new brake lines

started running new brake lines from moss on the rear axle. started bending my left rear brake line first taping it to the original so i got a good match... then... when i get to the wheel end, it is 5" too long. nto sure where i coould hid 5" and still hit the P-clips for that line. figured maybe it was just that line so i started to look at the right rear line and it also looks to be quite a bit too long.
has anyone else run in to this and what did you do?

i thought about cutting the line and putting on a new flare but Moss shows this flare like it is a special flare for british cars. So guessing that is out. not going to spend a ton on a special flaring tool.

does anyone else make a better fitting line?

Thanks

Classic Tube makes stainless steel pipe sets for most__if not all__models of Big Healeys. I've installed a couple of brake/clutch sets now, BN6/7 (100/6 with front discs & no servo) and BJ8, and both sets fit very well. Naturally, there was a little bit of fine-tuning required, and the longest runs came folded in half (large, large radius bend, easily straightened back out).

I'm not a fan of copper-alloy (or cunifer, whatever they call it) pipes, as I had a rock or other piece of road debris fly up and nearly crushed the pipe leading to the rear axle flat. I don't know how they got around it, but historically the DOT says STEEL for brake pipes; unless the regulations have been relaxed...

For the record, it's not that hard__nor expensive__to replicate ISO, or "bubble" flair'd ends...

Bubble flaring tools can be purchased relatively inexpensively if you are just doing a few, and not going into production.

any recommendation on a particular tool? i see amazon has a few of them. only planning to do this car so it is a one time job. just don't want to waste money on one that does a poor job and i end up having to buy new lines anyway.... or using my old ones.

i also see they have a 4.75mm setting where these lines are 4.76mm. close enough?

Hey Randy. I really like that pipe bender. Is it as old as Fred Flinstone or can you share a vendor name, part number or some place from where I might purchase one?
Lin

Don't think having a brake line crushed by debris is a significant risk on a Healey. As a developer of a project car, I like the ease-of-use of the cunifer tubing.

Not a factor if one is just going to install some tubing and never touch it again (most people).

The Harbor Freight flaring tool is really crude and handmade-looking - the one I bought created flares that were not perpendicular to the pipe, so they leaked. I bought the Ridgid tool on amazon and use the HF dies with it. If your HF tool grips the pipe at right angles as it should, it should create flares that don't leak.

You can easily create bubble flares with the standard tool, as Randy has demonstrated above. You don't need a special tool.

The secret with all the flares is to not tighten the tool all the way - that way the flare has a little give to it whan you compress it with the tube nut on installation.

are bubble flares and double flares the same thing? either tool will do the job here?

John Turney said:

Bubble flaring tools can be purchased relatively inexpensively if you are just doing a few, and not going into production.

Click to expand...

The one shown in my pictures was a late-night purchased cheapie from Advance Auto. Buyer beware though, as two (2) of the three (3) they had in stock were of unacceptable quality; the yoke wasn't threaded exactly perpendicular to the clamp fixture__visually obvious without opening the package__and wouldn't have made a decent flare.

Drone Dog said:

any recommendation on a particular tool? i see amazon has a few of them. only planning to do this car so it is a one time job. just don't want to waste money on one that does a poor job and i end up having to buy new lines anyway.... or using my old ones.

i also see they have a 4.75mm setting where these lines are 4.76mm. close enough?

Click to expand...

As long as the tube doesn't slip in the holding fixture, and the finished bubble goes into the female port, then yes, close enough.

See warning above, which precludes any recommendation of ordering online, sight unseen...

Lin said:

Hey Randy. I really like that pipe bender. Is it as old as Fred Flinstone or can you share a vendor name, part number or some place from where I might purchase one?
Lin

Click to expand...

Mine is left over from when I did instrumentation and control work (quit my day job in 2005 to play with cars all day) so it's not that old, perhaps dating from the 80s-90s.

This one is similar, I couldn't find one with solid handles like mine__I can see if it has a model no. on it later on, once I get in the shop: https://www.amazon.com/Imperial-Too...568&sr=8-1&keywords=1/4"+imperial+tube+bender



The "R" and "L" on the scale denote where the back of the finished (90*) bend will be, when measured from the right or left end of the tube (unless backed into a corner, I always work down the tube from the left end, hence it marked in red on my own tool).

What that piece of tube ended up looking like, once plumbed between the Hurst Line-Loc solenoid and braking system on this BMW 328i with an LS2 V8 engine swap.

Search Google for this then look at the images:
types of automotive brake line flares

There are lots of diagrams and pics of the difference between bubble and double flares.

Drone Dog said:

are bubble flares and double flares the same thing? either tool will do the job here?

Click to expand...

Nope, different tools for different results.

A double flare folds the tube in on itself, whereas the "bubble" or ISO flare is shown in my first post.

Regarding the length of brake pipes - I recently bought pre-bent S/S rear axle pipes from British Car Specialists in Stockton, CA and both the left and right were longer than the originals. I finessed the bends during installation to get it all to fit. Not quite as pretty as I would like but functional with no leaks.

nevets said:

Regarding the length of brake pipes - I recently bought pre-bent S/S rear axle pipes from British Car Specialists in Stockton, CA and both the left and right were longer than the originals...

Click to expand...

BCS is a Moss distributor, so ...

I've built all the brake pipes for my dual-circuit 4-wheel disk setup. The jag calipers and Fiat master cyl use bubble flares. All the stock Healey flares are double flares (except BJ8 booster - bubble). I did all these flares with the Ridgid 345 tool and the harbor freight button dies. The Ridgid tool will make either flare correctly if you are careful. I like the flexibility of being able to make my own pipes.

It is absolutely important that the tube be cut square; therefore you need a decent tubing cutter.

Just ran across this: Eastwood makes a remarkably inexpensive tool for 3/16" double flares. It will do steel or copper/nickel but not SS tubing. 21 5-star reviews:

These tube straightening pliers also look good:


PS - I just ordered these items and some steel tubing and will report back when I've built a new line with them.

Thanks for the tool info, Randy!
Lin

went out and really looked at my new and old lines this evening. mine do not look like bubble flares. i would say they are double flares. old line that came out of the car

new line i would be working with. but according to Moss info, this is not a standard double flare.

Thoughts?

On Moss site:

Suffice it to say that the hydraulic lines we supply all come with the “Universal Flare”, even though they are made by several different manufacturers.

Please note that this universal flare is not the same as the standard American double flare (SAE 45º) used on cars in the US.

Drone Dog said:

On Moss site:

Suffice it to say that the hydraulic lines we supply all come with the “Universal Flare”, even though they are made by several different manufacturers.

Please note that this universal flare is not the same as the standard American double flare (SAE 45º) used on cars in the US.

Click to expand...

Moss has info stating the universal flare was created to fit both the double and bubble flares.

i know i am a little slow on the uptake sometimes... so would you make a double flare or bubble flare to shorten this line and using the same fitting?
the fitting has a bevel on the front side that fits the flare.

Drone Dog said:

i know i am a little slow on the uptake sometimes... so would you make a double flare or bubble flare to shorten this line and using the same fitting?
the fitting has a bevel on the front side that fits the flare.

Click to expand...

Double flare. All the Healey flares are double flares.

PS - there are a lot of YouTube videos on making your own flares. Also see this for lots of information:
https://store.fedhillusa.com/

Thanks. i have been reading other info as well. don't think making them is a problem. just making sure i make the right one.