even the local military?

TR3driver
03-24-2018, 07:33 PM
If you can get someone on the other end to help, you might want to look into terminal-to-terminal services like Forward Air offers. It's been a few years back, but I had roughly 1500 pounds shipped to LAX from IAH (by ground, not air) and the cost was under $200. My memory is fuzzy on details, but ISTR they supplied the pallet and gaylord plus banding them together for only a slight extra fee.

TR3driver
03-24-2018, 08:17 PM
Some more thoughts: 2 trips with a U-haul truck. Or two drivers and two trucks. Half of 15,000 lbs is 7500, not 7400, but I'm pretty sure no one will complain about such a small overload. If worst comes to worst, you can always add a trailer to one of the trucks.

Or, if you can find someone with a CDL (commercial drivers license), it appears that Penske can rent a truck to carry 17,000 lbs
https://www.pensketruckrental.com/commercial-truck-rental/commercial-trucks/medium-duty-trucks/22-26-foot-box-truck-CDL-required/

NutmegCT
03-25-2018, 12:50 PM
Thanks for the suggestions. We'll be choosing the materials for scanning over the next few months. Should be quite a project. I've also found several organizations (archive.org, TRAIL, AirCorpsLibrary, etc.) that do large collection image work, so when we're ready to proceed, now I've got some shipping ideas.

Thanks all.
Tom M.