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View Full Version : TR2/3/3A TR3 Cylinder Head Lubrication



Eric
10-14-2003, 05:10 PM
There was a tread on the GT6 and Spitfire message board on this a while ago for the GT6 motors. The main message was that an unrestricted oil feed to the rockers could result in too much oil getting up there and starving the bearings. (ungood) There was a recommendation for a restrictor, although I don't remember the details.

I assume you have got your valve clearances set correctly? When setting them, its worthwhile to press the rocker back into the pushrod, to squeeze out any oil that may be puddled in the top of the pushrod. Otherwise you end up with an inaccurate valve clearance setting and noisy rockers. Plus, these engines are just 'tappety', although once warmed up they shouldn't be too noisy.

My tractor (same basic motor as the TR3)isn't tappety - the exhaust is too loud to hear the valves. Maybe you just need to ditch your muffler! images/icons/grin.gif

Mickey Richaud
10-14-2003, 05:17 PM
Eric -

Thanks for the input. Yes, clearances are OK, though I didn't "squeeze" oil out. I have adjusted them several times, and assume they're within specs. I've even replaced pushrods, thinking the caps on them were making noises. May just have to ditch the muffler - this one is pretty loud!

piman
10-14-2003, 06:08 PM
Hello Mickey,

as far as the oil line goes, I have one on my (6 cylinder) Triumph and it was easily fitted, a pick up from a blanked off oil gallery drilling and conection to a blanked off drilling at the rear of the cylinder head. I don't find that I am starving the bearings of oil as I can maintain a healthy oil pressure.
What is worth checking is that all the oil ways in the rockers are clear. The valve gear shouldn't be noisy and to me should not be ignored. I would take off the rocker cover and run the engine and make sure that oil is flowing from every rocker. If some rockers are starved, remove, strip and clean the rocker assembly. The point is that if there is some blockage an extra oil feed will not help. If all seems well from an oil supply point of view, try using a feeler gauge between the rocker arm and the valves while the engine is running to see if there is a rocker or rockers that are quietened by this. It could be that the rocker arm tip(s) are worn thus giving a false setting to the clearances.

Alec graemlins/cheers.gif

Mickey Richaud
10-14-2003, 06:18 PM
Alec -

Thank you. That's very helpful.

I've been chasing this down for some time now, with no luck. Will check the passages and try the feeler gauge.

What bothers me most is that no one but me seems to think it is a problem. But when driving, I can hear the valve noise over the exhaust, especially when the top - excuse me, hood! - is up.

Thanks again! graemlins/cheers.gif

10-14-2003, 07:53 PM
My two cents worth:
I installed the auxillary oil feed line from a "Tee" behind the oil pressure switch, came as a kit. My roller rockers are totally bathed in oil, which should be a good thing. Oil pressure is good, even with external oil cooler. Looked at a friend's rocker setup on a newly purchased '76 TR6, to help him set his valves, and noticed his rocker assembly in the area of #1 and #2 were BONE DRY. And all his galleys were clear. Not good. An aside on the oil cooler, another friend had an oil cooler on his TR6, mounted on the skid plate as recommended, and had it crack from the vibration. Almost burned his engine. I found a bracket assembly to hold my cooler from Earl's speed shop on the net, modified it very slightly, and now you can lift my car with the extremely stout setup I have to hold the oil radiator down to the skid plate. Little pearl.

Bill

Mickey Richaud
10-15-2003, 03:28 AM
Has anyone had any experience with adding the external oil line to the head on these cars? The valve train in mine is extremely noisy, and though I've been told that it's harmless, it sure is aggravating to hear all that clacking over the wonderful exhaust note.

I see that Moss and others sell a line that goes from the "oil gallery" to the head, and that it is an "easy installation." Where, exactly, does it hook up, how "easy" is the installation, and will it help quiet some of the racket? Is it worth the trouble?

Thanks.

Mickey Richaud
10-15-2003, 08:43 AM
Thanks, Dr. Bill -

Checked out the rockers and arm last night - they seem pretty wet, and there's oil pooled on top of the valve keepers, so not sure it's an oil delivery problem.

Before I pull the rockers, what shape should the tips be? If I remember the last time I checked them, they didn't look like they had any serious flat spots on them.

Also, what about the springs between the rockers? Anybody have any experience with using spacers instead of springs? Or is that really an issue? As long as I'm in there, I might as well address anything that is necessary.

By the way, "Geaux Tigers!"

[ 10-15-2003: Message edited by: Mickey Richaud ]</p>

piman
10-15-2003, 09:30 AM
Hello Mickey,
that sounds good so far, and wear on the tips is evident as an indentation, which is why it is not possible to set the clearances accurately using feeler gauges when this occurs. Sleeves instead of springs are what racers use, but I don't think it is useful for a road car. Even for a race car I'm sure the effect is very minimal. (reduced friction)
So back to the problem, are the rockers slack on the rocker shaft?, you may need to dismantle the rocker assembly to accurately assess what wear is present. The other thought I have is that it is not valve train noise but something else as it would have to be unacceptably bad to hear over your exhaust.

good luck,

Alec graemlins/cheers.gif

[ 10-15-2003: Message edited by: piman ]</p>

Mickey Richaud
10-15-2003, 06:38 PM
Well, gosh and gee whiz, do I have egg on my face or what? Just reset the valves and it quieted significantly. All the intakes were set around .013 or .014; exhaust valves were pretty close to .012. The last time I set them, I used the technique in the reprinted shop manual. If you've never read this wonderful work, you should. For example, can anyone tell me what "point of rock" is with regard to engine rotation? Why didn't they write that thing in English? images/icons/wink.gif (Just kidding, Alec!) I went with TDC on each cylinder this time, and it seemed to make the difference needed.

Anyway, there's still a little noise, but I can sure live with it. Thanks for all the input. Think I'll forego the cylinder head oil line, as there seems to be plenty of oil splashing around in there.

[ 10-15-2003: Message edited by: Mickey Richaud ]</p>

Mark Beiser
10-16-2003, 03:33 AM
I think the external oil feed lines are only usefull/desirable if you plan on running the engine at high RPM for extended periods, like racing...

SoCal
10-16-2003, 08:24 AM
Mickey,
I think the point of rock or point of balance is when one valve has just closed and the other is just begining to open (same cylinder of course). That reference is used to set cam timing.
An easy way to adjust the valves on the 4 cylinder is to use the "RULE OF NINE". It's an easy way know what valve to adjust when and it also cuts down on how many times you have too turn the crankshaft around. Turn the crank until a valve is fully open. Let's say it's valve number 2 (counting from the front), using this rule, valve number 7 can be adjusted. The two valves just have to add up to 9. Valve 1 open adjust 8, 2 adj 7, 3 adj 6 and so on. It's easy to remember and cuts down on the crank spinning.
Steve

clint
10-20-2003, 01:48 PM
I put the extra line on my tr3. very easy to do. Put the spacers instead of springs in as well, valvetrain is quiet. Problem I had was oil fouling the plugs as long traffic lights, had to keep the engine revs up. I had a NOS add on lucas ignition amplifier that only uses the points as a breaker, not the full voltage, came with a module and another coil, said to open plug gap up to .045. Car runs great and can idle all day with no fouling, so you may need to make sure the guides are perfect(head work) or put a "hot" ignition on the car.